Josh Allen….detached.

[4merper4mer]

Something is off with the team for sure.  I don’t claim to know what it is but find the literal hero worship of Josh off putting.  He’s surrounded by:

 

A terrible roster

worthless receivers

terrible OL

Diggs is a diva

an inept GM

an inept HC

an inept OC

 

and Davis had only one catch for 6 yards so he stinks.  Why didn’t he just jump 26 feet in the air and catch that TD?  What a dummy.

 

It could not possibly be anything to do with Josh.  He’s perfect.

 

FWIW I don’t put too much stock into the sideline shots which aren’t exactly a big sample size.  I’m also not blaming Josh for everything.  
 

Take the way Allen is playing right now and insert it onto any other NFL team.  Does that team win the Super Bowl?  I say 49ers probably, Eagles maybe, Lions probably not but remotely possible.  Every other team: no way.  And yet everything here is everyone else’s ineptitude or fault.

 

The Bills best chance for the foreseeable future is with Allen but he needs to be better than he is right now and he needs to start with himself.  To his credit, he is not blaming anyone else publicly and my guess is that he isn’t privately either.  He isn’t the entire issue but he needs to grow up.

[DuckyBoys]

12 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

Something is off with the team for sure.  I don’t claim to know what it is but find the literal hero worship of Josh off putting.  He’s surrounded by:

 

A terrible roster

worthless receivers

terrible OL

Diggs is a diva

an inept GM

an inept HC

an inept OC

 

and Davis had only one catch for 6 yards so he stinks.  Why didn’t he just jump 26 feet in the air and catch that TD?  What a dummy.

 

It could not possibly be anything to do with Josh.  He’s perfect.

 

FWIW I don’t put too much stock into the sideline shots which aren’t exactly a big sample size.  I’m also not blaming Josh for everything.  
 

Take the way Allen is playing right now and insert it onto any other NFL team.  Does that team win the Super Bowl?  I say 49ers probably, Eagles maybe, Lions probably not but remotely possible.  Every other team: no way.  And yet everything here is everyone else’s ineptitude or fault.

 

The Bills best chance for the foreseeable future is with Allen but he needs to be better than he is right now and he needs to start with himself.  To his credit, he is not blaming anyone else publicly and my guess is that he isn’t privately either.  He isn’t the entire issue but he needs to grow up.

Fair enough but put Goff, Hurts or Purdy on the Bills and see how many games we win   Every player on this roster is capable of playing better but not many are remotely close to Josh Allen

[Boatdrinks]

3 hours ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

Nothing is wrong with him. I just don’t think he can believe he plays with the crap he does . Gabe Davis 1 catch 6 yards 🙄

I agree. I don’t care how he looks on the sideline. Vastly overrated. This scheme isn’t designed around his skill set and they’re coaching too many things out of him. He’s the only reason this team isn’t in the division basement anymore. 

[What a Tuel]

38 minutes ago, Brian Higgins hair said:

 

This isn’t about questioning Allen’s talent. We all know what he’s capable of. This is about wondering what’s wrong here…something has changed between the killer Josh to the current Josh.

if you and others believe we are dealing with the same Josh killer Attitude of a couple years ago, well, I respectfully disagree. 
 

 

You don't have to question "what's wrong" after every loss. You win some you lose some.

Edited October 23, 2023 by What a Tuel

[Bob in STL]

Something is rotten in Denmark that is for sure.

 

Josh is not having fun and the team spirit is not there - but is the bad play killing the team spirit, or is the lack of team spirit leading to the bad play?  

 

Factors to consider:

• Coaching:  Daboll gone and Dorsey running a lot of the same system but not doing it nearly as well
• Familiarity:  Teams know what we do and how to stop us, there are no surprises 
• Work Ethic:  Allen's off seasons of hard work and fundamentals is a thing of the past, he is a celebrity now (for awhile) 
• How we play him:  The taming of Josh (no more planned runs, way less deep balls) 
• Supporting cast:  Failure to develop top talent around Josh (example: Knox is average, Davis far below average, no slot replacement for Beasley, a mediocre OL, a mediocre running game); a lack of team speed to make big plays.   We have Diggs and that is all.  

Maybe we fix the first thing on the list and everything else gets better.  

 

I am done with Dorsey right now.  

 

Edited October 23, 2023 by Bob in STL

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

3 hours ago, Brian Higgins hair said:

is it me?

The days of Josh, with that burning competitive fire in his eyes…going up and down the bench supporting the D, talking to the O line and talking to receivers seem to be gone. 
After a 4th down, he goes back to the bench, looks at the IPad, and then just sits and watches the Jumbotron quietly.

Meanwhile, Diggs is doing what Stef does, fire burning and supporting others.
There is something that’s changed in him. 

it’s the anti-sugar rush high Josh mentality that the coaching staff is trying to instill in him. It’s the worst thing that could’ve been done.

 

 

[cgg716]

28 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

Something is off with the team for sure.  I don’t claim to know what it is but find the literal hero worship of Josh off putting.  He’s surrounded by:

 

A terrible roster

worthless receivers

terrible OL

Diggs is a diva

an inept GM

an inept HC

an inept OC

 

and Davis had only one catch for 6 yards so he stinks.  Why didn’t he just jump 26 feet in the air and catch that TD?  What a dummy.

 

It could not possibly be anything to do with Josh.  He’s perfect.

 

FWIW I don’t put too much stock into the sideline shots which aren’t exactly a big sample size.  I’m also not blaming Josh for everything.  
 

Take the way Allen is playing right now and insert it onto any other NFL team.  Does that team win the Super Bowl?  I say 49ers probably, Eagles maybe, Lions probably not but remotely possible.  Every other team: no way.  And yet everything here is everyone else’s ineptitude or fault.

 

The Bills best chance for the foreseeable future is with Allen but he needs to be better than he is right now and he needs to start with himself.  To his credit, he is not blaming anyone else publicly and my guess is that he isn’t privately either.  He isn’t the entire issue but he needs to grow up.

Allen is completing 65 percent of his passes for 253 yards per game, 11 tds and 7 INT's, this is with his best performance, Miami, removed from the math. Any assertion that other teams couldn't win with that, or that, the clapping dope who wants all the cap room for his 1998 defense isn't the problem, is just insane 

[Xwnyer]

3 hours ago, oldmanfan said:

I said to my wife he looked disinterested until the fourth quarter.  Detached might be a better descriptor.  Something is going on with him.

this started last season during the GB game.  Maybe we need to invite his girlfriend to the games so she can be seen rooting for him maybe the Taylor Swift like effect might help him  lol.

[Milanos Milano]

3 hours ago, Billsflyer12 said:

I think he generally looks like a guy who would 100% rather be on a golf course anywhere else in the world.

Which is concerning. He doesn’t put in the extra mile in the off-season like some of the greats either. Sigh. 

[Xwnyer]

28 minutes ago, DuckyBoys said:

Fair enough but put Goff, Hurts or Purdy on the Bills and see how many games we win   Every player on this roster is capable of playing better but not many are remotely close to Josh Allen

actually Purdy might be better in the offense that Dorsey has designed 😞

 

[Roundybout]

I’d feel pretty bad too if I was a unicorn and I got my horn cut off in the name of “complementary football”

[cgg716]

1 minute ago, Xwnyer said:

actually Purdy might be better in the offense that Dorsey has designed 😞

 

That might actually be the dumbest thing ever said on these boards. High bar

[4merper4mer]

42 minutes ago, DuckyBoys said:

Fair enough but put Goff, Hurts or Purdy on the Bills and see how many games we win   Every player on this roster is capable of playing better but not many are remotely close to Josh Allen

Are we 3-4 with Hurts or even Goff/Purdy.  I’m not sure.  You’ll note I didn’t include the Chiefs because I see holes there that the refs and Mahomes can’t cover up forever.    
 

If you asked me to pick a QB to lead the Bills moving forward Josh would be very high on the list.  I think you have to go with Mahomes first but beyond that Allen can at the very least be heavily argued against anyone else.  There are very few who can be argued against him.  But……2023 Allen is not doing what Josh Allen can do.  He’s just not.  People can go on blaming everything else in the world and anyone but Allen, but his play is a very large part of our set of issues.  There is NEVER only one reason.  All I’m saying is that attributing 0% to Josh is silly hero worship and factually way off.  For that I get lots of thumbs downs and eye rolls.  It’s weird.

16 minutes ago, cgg716 said:

Allen is completing 65 percent of his passes for 253 yards per game, 11 tds and 7 INT's, this is with his best performance, Miami, removed from the math. Any assertion that other teams couldn't win with that, or that, the clapping dope who wants all the cap room for his 1998 defense isn't the problem, is just insane 

First off I didn’t say “win”.  I said “win the Super Bowl”.  See the difference?  
 

Did the clapping dope throw an easy pick on the first play from scrimmage yesterday to dig us a hole?  

Edited October 23, 2023 by 4merper4mer

[wvbillsfan]

I thought about that but he’s very much into not too high and not too low

 

I’ve heard him say that after big wins. I assume it applies to losses as well. Good way to manage your mental space and not go in a downward spiral. 

[cgg716]

11 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

Are we 3-4 with Hurts or even Goff/Purdy.  I’m not sure.  You’ll note I didn’t include the Chiefs because I see holes there that the refs and Mahomes can’t cover up forever.    
 

If you asked me to pick a QB to lead the Bills moving forward Josh would be very high on the list.  I think you have to go with Mahomes first but beyond that Allen can at the very least be heavily argued against anyone else.  There are very few who can be argued against him.  But……2023 Allen is not doing what Josh Allen can do.  He’s just not.  People can go on blaming everything else in the world and anyone but Allen, but his play is a very large part of our set of issues.  There is NEVER only one reason.  All I’m saying is that attributing 0% to Josh is silly hero worship and factually way off.  For that I get lots of thumbs downs and eye rolls.  It’s weird.

First off I didn’t say “win”.  I said “win the Super Bowl”.  See the difference?  
 

Did the clapping dope throw an easy pick on the first play from scrimmage yesterday to dig us a hole?  

Dig us a hole. The clapping dopes defense is just as culpable for mistaking Jones for Brady. Anyone laying blame on Allen is missing what he has accomplished in spite of the crap he's been handed. Nobody could do more with this coach and roster, Nobody. 

[ChrisWatson#21]

He has been the QB that has taken the most hits since 2018 and it has to be taking it's toll on his body.  He looks like he is playing hurt and has clearly lost a step or two already with his mobility.  They need to develop a better running game and design plays where he gets rid of the ball quicker.

[cgg716]

1 minute ago, ChrisWatson#21 said:

He has been the QB that has taken the most hits since 2018 and it has to be taking it's toll on his body.  He looks like he is playing hurt and has clearly lost a step or two already with his mobility.  They need to develop a better running game and design plays where he gets rid of the ball quicker.

Or I don't know maybe get an oline. That 12 deep d line rotation though, thatshould do it 

[78thealltimegreat]

52 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

I agree. I don’t care how he looks on the sideline. Vastly overrated. This scheme isn’t designed around his skill set and they’re coaching too many things out of him. He’s the only reason this team isn’t in the division basement anymore. 

Do they honestly win a single game without him? I just don’t know 

Edited October 23, 2023 by 78thealltimegreat

[TheFunPolice]

To me, it now seems clear that something is off with him. At first, I would dismiss it as me projecting my own frustrations as a fan of the team, but something is definitely different, and not in a good way. 

 

It could also be that it's less about Allen personally and more something larger going on with the team behind the scenes. Maybe the issues with Diggs are another hint at that, who knows. 

 

A couple of recent examples:

 

1. The biggest indicator of a real issue for me: The "same **** different day" comment after the week 1 loss to the Jets this year. To me, that comment revealed something deeper going on, since it was week 1 and that phrase came to his mind in that moment. It was 1 game, so why "same ****" ?

 

If he was QB of the Chargers I would get that, but he and the team have had a lot of success lately. Can you imagine Mahomes saying that after the Week 1 loss at home to the Lions? That's my point. Other than Mahomes and Burrow, Allen has done a lot of winning, so what's the reason for a comment like that? 

 

An optimistic person would say no Josh, that was different **** than we're used to, not the same. 

 

2. After the Giants game Allen seemed miserable and borderline rude to Melissa Stark who does the SNF "talk with the winners" thing at the end of the game. The way he said "let's go home" at the end of the interview was really strange. Dude, you just won the damn game! Granted, it was ugly but good lord. 

 

In fact, I think that's what I see the most with Allen this season. He just looks, sounds, and seems miserable. He's been much more combative with interviewers, calling out the "armchair critics" and just generally not being the smiling, happy go lucky ball of energy that he was in previous seasons. 

 

I do wonder if McDermott is wearing on these guys. Every time the Bills have a tough game Florio puts that "Jenga tower" analogy out there, and even though I have nothing but disdain for him generally that does worry me a bit. Like he knows something and is being cute about it. 

 

He did it AGAIN today. 

It's hard to dismiss when it actually feels like a good analogy. 

 

Edited October 23, 2023 by TheFunPolice

[4merper4mer]

21 minutes ago, cgg716 said:

Dig us a hole. The clapping dopes defense is just as culpable for mistaking Jones for Brady. Anyone laying blame on Allen is missing what he has accomplished in spite of the crap he's been handed. Nobody could do more with this coach and roster, Nobody. 

In your humble opinion has Allen ever made a mistake?