I’m scared to fire McDermott.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

The best idea is if the offense doesn’t improve the rest of season you go hire the best OC available that fits the modern game. We hope that guy one day will be McDermott’s replacement if McDermott doesn’t get to a Super Bowl.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Then dont ever do anything. Because every decision has a chance to go wrong. Better to just play not to lose on this one.

 

not saying that at all

 

But let's throw a hypothetical out there. Pegula gets it and fires McDermott and/or Beane.

 

Hires a coach who turns out to be just as bad or worse. Do you believe he's going to fire the new guy after a season or two? It may not be a popular question, but it's a question that should be asked.

 

[DrDawkinstein]

1 minute ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

The best idea is if the offense doesn’t improve the rest of season you go hire the best OC available that fits the modern game. We hope that guy one day will be McDermott’s replacement if McDermott doesn’t get to a Super Bowl.

 

I'm not against the idea of hiring an OC with the plan he replaces McD as HC.

 

But if you are going to do that, then just cut bait and fire McD now. Otherwise, you are breeding paranoia and dishonesty in the organization. Very much like the Browns with Gregg Williams and Todd Haley gunning for Hue's job instead of doing their own job.

Just now, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

not saying that at all

 

But let's throw a hypothetical out there. Pegula gets it and fires McDermott and/or Beane.

 

Hires a coach who turns out to be just as bad or worse. Do you believe he's going to fire the new guy after a season or two? It may not be a popular question, but it's a question that should be asked.

 

 

Does it matter when we have no future under McD?

 

The entire motivation of the move is knowing we've hit McD's ceiling. So better to try ANYTHING else, than nothing.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

2 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

You dont even know what you said? Because here it is:

 

 

Nothing about which coaches built a winning franchise, or developing QBs, or any of that extra stuff you are adding on.

 

You asked which Franchise QBs had coaches fired, and what was their future.

 

Tua, Cousins, and Hurts all say hi.

 

And those are all recent, relevant examples. 2 of which were firing highly regarded Defensive coaches for hot shot OCs.

 

 

 

Then dont ever do anything. Because every decision has a chance to go wrong. Better to just play not to lose on this one.

 

 

Tua, Cousins, and Hurts? What are we even doing here? Kirk Cousins!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Hurts and Tua weren’t even considered the future of their respective teams when their coaches were fired. 
 

And if you’re answering Kirk Cousins then you should rethink your position.

[DrDawkinstein]

Just now, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Tua, Cousins, and Hurts? What are we even doing here? Kirk Cousins!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Hurts and Tua weren’t even considered the future of their respective teams when their coaches were fired. 
 

And if you’re answering Kirk Cousins then you should rethink your position.

 

Right, and now they are thanks to the coaching change you are arguing against.

 

(And Hurts was by the owner and GM, hence Pederson's firing)

[The Jokeman]

My question for those that want to fire McDermott, who are you replacing him with? New doesn't always mean better. I've heard many mention Ben Johnson, well guess what the Lions have scored less points then we have this season. Not sure it's all on him but it's worth pointing out. 40 points less. Then my next question who do you replace at DC? 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Does it matter when we have no future under McD?

 

The entire motivation of the move is knowing we've hit McD's ceiling. So better to try ANYTHING else, than nothing.

 

OK fine, it's obvious you're too emotional to even consider that Terry Pegula, who's a KNOWN coach-hire bungler across two organizations might ***** the duck in the process and stick a fork in an outlet.

 

But don't for one moment pretend it can't get worse. It can.

 

I'm for moving on, by the way, but I'm not going to sit here and pretend it'll be rose petals and champagne.

 

[VaMilBill]

1 minute ago, The Jokeman said:

My question for those that want to fire McDermott, who are you replacing him with? New doesn't always mean better. I've heard many mention Ben Johnson, well guess what the Lions have scored less points then we have this season. Not sure it's all on him but it's worth pointing out. 40 points less. Then my next question who do you replace at DC? 

So you’re ok with the status quo which is a downward trajectory? Four the last three years?

 

yeah sometimes new isn’t better, but at least we should try to improve. Just sticking with what we have has proven we aren’t improving. 

[Captain_Quint]

8 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

None of this even fits what I said. McDermott built a winning franchise. He helped develop a franchise QB. Hurts and Tua were on losing teams and not developed yet.

 

The QBs you need to look at are Mathew Stafford in Detroit, Philip Rivers in San Diego, and Aaron Rodgers in Green Bay. Rodgers is probably the best example but they never made it to the Super Bowl with LeFluer.

John Elway won a Super Bowl going from Fox to Kubiak but that was a promotion from within which no one wants.

These are good points, but the Bills need to take the sentiment out of the decision.

We're going on 60+ years of being losers and not winning a Super Bowl. I think you need to throw everything we can at it for the next 5 years until the formula is right. 

 

McD just doesn't seem to have the right stuff going forward. It wouldn't surprise me if his next stint goes similar to this one, and he's still chasing a championship down the road as a DC again. 

[Freddie's Dead]

McDummy needs to be gone.  If it takes missing the playoffs to do that, then I'm for it, because this team is going nowhere as long as this idiot remains in charge.  His in-game decisions against the Bengals were so bad that I would have fired him when the clock hit :00 at the end of the 4th QTR.  He should have been fired for 13 seconds.  Sacking him at this point would simply be correcting that mistake.

Edited November 7, 2023 by Freddie's Dead

[The Jokeman]

Just now, VaMilBill said:

So you’re ok with the status quo which is a downward trajectory? Four the last three years?

 

yeah sometimes new isn’t better, but at least we should try to improve. Just sticking with what we have has proven we aren’t improving. 

The offense has struggled this season no doubt but I don't blame it all on Dorsey. IDK Josh just seems to me like he's not the same, lack of energy and/or just not getting good presnap reads that used to etc. I just don't want to fire McD and just go with an OC because again that could hurt our defense which currently the best part of the team. 

[Success]

The season will dictate how things go (I'm stating the obvious, I know).

 

I don't see how they can retain him if we actually miss the playoffs.  That would kind of shock me - and be a little depressing.

 

I don't think we miss the playoffs, though. Then, it's more iffy. I think a 1st round exit would still leave things very much in doubt for his future here.  But any kind of run, and he'll be back.

 

 

 

[DrDawkinstein]

9 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

OK fine, it's obvious you're too emotional to even consider that Terry Pegula, who's a KNOWN coach-hire bungler across two organizations might ***** the duck in the process and stick a fork in an outlet.

 

But don't for one moment pretend it can't get worse. It can.

 

I'm for moving on, by the way, but I'm not going to sit here and pretend it'll be rose petals and champagne.

 

 

I'm not saying that at all. I have made no guarantees that it will get better. I even said as much in that post you just quoted.

 

No one is pretending it cant get worse. No one has asked you to pretend it will be all rose petals. You made both of those up. So maybe look at who is really being too emotional and scared...

 

I said this earlier in the thread if people bothered to read instead of just react:

 

I dont necessarily trust Pegula to make the decision, but I trust that he is more likely to rely on outside help and advice when it comes to NFL hires than he is on NHL hires.

 

He thinks he's a "hockey guy", and makes a lot of those decisions himself.

 

For the Bills, he hired an outside consulting firm who helped find McDermott. Who most of us didnt even have on our coaching radar at the time.

 

No reason to think the firm and Beane couldnt find a decent replacement. Even with Terry in the mix.

 

And before you get worked up, I'm not guaranteeing that

 

 

Edited November 7, 2023 by DrDawkinstein

[Buffalo_Stampede]

1 minute ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Right, and now they are thanks to the coaching change you are arguing against.

 

(And Hurts was by the owner and GM, hence Pederson's firing)

Matt Ryan is another one and he actually did make a Super Bowl after a coaching change. Should’ve won.

 

 

 

[GoBills808]

13 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

 

John Elway won a Super Bowl going from Fox to Kubiak but that was a promotion from within which no one wants.

Pretty sure this is completely wrong

[VaMilBill]

1 minute ago, The Jokeman said:

The offense has struggled this season no doubt but I don't blame it all on Dorsey. IDK Josh just seems to me like he's not the same, lack of energy and/or just not getting good presnap reads that used to etc. I just don't want to fire McD and just go with an OC because again that could hurt our defense which currently the best part of the team. 

That’s fair. I feel the same way mostly, with the exception id rather take the risk and try to win a SB. I think it’s become pretty clear at this point McD won’t get us a SB win

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

I'm not saying that at all. I have made no guarantees that it will get better. I even said as much in that post you just quoted.

 

No one is pretending it cant get worse. No one has asked you to pretend it will be all rose petals. You made both of those up. So maybe look at who is really being too emotional and scared...

 

I said this earlier in the thread if people bothered to read instead of just react:

 

I dont necessarily trust Pegula to make the decision, but I trust that he is more likely to rely on outside help and advice when it comes to NFL hires than he is on NHL hires.

 

He thinks he's a "hickey guy", and makes a lot of those decisions himself.

 

For the Bills, he hired an outside consulting firm who helped find McDermott. Who most of us didnt even have on our coaching radar at the time.

 

No reason to think the firm and Beane couldnt find a decent replacement. Even with Terry in the mix.

 

And before you get worked up, I'm not guaranteeing that

Honestly, I think Beane should go before McDermott based on the Von Miller addition alone.

 

I'm OK with both of them going, so long as Pegula hires a GM FIRST and allows HIM to make the decision.

 

My number one prime concern with this whole thing is that we end up with Rex/Rob Ryan part deux. Sorry, just don't want ANY part of that clown shoes

 

Edited November 7, 2023 by Pine Barrens Mafia

[DrDawkinstein]

Just now, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Matt Ryan is another one and he actually did make a Super Bowl after a coaching change. Should’ve won.

 

 

 

 

AND the Falcons should have let Quinn walk and promoted Shanny, much like the Bills should have done with McD/Dabol after 13seconds.

 

But that is a huge and difficult move I dont expect owners to make.

[Shemp]

Allen shouldn't be in the HOF. 

[DrDawkinstein]

2 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Pretty sure this is completely wrong

 

Yeah, it was Shanahan for Elway.