Israel and Iran

[Justice]

4 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

 

The Ottoman Empire? 

 

Palestine was never a country to be taken. The name itself refers to the land that the Philistines used to live in.

 

It was a geographical region, like the mid-west, governed by the Ottoman Empire for 800 years until they lost World War I.

 

The land that consisted of the region of Palestine became Jordan, Lebanon and parts of Syria and Iraq. 

 

The very notion of a "Palestinian" people was born out the the muslim refusal to accept a sovereign Israel. They claimed all of the land that comprises Israel, and the Palestinian identity emerged in opposition to Israel.

 

Individual Arabs that now identify as Palestinians had their land taken, as a result of their attempt to destroy Israel. But they had no country to take. 

 

Let's be real. 90% of Palestine was turned into four different Arab states. Then the world demanded the remaining 10% be split into two states. 

 

Had the so called Palestinians accepted a two state solution in 1948 they would have a country of their own today. 

 

If they had accepted a two state solution in 1967 they would have a country of their own today.

 

The same could be said of the 1970's, 80's, 90's and 2000's.

 

The truth is they don't want peace. What they want is all of Israel to be theirs.

 

What would I do if I was born there in the 1970's and may family had their home taken because they launched a war against Israel 10 years earlier and then continued global terror attacks for decades? 

 

I would have tried my best to get the f out of such a backwards, violent, hate filled hell hole. 

 

Edit: let me ask you a question. Why is it that  none of the people criticizing Israel for their response are demanding  Hamas release the hostages? 

 

 

 

 

Damn. My 97 year old grandfather who passed away 15 years ago and would have been 112 years old today was lying to me all this time? His father too?? And his before that? And so on and so on? You see today’s Israelis grandparents and great grandparents weren’t born in Israel or Palestine for the most part. 
 

It’s funny how you can make this argument and not give a F that Israel was Israel long before Palestine was Palestine. You want to go back 2000 years but refuse to go back 75. 

Well let’s play this game… what do we call non Israelis in 2023? Palestinians right? Palestinians need a Palestine. 

 

I’m not like that though. I recognize Israel’s right to exist even if it was 2000 years ago. I refuse to be the guy that won’t let a people have their dignity. 
 

 

[Justice]

14 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

 

The Ottoman Empire? 

 

Palestine was never a country to be taken. The name itself refers to the land that the Philistines used to live in.

 

It was a geographical region, like the mid-west, governed by the Ottoman Empire for 800 years until they lost World War I.

 

The land that consisted of the region of Palestine became Jordan, Lebanon and parts of Syria and Iraq. 

 

The very notion of a "Palestinian" people was born out the the muslim refusal to accept a sovereign Israel. They claimed all of the land that comprises Israel, and the Palestinian identity emerged in opposition to Israel.

 

Individual Arabs that now identify as Palestinians had their land taken, as a result of their attempt to destroy Israel. But they had no country to take. 

 

Let's be real. 90% of Palestine was turned into four different Arab states. Then the world demanded the remaining 10% be split into two states. 

 

Had the so called Palestinians accepted a two state solution in 1948 they would have a country of their own today. 

 

If they had accepted a two state solution in 1967 they would have a country of their own today.

 

The same could be said of the 1970's, 80's, 90's and 2000's.

 

The truth is they don't want peace. What they want is all of Israel to be theirs.

 

What would I do if I was born there in the 1970's and may family had their home taken because they launched a war against Israel 10 years earlier and then continued global terror attacks for decades? 

 

I would have tried my best to get the f out of such a backwards, violent, hate filled hell hole. 

 

Edit: let me ask you a question. Why is it that  none of the people criticizing Israel for their response are demanding  Hamas release the hostages? 

 

 

 

 

Good job, Mayweather, you dodged the question. Maybe if I said what if the Native Americans took their country back how would you respond would you answer me then? Would you love them? Would you resist? 
 

IDK if they’re asking for the hostages to be released or not. I would hope they’d want that. I do. 

[ExiledInIllinois]

1 hour ago, SCBills said:

How do you believe this can be done?

 

You seem to be advocating for a two state solution?

 

Do you believe Palestinian terror groups, supported by Iran and - at least - a noticeable segment of the population given they were elected to governance, are willing to abide by that?

 

Because it seems to me, hearing directly from Hamas, and seeing the sentiment of Pro-Palestinian protesters all over the globe, that the only acceptable solution to many is a Palestinian state at the expense of Israel. 
 

One state solution. Seeking a one state solution.

[Justice]

1 minute ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

One state solution. Seeking a one state solution.

That’ll never happen. The Arabs would outnumber them and they’d lose every election. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

59 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

So that's what it comes down to: fear that somehow this will change the election dynamics and Biden's support of Israel will make him more popular. 

It will make him more favorable to moderates and right middle, but alienate him amongst the further left, blm, disillusioned social Justice warrior types. So for him it’s a clear move towards the center, a move he can afford without an actual primary contest. 

[Tiberius]

2 hours ago, Tenhigh said:

Not it all. Just don't criticize them for Nonsense.

 

Not doing their job? I'll criticize that, don't get you panties in a wad over it, it will be ok

[Tiberius]

2 hours ago, Motorin' said:

 

Turns out Trump was right about the radical left. And now they are calling for Israel to be wiped off the map "from the river to the sea, Palestine will be free."

 

 

 

750,000 Palestinians driven from their own lands in 1948, when their people and five additional nations invaded Israel to bring about its destruction. 

 

Don't forget, they became refugees  when they tried to wipe Israel off the map the moment it was recognized as a nation. 

You mean after Britain had simply declared a Jewish homeland in 1917 in a land they didn't own where Jews were a small minority? Right? 

[Doc]

Glad to see the call for a day of Jihad was a complete bust.  That's incredibly embarrassing for Hamas.

[sherpa]

The potential for a peaceful resolution was in hand in 2000, during a Clinton led summit.

It would have been a great foundation.

 

Arafat was offered nearly everything they had demanded.

I recall he claimed it was all a "trick."

 

Most reasonable people disagree, and understand that he was a lying clown never intending to save his people from this, and greatly engaged in self enrichment.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2002/may/23/israel3 

 

"The true story of Camp David was that for the first time in the history of the conflict the American president put on the table a proposal, based on UN Security Council resolutions 242 and 338, very close to the Palestinian demands, and Arafat refused even to accept it as a basis for negotiations, walked out of the room, and deliberately turned to terrorism."

 

 

Edited October 14, 2023 by sherpa

[Doc]

2 minutes ago, sherpa said:

The potential for a peaceful resolution was in hand in 2000, during a Clinton led summit.

It would have been a great foundation.

 

Arafat was offered nearly everything they had demanded.

I recall he claimed it was all a "trick."

 

Most reasonable people disagree, and understand that he was a lying clown never intending to save his people from this, and greatly engaged in self enrichment.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2002/may/23/israel3 

 

It was never going to be enough.

[Irv]

2 hours ago, Justice said:

Oh I see. I’m not the one insulting people. But ban me. Idgaf. Don’t need to be around a dictator like you. 

Your grandfather makes more sense than you do.  Cocaine's a powerful drug.  What a mess.  

[Motorin']

1 hour ago, Justice said:

Damn. My 97 year old grandfather who passed away 15 years ago and would have been 112 years old today was lying to me all this time? His father too?? And his before that? And so on and so on? You see today’s Israelis grandparents and great grandparents weren’t born in Israel or Palestine for the most part. 
 

It’s funny how you can make this argument and not give a F that Israel was Israel long before Palestine was Palestine. You want to go back 2000 years but refuse to go back 75. 

Well let’s play this game… what do we call non Israelis in 2023? Palestinians right? Palestinians need a Palestine. 

 

I’m not like that though. I recognize Israel’s right to exist even if it was 2000 years ago. I refuse to be the guy that won’t let a people have their dignity. 
 

 

 

Yes, unfortunately your grandfather was lying to you if he told you he was born in the country of Palestine. 

[sherpa]

25 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

It was never going to be enough.

 

I think there is a real systemic problem in the situation.

There is simply no Arab leader willing to step forward and engage in a peaceful agreement that involves Israel keeping land.

It would be viewed as a gross weakness.

 

Look at what happened to Anwar Sadat after his agreement.

[Justice]

38 minutes ago, Irv said:

Your grandfather makes more sense than you do.  Cocaine's a powerful drug.  What a mess.  

Keep my grandfather out of your mouth. 

44 minutes ago, sherpa said:

The potential for a peaceful resolution was in hand in 2000, during a Clinton led summit.

It would have been a great foundation.

 

Arafat was offered nearly everything they had demanded.

I recall he claimed it was all a "trick."

 

Most reasonable people disagree, and understand that he was a lying clown never intending to save his people from this, and greatly engaged in self enrichment.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2002/may/23/israel3 

 

"The true story of Camp David was that for the first time in the history of the conflict the American president put on the table a proposal, based on UN Security Council resolutions 242 and 338, very close to the Palestinian demands, and Arafat refused even to accept it as a basis for negotiations, walked out of the room, and deliberately turned to terrorism."

 

 

He wanted the right of return. But yes. He dropped the ball hard on that one and Israel finished it off when they iced their PM. But hey you won’t mention that. 

30 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

 

Yes, unfortunately your grandfather was lying to you if he told you he was born in the country of Palestine. 

Point went well over your head. I’ll spell it out for you. Call them whatever you wish but my lineage goes back much longer than this current group of Israelis do. Now say something smart. 
 

It probably bothers you to hear I own acres and acres of land over there. It’s been passed down generations and I’ll pass it down to mine. 😉

Edited October 14, 2023 by Justice

[Tenhigh]

1 hour ago, Tiberius said:

Not doing their job? I'll criticize that, don't get you panties in a wad over it, it will be ok

You are right, they are not doing their job, but you are making up a fake emergency over an Ambassadorship, that's all.

Edited October 14, 2023 by Tenhigh

[Doc]

10 minutes ago, sherpa said:

I think there is a real systemic problem in the situation.

There is simply no Arab leader willing to step forward and engage in a peaceful agreement that involves Israel keeping land.

It would be viewed as a gross weakness.

 

Look at what happened to Anwar Sadat after his agreement.

 

Yup.  Like I said, it's a turf war and both sides want more.  Except that Israel appears to be willing to co-exist while the Muslims want them eradicated/all the land.

[Tiberius]

1 minute ago, Tenhigh said:

You are right, they are not doing their job, but you are making up a fake emergency over an Ambassadorship, that's all.

It's a real emergency. stop digging 

[Doc]

1 minute ago, Tenhigh said:

You are right, they are not doing their job, but you are making up a fake emergency over an Ambassadorship, that's all.

 

It's got to be a talking point of theirs.

[Tenhigh]

Just now, Tiberius said:

It's a real emergency. stop digging 

Ok Buddy

[Justice]

1 minute ago, Doc said:

 

Yup.  Like I said, it's a turf war and both sides want more.  Except that Israel appears to be willing to co-exist while the Muslims want them eradicated/all the land.

Don’t speak for me and my people. Everyone I know recognizes Israel’s right to exist.