The Good, The Bad, The Ugly TNF Bucs edition

[Chaos]

The Good

 

1. The Bills won
2. The team played the beginning of the game as if they were well prepared. They were one odd third down offensive play call away from a perfect start on both sides of the ball. Hopefully this starts a trend
3. Josh Allen was masterful spreading the ball around
4. Shakir, Davis, and Kindcaid all had great games. 
5. Diggs was clutch when he needed to be
6. Benard may never be Dick Butkus, but at his current level of play MLB is not something the Bills need to worry about
7. Solid first three quarters from the defense. 
8. The good outweighed the Bad and the Ugly last night. 

 

The Bad

 

1. Crucial play calls being botched with the same mistakes from past games, particulary being in shotgun on third down at the 8 inch line.  Bills do not have the luxury of leaving points on the board.  
    

The Ugly

 

1. The Bills have a choking problem.  In the past I have said the Bills do not seem to be closers.  But the problem maybe more severe than that. This season, the Bills special teams allowed the first punt return for a TD in an overtime in a number of years.  This is an example of choking. The Bills blew a lead with a less than two minutes left and the Patriots (NFL's worst statistical offense) 75 yards from the end zone. And in one failed to defend screen pass, allowed the Patriots back into the game, and then a horrible effort to actual lose the game. Another choke and a loss.  The game against the Giants was arguably saved on the last play of the game by the a crucial non-call by the refs. But it was a choke for the Giants to even be in that position at that point. And last nights game saw Mike Godwin outchoke the Bills by not seeing/catching the ball on the hail mary.  
   
   Some fans want to pretend these types of blown leads and blown lead situations are typical of NFL close games.  I do not think they are, particularly from teams aspiring to a championship.  Chiefs, Niners, Eagles, all lose games, but I don't think they put themselves in positions to lose the games on the last play in 50% of their games. And then actually lose half of those game.   It is so frustrating.  On the one hand the team seems good enough that it should be 7-1 and in a dominating postion in the AFC East.  But due to this choking issue is 5-3 and in second place.  And two last plays of games away from being 3-5
   
    

Edited October 27, 2023 by Chaos

[Drew21PA]

7 minutes ago, Chaos said:

The Good

 

1. The Bills won
2. The team played the beginning of the game as if they were well prepared. They were one odd third down offensive play call away from a perfect start on both sides of the ball. Hopefully this starts a trend
3. Josh Allen was masterful spreading the ball around
4. Shakir, Davis, and Kindcaid all had great games. 
5. Diggs was clutch when he needed to be
6. Benard may never be Dick Butkus, but at his current level of play MLB is not something the Bills need to worry about
7. Solid first three quarters from the defense. 
8. The good outweighed the Bad and the Ugly last night. 

 

The Bad

 

1. Crucial play calls being botched with the same mistakes from past games, particulary being in shotgun on third down at the 8 inch line.  Bills do not have the luxury of leaving points on the board.  
    

The Ugly

 

1. The Bills have a choking problem.  In the past I have said the Bills do not seem to be closers.  But the problem maybe more severe than that. This season, the Bills special teams allowed the first punt return for a TD in an overtime in a number of years.  This is an example of choking. The Bills blew a lead with a less than two minutes left and the Patriots (NFL's worst statistical offense) 75 yards from the end zone. And in one failed to defend screen pass, allowed the Patriots back into the game, and then a horrible effort to actual lose the game. Another choke and a loss.  The game against the Giants was arguably saved on the last play of the game by the a crucial non-call by the refs. But it was a choke for the Giants to even be in that position at that point. And last nights game saw Mike Godwin outchoke the Bills by not seeing/catching the ball on the hail mary.  
   
   Some fans want to pretend these types of blown leads and blown lead situations are typical of NFL close games.  I do not think they are, particularly from teams aspiring to a championship.  Chiefs, Niners, Eagles, all lose games, but I don't think they put themselves in positions to lose the games on the last play in 50% of their games. And then actually lose half of those game.   It is so frustrating.  On the one hand the team seems good enough that it should be 7-1 and in a dominating postion in the AFC East.  But due to this choking issue is 5-3 and in second place.  And two last plays of games away from being 3-5
   
    

Agree 

 

McDermott continues to make head scratching decisions - timeouts not being used right I hope someone steps in to help him or something what in the world

 

vosching decision to go conservative instead of the kill shot end game - my opinion they let them hang around instead of pushing for 31-10

 

srupid penalties on defense - yes they are back ups stepping up but dang 2 4th downs - well three with the TD to Evan’s - and you can’t get off the field is inexcusable and “choker” mentality for sure 

 

now that last part can be coached and fixed but 

 

sadly maybe I can’t because it involved coaching

 

McDermott REALLY needs to improve becuase slot of the short comings are coming from the top and that isn’t good 

[Dr Divit]

I agree.  After 7 years, McD hasn’t grown into the job.    13 sec will always be in his DNA

[Since1981]

39 minutes ago, Chaos said:

shotgun on third down at the 8 inch line

—-First try and the Tush Push from under center is unstoppable at 8 inch line. 
—-fake 4th down stuff is maddening—any bluff has to have real sprinkled in

—punts at midfield when O is hot 

 

McDummy is not going to win us trophies 

[PatsFanNH]

38 minutes ago, Chaos said:

The Good

 

1. The Bills won
2. The team played the beginning of the game as if they were well prepared. They were one odd third down offensive play call away from a perfect start on both sides of the ball. Hopefully this starts a trend
3. Josh Allen was masterful spreading the ball around
4. Shakir, Davis, and Kindcaid all had great games. 
5. Diggs was clutch when he needed to be
6. Benard may never be Dick Butkus, but at his current level of play MLB is not something the Bills need to worry about
7. Solid first three quarters from the defense. 
8. The good outweighed the Bad and the Ugly last night. 

 

The Bad

 

1. Crucial play calls being botched with the same mistakes from past games, particulary being in shotgun on third down at the 8 inch line.  Bills do not have the luxury of leaving points on the board.  
    

The Ugly

 

1. The Bills have a choking problem.  In the past I have said the Bills do not seem to be closers.  But the problem maybe more severe than that. This season, the Bills special teams allowed the first punt return for a TD in an overtime in a number of years.  This is an example of choking. The Bills blew a lead with a less than two minutes left and the Patriots (NFL's worst statistical offense) 75 yards from the end zone. And in one failed to defend screen pass, allowed the Patriots back into the game, and then a horrible effort to actual lose the game. Another choke and a loss.  The game against the Giants was arguably saved on the last play of the game by the a crucial non-call by the refs. But it was a choke for the Giants to even be in that position at that point. And last nights game saw Mike Godwin outchoke the Bills by not seeing/catching the ball on the hail mary.  
   
   Some fans want to pretend these types of blown leads and blown lead situations are typical of NFL close games.  I do not think they are, particularly from teams aspiring to a championship.  Chiefs, Niners, Eagles, all lose games, but I don't think they put themselves in positions to lose the games on the last play in 50% of their games. And then actually lose half of those game.   It is so frustrating.  On the one hand the team seems good enough that it should be 7-1 and in a dominating postion in the AFC East.  But due to this choking issue is 5-3 and in second place.  And two last plays of games away from being 3-5
   
    

Can I just add the last 3 games the Bills should have been 3-0 and easy wins. They went 2-1 and it looked hard.  As you pointed out they could easily be 0-3.

 

Are you worried about the team when they get to the tough part of your schedule in Philly,Dallas,KC, and even Chargers? 

[Freddie's Dead]

The ugly

 

Getting cute on the half inch line by lining up in shotgun and running Murray for a loss instead of just butt shoving it into the EZ. 

 

Jordan Phillips being an absolute ***** idiot. If we didn't need DTs, I'd bench him or cut him RIGHT ***** NOW!!  And then hang up. 

Edited October 27, 2023 by Freddie's Dead

[Nuncha]

Ugly - Tampa converted THREE 4th downs during their last TD drive, two by penalty.  That was infuriating.  Then the offense gets the ball back and can't seal the deal.

Edited October 27, 2023 by Nuncha

[zow2]

It was great to see Shakir get some action, a lot of us have been wondering why they rarely targeted him.  He's good, and he showed it.   Gabe showing up was great as well and of course Kincaid.  Diggs is still the main man of course, but when Allen tries to force it to Diggs on 3rd and medium lately it's not working out as well.  Fortunately late in the game they hit on a critical 3rd down play to keep the clock moving.  

 

As mentioned, not slamming it in for a TD and going shotgun was awful.  Allowing TB to convert all those 4th downs late and the stupid penalties.  And the leaving the door open for an opponent to steal a win on the last play is maddening.  The coverage on the hail mary was the worst I've ever seen from an NFL team.  If Godwin turns around half second sooner, its over.  Ball game.  Even ESPN had a breakdown this morning on how that pass was almost completed and the incompetence of the Bills.

[VaMilBill]

11 minutes ago, zow2 said:

It was great to see Shakir get some action, a lot of us have been wondering why they rarely targeted him.  He's good, and he showed it.   Gabe showing up was great as well and of course Kincaid.  Diggs is still the main man of course, but when Allen tries to force it to Diggs on 3rd and medium lately it's not working out as well.  Fortunately late in the game they hit on a critical 3rd down play to keep the clock moving.  

 

As mentioned, not slamming it in for a TD and going shotgun was awful.  Allowing TB to convert all those 4th downs late and the stupid penalties.  And the leaving the door open for an opponent to steal a win on the last play is maddening.  The coverage on the hail mary was the worst I've ever seen from an NFL team.  If Godwin turns around half second sooner, its over.  Ball game.  Even ESPN had a breakdown this morning on how that pass was almost completed and the incompetence of the Bills.

Josh kinda admitted in the post game interview that he likes to throw to Diggs because he is open a lot. True. But if you do that, you are wasting potential better opportunities on the field. Josh needs to continue to spread the ball around to everyone. I’d like to see Kinkaid get even more targets as well as Shakir 

[DD4Bills]

One Ugly that I haven't seen mentioned is the bonehead attempt to run a quick play with time running out of the 3rd quarter.

 

Bills had driven from their own 17 to the Bucs 39 and were moving well. Absolutely no reason to try to catch the Bucs off guard and sneak one play in with time expiring in the 3rd. Taking a 10 yard sack in that situation is inexcusable. Running a play in that situation is inexcusable. From that point on, they gained less than 60 yards and punted THREE TIMES from the Bucs side of the field. If they let time expire, go to the 4th, and take the time to setup a real play, I am convinced that they keep driving for points and this game is over.

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

I really want to know if there’s some reason we don’t sneak that much…I can see a shotgun run vs an under center run from the goal line but there’s just no good reason not to attempt a sneak there so calling a shotgun run is ridiculous 

 

I think the choking bit is getting a little overblown in this one…it seemed like TB was content running the clock out on themselves and there’s no way they were gonna get any closer than a 1/1000 Hail Mary attempt if we played pretty conservative and pinned them deep in the second half multiple times.  It wasn’t fun to watch but it was effective. 
 

that punt return in the jets game was absolute bollocks…there was a blatant trip on the 25 yard line but apparently only we commit special teams penalties 😂. That was the difference in this game for me and why it ended up pretty close when it shouldn’t have.we were absolutely dominating the field position game and just completely throwing it away on stupid ST penalties in the second half.  Probably cost ourselves 80 yards of field position.  We would’ve added on two more fgs at minimum despite trying to control the clock if we cleaned that up 

Edited October 27, 2023 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[FireChans]

1 hour ago, Chaos said:

The Good

 

1. The Bills won
2. The team played the beginning of the game as if they were well prepared. They were one odd third down offensive play call away from a perfect start on both sides of the ball. Hopefully this starts a trend
3. Josh Allen was masterful spreading the ball around
4. Shakir, Davis, and Kindcaid all had great games. 
5. Diggs was clutch when he needed to be
6. Benard may never be Dick Butkus, but at his current level of play MLB is not something the Bills need to worry about
7. Solid first three quarters from the defense. 
8. The good outweighed the Bad and the Ugly last night. 

 

The Bad

 

1. Crucial play calls being botched with the same mistakes from past games, particulary being in shotgun on third down at the 8 inch line.  Bills do not have the luxury of leaving points on the board.  
    

The Ugly

 

1. The Bills have a choking problem.  In the past I have said the Bills do not seem to be closers.  But the problem maybe more severe than that. This season, the Bills special teams allowed the first punt return for a TD in an overtime in a number of years.  This is an example of choking. The Bills blew a lead with a less than two minutes left and the Patriots (NFL's worst statistical offense) 75 yards from the end zone. And in one failed to defend screen pass, allowed the Patriots back into the game, and then a horrible effort to actual lose the game. Another choke and a loss.  The game against the Giants was arguably saved on the last play of the game by the a crucial non-call by the refs. But it was a choke for the Giants to even be in that position at that point. And last nights game saw Mike Godwin outchoke the Bills by not seeing/catching the ball on the hail mary.  
   
   Some fans want to pretend these types of blown leads and blown lead situations are typical of NFL close games.  I do not think they are, particularly from teams aspiring to a championship.  Chiefs, Niners, Eagles, all lose games, but I don't think they put themselves in positions to lose the games on the last play in 50% of their games. And then actually lose half of those game.   It is so frustrating.  On the one hand the team seems good enough that it should be 7-1 and in a dominating postion in the AFC East.  But due to this choking issue is 5-3 and in second place.  And two last plays of games away from being 3-5
   
    

There’s a large correlation between a lack of stars on defense and our inability to close out games on defense.

 

It’s not that we are chokers. It’s that our defense is full of average NFL talent.

[gordong]

when you punt three time inside the other teams 50 on third and short there is an problem. I guess one of those was a 4th down, but still.

. 

Edited October 27, 2023 by gordong

[Big Turk]

I really, really like what I see from Shakir when he gets the ball in his hands.  Like A LOT.  Dude is super shifty and has moves like an RB.  I hope this is the start of him being more and more involved...he also gets open A LOT. Especially against man coverage.

Edited October 27, 2023 by Big Turk

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

12 minutes ago, DD4Bills said:

One Ugly that I haven't seen mentioned is the bonehead attempt to run a quick play with time running out of the 3rd quarter.

 

Bills had driven from their own 17 to the Bucs 39 and were moving well. Absolutely no reason to try to catch the Bucs off guard and sneak one play in with time expiring in the 3rd. Taking a 10 yard sack in that situation is inexcusable. Running a play in that situation is inexcusable. From that point on, they gained less than 60 yards and punted THREE TIMES from the Bucs side of the field. If they let time expire, go to the 4th, and take the time to setup a real play, I am convinced that they keep driving for points and this game is over.

Something went really wrong there haha I can’t argue with this criticism at all.  The punts I’ll defend but snapping the ball there was a mess.  I think morse thought he caught someone Offside and snapped it and josh wasn’t really ready for it but that’s just a guess 

[Bermuda Triangle]

2 hours ago, Chaos said:

The Good

 

1. The Bills won
2. The team played the beginning of the game as if they were well prepared. They were one odd third down offensive play call away from a perfect start on both sides of the ball. Hopefully this starts a trend
3. Josh Allen was masterful spreading the ball around
4. Shakir, Davis, and Kindcaid all had great games. 
5. Diggs was clutch when he needed to be
6. Benard may never be Dick Butkus, but at his current level of play MLB is not something the Bills need to worry about
7. Solid first three quarters from the defense. 
8. The good outweighed the Bad and the Ugly last night. 

 

The Bad

 

1. Crucial play calls being botched with the same mistakes from past games, particulary being in shotgun on third down at the 8 inch line.  Bills do not have the luxury of leaving points on the board.  
    

The Ugly

 

1. The Bills have a choking problem.  In the past I have said the Bills do not seem to be closers.  But the problem maybe more severe than that. This season, the Bills special teams allowed the first punt return for a TD in an overtime in a number of years.  This is an example of choking. The Bills blew a lead with a less than two minutes left and the Patriots (NFL's worst statistical offense) 75 yards from the end zone. And in one failed to defend screen pass, allowed the Patriots back into the game, and then a horrible effort to actual lose the game. Another choke and a loss.  The game against the Giants was arguably saved on the last play of the game by the a crucial non-call by the refs. But it was a choke for the Giants to even be in that position at that point. And last nights game saw Mike Godwin outchoke the Bills by not seeing/catching the ball on the hail mary.  
   
   Some fans want to pretend these types of blown leads and blown lead situations are typical of NFL close games.  I do not think they are, particularly from teams aspiring to a championship.  Chiefs, Niners, Eagles, all lose games, but I don't think they put themselves in positions to lose the games on the last play in 50% of their games. And then actually lose half of those game.   It is so frustrating.  On the one hand the team seems good enough that it should be 7-1 and in a dominating postion in the AFC East.  But due to this choking issue is 5-3 and in second place.  And two last plays of games away from being 3-5
   
    

Good post.  Unfortunately, I don't think you will get a substantive response as to why the team seems to make the same mistakes (or types of mistakes) repeatedly - the responses will be along the lines of "every team wins close games", "this is the NFL" and "look at the point differential".

[zow2]

10 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

I really, really like what I see from Shakir when he gets the ball in his hands.  Like A LOT.  Dude is super shifty and has moves like an RB.  I hope this is the start of him being more and more involved...he also gets open A LOT. Especially against man coverage.

 

I'd like to know if Shakir was a better option on stalled 3rd downs around midfield, during 3rd Qtr and early 4th when they passed to Diggs. 

[Big Turk]

30 minutes ago, DD4Bills said:

One Ugly that I haven't seen mentioned is the bonehead attempt to run a quick play with time running out of the 3rd quarter.

 

Bills had driven from their own 17 to the Bucs 39 and were moving well. Absolutely no reason to try to catch the Bucs off guard and sneak one play in with time expiring in the 3rd. Taking a 10 yard sack in that situation is inexcusable. Running a play in that situation is inexcusable. From that point on, they gained less than 60 yards and punted THREE TIMES from the Bucs side of the field. If they let time expire, go to the 4th, and take the time to setup a real play, I am convinced that they keep driving for points and this game is over.

 

They REALLY LOVE the attempt to get free plays and draw teams Offside a little TOO much...that was the reason for it and Allen was thinking he was Offside and was pointing to it while getting up after being sacked.  

 

Just run the clock out on the quarter and start fresh in Quarter 4. Basically caused a punt from that play since we weren't able to make up all the yards he lost on the sack.

[Buffalo Junction]

32 minutes ago, FireChans said:

There’s a large correlation between a lack of stars on defense and our inability to close out games on defense.

 

It’s not that we are chokers. It’s that our defense is full of average NFL talent.

Particularly when those injured players happen to be the guys who seal wins with splash plays. 

[FireChans]

8 minutes ago, Buffalo Junction said:

Particularly when those injured players happen to be the guys who seal wins with splash plays. 

Milano, Jones, Tre, Von are 4/5 of our highest paid defenders by cap hit this year. Von is trying to return coming off major injury and the rest of them have season ending injuries.

 

It's no surprise lol.