Devils advocate...what is Josh is the problem?

[Hebert19]

 

When you look at all 22 he is missing open guys all over and seems to be keying in on one guy in the route the entire time.  

 

The turnovers at the end of last year amd jets game were bad.  Like he didn't see the defenders.  

 

What are chances he's locking in on one guy because he isn't trusting what he's seeing now.   

 

 

[ngbills]

Not allowed. Its someone else fault entirely. Josh can do no wrong. 

[Dick_Cheney]

If I had to guess, I'd say it's an identity crisis and loss of confidence in coaches as well as the majority of the offense.

 

It's clear at this point that Josh's big play ability is being held back, and he's not the one choosing to do so. For whatever reason, he has decided not to rebel against whatever Dorsey and likely also McD have been trying to instill in him to be a more stereotypical pocket passer and to essentially neutralize the wild and explosive aspect of his running ability and his hero ball play. Yes, this actually has to some degree cut down on the mistakes that would come with that sort of play, but at this point it seems like a wash in that regard, all the while we no longer have any of the upside and the positives of Josh's usual style of play.

 

So we've absorbed all the negative aspects of changing his game, but haven't reaped any of the benefts. If the offense and the line were totally stacked then sure, we'd be a machine on offense. Instead we are predictable and teams no longer have to spy Josh, and honestly I don't think they fear him or go into each play anymore thinking "Oh *****, he might pull off something insane here." He's been neutered and they know it.

 

As for confidence in the rest of the offense, it's pretty bleak. Knox is anti-clutch. Diggs can't get the ball every time. We have no true #2 receiver. It was very encouraging having such a great game with Kincaid and I hope that mentally that gives Josh the confidence to basically turn him into the #2, but still. Having two guys on your offense that you actually trust isn't enough and that is painfully obvious.

 

Josh will always make some mistakes, but I cannot blame him too much at the moment considering what he's been told to do and the cast of characters he is having to do it with.

Edited October 23, 2023 by Dick_Cheney

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

I think it was very windy out there

[Big Turk]

12 minutes ago, Hebert19 said:

 

When you look at all 22 he is missing open guys all over and seems to be keying in on one guy in the route the entire time.  

 

The turnovers at the end of last year amd jets game were bad.  Like he didn't see the defenders.  

 

What are chances he's locking in on one guy because he isn't trusting what he's seeing now.   

 

 

 

Your username points to the problem.  He is trying to play like Herbert and extend plays outside the pocket to throw downfield instead of taking off running when the opportunities are there. Herbert runs only as a last resort.  Last year Allen ran 70 more times than Herbert did.  This year they are equal. That's a major problem, IMO. Both for him and for the offense in general.

 

It's causing defenders to not respect that part of his game anymore and simply drop back to cover which means he has a bunch of green grass to run but instead tries to throw into tighter windows.  

 

If he starts taking advantage of those green spaces again, it forces defenders to respect it and come up to stop him, thereby opening up those windows again. Literally that's all that he needs to do.

 

The other problem is the team isn't playing with any continuity as a team and playing "complimentary football".  When the D is making stops and getting the O the ball back in the first half, they can't do anything, and then when the O starts moving and scoring at will in the 2nd half, the D can't get any stops and allows long drives and the other team to eat time off the clock, lessening the opportunity for the Bills to score more points to pull away. In the last 9 "real possessions" in the 2nd halves of the last 3 games, the offense has 7 TDS, a missed FG and a turnover on downs after picking up 42 yards.  That's pretty good...no punts, mostly TDs.  The D needs to help them more by getting a 3 and out here or there instead of allowing 15 play 8.5 minute drives for points for the other team.

 

They need to start playing as a unit where the O helps the D and the D helps the O.  

Edited October 23, 2023 by Big Turk

[dorquemada]

lotta moping around too

 

a team will reflect its leaders

 

maybe he's just spending too much time at the bar on saturday nights

[Your Brown Eye]

It kinda all started around the time they lost the title of NFL celebrity "it" couple

[ngbills]

I said this in another thread. If you compare KC v BUF - the Chiefs have the confidence to play how they want. Throw it 100 straight times, run it 100 straight times, who cares. They dont give a rats how they score. The Bills with Dorsey are like the smart kid who thinks he can figure stuff out and is always trying to impress others. Lets show we can establish the run, lets show we can throw to 17 different guys, lets get this guy involved, the book says you need this, always thinking about something and not just doing what you do best. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

11 minutes ago, Hebert19 said:

 

When you look at all 22 he is missing open guys all over and seems to be keying in on one guy in the route the entire time.  

 

The turnovers at the end of last year amd jets game were bad.  Like he didn't see the defenders.  

 

What are chances he's locking in on one guy because he isn't trusting what he's seeing now.   

 

 

careful .. articulating this type of observation is intimidated 

[Westside]

Herbert sucks as a Qb, Allen is much much better. Get over it!

[Doc]

If Josh is the problem, we'll just get a shiny new QB at the QB store.   

[Roundybout]

He’s a unicorn with its horn being chopped off to appease the archaic notion of complementary football. 

[Westside]

These people think that getting rid of Josh will solve all the problems. 

[Goin Breakdown]

3 minutes ago, Westside said:

These people think that getting rid of Josh will solve all the problems. 

Maybe I missed something. Who's saying this?

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

Josh put us in position to win the game and yet again the defense **** the bed and that falls solely on McD. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

11 minutes ago, Westside said:

These people think that getting rid of Josh will solve all the problems. 

Stop playing like and idiot equates to getting rid of? 

[Hebert19]

22 minutes ago, Doc said:

If Josh is the problem, we'll just get a shiny new QB at the QB store.   

Not saying its a long term thing but since he started throwing picks he's not going through his progressions the same and as a result he's missing people.  

 

Watch the cheifs game last year before he started throwing picks.  He was so decisive and fast that game.  Same with NE game.  Even until halftime at against green Bay.  Then he threw a pick.  Then another and all of a sudden he was off.  

 

He needs a sports psychologist. 

23 minutes ago, Westside said:

These people think that getting rid of Josh will solve all the problems. 

No one said get rid of him.  He's got a bit of a mental block.  Doesn't mean he can't fix.  Doesn't mean we need rid of him.  But he CAN be the problem and the solution too. 

24 minutes ago, Westside said:

These people think that getting rid of Josh will solve all the problems. 

No one said get rid of him.  He's got a bit of a mental block.  Doesn't mean he can't fix.  Doesn't mean we need rid of him.  But he CAN be the problem and the solution too. 

[corta765]

Ironically he is on pace for the best year statistically since 2020 passing. It is why the eye test matters more to me then the stats, I thought last year was actually Joshs best year as they took a lot of body blows and regardless of turnovers he got them through it.

 

To me he is pressing a bit too hard and things have gone sideways in a way he has not faced since 2019. The offense seems to actively trying to evolve for some reason to be more balanced and he has been far more a pocket passer this year then I can ever remember prior. He still is a freak breaking tackles and making plays exist that normally don't, but there seems to be a forced effort to not run 20 yards and pass for 10 or throw it away. When the offense was running hot weeks 2-4 it wasn't an issue and the evolution seemed fine. But the last three weeks have been a step back and I think they have gone a bit too far with keeping him safe and in the pocket vs letting him play. Truthfully Josh is at his best when he is a dual threat and willing to take a guy on. Week 1 may have spooked him in a season he was already moving away from being as aggressive running it. Maybe this is just part of his evolution and by the back half of the season this is a road bump as they find the stride they had weeks 2-4 or maybe the offense as a whole needs a rescheme and going back to the most successful parts of 2020-22. To me the answer is probably more towards the middle by loosening and letting Josh play a little more free and utilizing 11 personnel which josh seems to like more while having a more targeted rushing attack when you run.

[Peace Frog]

Josh needs to tackle better.

[TheCockSportif]

I read here that the problem is jetlag.