Davante Adams trade speculation…UPDATE: Schefter says no chance he is traded today (link pg 17)

[BuffaloRebound]

I think it’s hard to assimilate a WR in middle of season no matter how good he is.  A premier RB like Barkley probably costs less draft capital and provides more immediate impact.  

[BaaadThingsMan]

11 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

From now on when someone makes some broad declaration like this..........but then gets proven 100% wrong:

 

 

We gotta' set some kind of standard for unnecessary absolute failure.

 

 

Was he traded and I missed it? 

 

I think your premature bud. 

[SoTier]

19 hours ago, boyst said:

and we are going to be losing AJE and Floyd, to bank on an aging Miller with Rosseau. I just don't get tingly thinking of that and our FO malfeasance handling the DL

 

Can I borrow your crystal ball for the next big Power Ball drawing?

 

16 hours ago, Araiza Curse said:

As much as I want this to happen. It won’t. Why? Because this franchise has no clue in what it takes to win a Super Bowl. Another great WR opposite of Diggs is the medicine we need, which is precisely why I’m not expecting it. 

 

How many Super Bowls have you won?

 

15 hours ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

Yeah - part of why I say Beane can't evaluate WR talent is because he doesn't even try to land great wide receivers.

 

In his six drafts as the Bills GM, the highest draft pick Beane has used on a wide receiver is a 4th rounder, which is absurd:

 

2018

 

Ray-Ray McCloud (6th)
Austin Proehl (7th)

 

2019

 

None

 

2020

 

Gabe Davis (4th)
Isaiah Hodgins (6th)

 

2021

 

Marquez Stevenson (6th)

 

2022

 

Khalil Shakir (5th)

 

2023

 

Justin Shorter (5th)

 

So I say he can't evaluate WR talent because year in and year out I see wide receivers that would be very valuable to the Bills drafted by other teams and Beane constantly lets them pass by.

 

Notable wide receivers passed on by Beane in the draft (chosen 20 picks or less after the Bills draft pick - (round - position and player chosen instead)):

 

2018

 

DJ Moore (1st - LB Edmunds)

Calvin Ridley (1st - LB Edmunds)

Antonio Callaway (3rd - DT Phillips)

 

2019

 

Marquise Brown (1st - DT Oliver)

AJ Brown (2nd - OL Ford)

Mecole Hardman (2nd - OL Ford)

*DK Metcalf (2nd - OL Ford)

Terry McLaurin (3rd - RB Singletary)

Hunter Renfrow (5th - LB Joseph)

 

2020

 

Van Jefferson (2nd - DE Epenesa)

Devin Duvernay (3rd - RB Moss)

Darnell Mooney (5th - QB Fromm)

KJ Osborn (5th - QB Fromm)

Donovan Peoples-Jones (5th - QB Fromm)

Quez Watkins (6th - K Bass)

Jauan Jennings (6th - WR Hodgins)

 

2021

 

Elijah Moore (1st - DE Rousseau)

Rondale Moore (1st - DE Rousseau)

Josh Palmer (2nd - DE Basham)

Amon-Ra St. Brown (3rd - OL Brown)

 

2022

 

Christian Watson (1st - CB Elam)

Wan'Dale Robinson (1st - CB Elam)

David Bell (3rd - LB Bernard)

 

2023

 

Jonathan Mingo (1st - TE Kincaid)

Marvin Mims (2nd - OL Torrence)

Tank Dell (2nd - OL Torrence)

Jalin Hyatt (2nd - OL Torrence)

Cedric Tillman (2nd - OL Torrence)

Josh Downs (2nd - OL Torrence)

Michael Wilson (3rd - LB Williams)

Tre Tucker (3rd - LB Williams)

 

*chosen 26 picks after Ford

 

So, Beane "doesn't even try to land great wide receivers"????   Really?   The fact that the Beane traded a first round pick for Stefon Diggs in 2020 flushes your premise down the toilet, dude.

 

The reality is that a team can't afford two #1 WRs on 2nd or 3rd contract as well as an elite QB beyond his rookie contract unless the team is going to ignore the OL and the defense.  That's exactly why Tyreek Hill is in Miami.

Edited October 20, 2023 by SoTier

[boyst]

15 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

Can I borrow your crystal ball for the next big Power Ball drawing?

 

 

How many Super Bowls have you won?

 

 

So, Beane "doesn't even try to land great wide receivers"????   Really?   The fact that the Beane traded a first round pick for Stefon Diggs in 2020 flushes your premise down the toilet, dude.

 

The reality is that a team can't afford two #1 WRs on 2nd or 3rd contract as well as an elite QB beyond his rookie contract unless the team is going to ignore the OL and the defense.  That's exactly why Tyreek Hill is in Miami.

We gotta pay AjE,Floyd, and Davis among others... It's gonna be tough 

[dma0034]

7 minutes ago, boyst said:

We gotta pay AjE,Floyd, and Davis among others... It's gonna be tough 

 

Bills are already 30 million over the  cap. They are going to have to dance around that for the foreseeable future

[BADOLBILZ]

3 hours ago, BaaadThingsMan said:

Was he traded and I missed it? 

 

I think your premature bud. 

 

 

Nope,  as was very clearly stated in english,  just pointing out that we need a response standard to address the unnecessary, random absolutes that some attention seekers create when they are eventually proven 100% wrong.    Like a Darwin award.    You may be proven 100% correct, though.   Time will tell but you are playing a long game with those absolutes and huge contract guys tend to get cut and change teams late in their careers, if nothing else.   

 

[Beck Water]

13 hours ago, Dr.Mantis_Toboggan said:

2019 was THE year, and BBB comes out with ZERO… I thought for sure they were going Brown or DK in the 2nd, it was a huge need, and in the 2024 draft, five years later, it still will be. Meanwhile Ford was literally a disappointment from the moment they called his name.

If Beane picks Brown or DK, or even McLaurin, does Buffalo have atleast one Lombardi by now?

Hard to think they wouldn’t…

 

Look, this is revisionist history x 1000.

 

In the 2019 off-season, Beane's first priority was to improve the OL, which could neither run block nor pass protect in 2018.  No OL, no Josh.

 

Hence the firing of Juan Castillo, the hiring of Bobby Johnson, letting him bring in "his guy" in Feliciano, signing Mitch Morse in FA, doubling down at various positions like C and RT in the journeyman FA market, and yes, drafting Ford. 

 

Ford was graded as a year-1 starter by Lance Zierlein (grades not infalliable but his scouting evaluations usually have me nodding when I go back and read them after a player has been in the league a while).  Ford was generally regarded as high ceiling, low floor guy - somewhat raw at tackle, but with a lot of physical traits and athleticism to develop into a solid starting OLman.  (And the fact that he's still in the NFL on a team which hopes to contend says Beane and his men aren't alone in that scouting e v a l).  I'm afraid if you want us to believe that you thought Ford was "a disappointment from the moment they called his name", you're going to have to show your receipts.

 

Ford showed flashes at RT his rookie season, starting 15 games (but platooning with Ty Nseckhe).  He also suffered a lot of injuries, some of which he probably tried too hard to play through (I can remember a game vs Tenn where he was on injury report with a knee injury, but he couldn't seem to lift his R arm into blocking position).  It happens that a guy who shows a lot of athleticism and physical promise and flashes as a rookie, fizzles because injuries derail him.  (That may become true of Spence Brown, by the way.)

 

Beane's second 2019 off-season priority was to bring in experienced, solid WR who were already solid route runners and who would help Josh Allen develop and expand his passing vocabulary as "player coaches".  And it paid off handsomely with Cole Beasley, who bonded with Allen then started arguing with Allen in training camp about throwing with anticipation and how to read the D.  Allen wouldn't be the QB he is today without Beasley and to a lesser extent, John Brown.

 

Has Beane neglected the WR position (in fact, the offense) overall?  I would say "yes".  But it doesn't come down to one year or one round.  And part of it comes down to misses, or to players who have all the athletic potential in the world but for some reason, take a while to get their head in the right place and live up to it (Zay Jones, I'm talking about you). 

 

And Yes, the guys who drafted AJ Brown and Metcalf have their misses, too - how many Lombardis does Jon Robinson have again?  Oh that's right - he's 47 and home sitting on the couch. 

 

So no, you can't say "whooo, if Beane had drafted AJ Brown or Deebo Samuel in the 2nd we woulda won at least one Lombardi by now", any more than the 8th grade girls CYC Bball team can say "we would have won the championship if I sunk that 3 pointer at the half".  (DK Metcalf was drafted before we picked, so that's Top Drawer Revisionism there).  You change one thing, and everything else in the game changes.

 

 

[Beck Water]

3 hours ago, BaaadThingsMan said:

Was he traded and I missed it? 

 

I think your premature bud. 

 

Indeed.  Although, I do understand the reaction to the "friends and family so I'm stayin' " notion.

 

 

The financials of trading Adams for the Raiders are something like $31.4 dead cap this season - $23.55 of it new.

I think $23.55 is what they'd take on in dead cap to trade him before the 2024 season as well, but that would be off-set by escaping his $16.89M salary.

 

Then we get to look at Josh McDaniel.  He's in his 3rd year in Las Vegas, rocked a 9-14 record in previous years, and is 3-3 right now.

 

He's been given everything he wants, including releasing Derek Carr/assuming a $5.6M dead cap hit just a year after he signed a 3 yr extension, then signing Jimmy "Italian Word for Made of Glass" Garrappolo to $34M guaranteed, 3 yr $72.5M.

 

Sooner or later, one would think that "to whom much is given, much is expected" would apply.

[SoTier]

1 hour ago, boyst said:

We gotta pay AjE,Floyd, and Davis among others... It's gonna be tough 

 

I think that they'll manage to keep at least one, hopefully AJE, most likely at the sacrifice of veteran DBs like White, Poyer, and/or Hyde. 

[boyst]

36 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

I think that they'll manage to keep at least one, hopefully AJE, most likely at the sacrifice of veteran DBs like White, Poyer, and/or Hyde. 

i would like to restructure white to make him more affordable post injury. i still think he can offer 3-5 more years. guarantee some money and get him redone

[Wayne Arnold]

16 hours ago, Ya Digg? said:

There are SEVERAL names on this list that are suspect at best, and why do you have any names from this past draft? 

 

Because they're wide receivers Beane could have chosen. What's your point?

2 hours ago, SoTier said:

So, Beane "doesn't even try to land great wide receivers"????   Really?   The fact that the Beane traded a first round pick for Stefon Diggs in 2020 flushes your premise down the toilet, dude.

 

The reality is that a team can't afford two #1 WRs on 2nd or 3rd contract as well as an elite QB beyond his rookie contract unless the team is going to ignore the OL and the defense.  That's exactly why Tyreek Hill is in Miami.

 

For your sake I'll assume your first paragraph is sarcasm.

 

We don't need two #1 WRs (although Miami has that). We need a #2 and a #3. We have neither. Davis ain't it. Nor is anyone else on the roster.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

2 hours ago, SoTier said:

 

Can I borrow your crystal ball for the next big Power Ball drawing?

 

 

How many Super Bowls have you won?

 

 

So, Beane "doesn't even try to land great wide receivers"????   Really?   The fact that the Beane traded a first round pick for Stefon Diggs in 2020 flushes your premise down the toilet, dude.

 

The reality is that a team can't afford two #1 WRs on 2nd or 3rd contract as well as an elite QB beyond his rookie contract unless the team is going to ignore the OL and the defense.  That's exactly why Tyreek Hill is in Miami.

I think Beane recognized the need for a #1 WR and minimized all Draft risk by trading for Diggs. 

 

It was a definite step up from 2019 when Duke Williams led the team in targets in the Houston Playoff game. 

 

But after that, they've stopped real efforts to get another top-level WR playmaker. 

 

 

2020 was Diggs, a prime Beasley, a declining but still starting John Brown, rookie Gabe Davis, Isaiah McKenzie and 2nd year Knox. 

 

2021 was Diggs, a declining Cole Beasley (~680 yards), the addition of Emmanuel Sanders on his last go around (~600 yards) as the #2, Gabe Davis in the same role (~550 yards) and McKenzie. Knox increased his role.

 

2022 the bottom 3 was Shakir, Crowder, Kumerow, and they brought back both Beasley and Brown late to get Josh more comfortable with his offensive stable. Knox held steady. 

 

In 2023, they turned over 2/3rds of the bottom 3 with Shakir and now Harty and Sherfield. 

 

 

The only real potential difference maker in the rotation is Dalton Kincaid. 

 

They haven't tried to pair Diggs with another upper tier WR, or take a significant draft swing. 

 

I don't think that's unfair. 

 

 

 

Edited October 20, 2023 by Straight Hucklebuck

[Straight Hucklebuck]

2 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

Look, this is revisionist history x 1000.

 

In the 2019 off-season, Beane's first priority was to improve the OL, which could neither run block nor pass protect in 2018.  No OL, no Josh.

 

Hence the firing of Juan Castillo, the hiring of Bobby Johnson, letting him bring in "his guy" in Feliciano, signing Mitch Morse in FA, doubling down at various positions like C and RT in the journeyman FA market, and yes, drafting Ford. 

 

Ford was graded as a year-1 starter by Lance Zierlein (grades not infalliable but his scouting evaluations usually have me nodding when I go back and read them after a player has been in the league a while).  Ford was generally regarded as high ceiling, low floor guy - somewhat raw at tackle, but with a lot of physical traits and athleticism to develop into a solid starting OLman.  (And the fact that he's still in the NFL on a team which hopes to contend says Beane and his men aren't alone in that scouting e v a l).  I'm afraid if you want us to believe that you thought Ford was "a disappointment from the moment they called his name", you're going to have to show your receipts.

 

Ford showed flashes at RT his rookie season, starting 15 games (but platooning with Ty Nseckhe).  He also suffered a lot of injuries, some of which he probably tried too hard to play through (I can remember a game vs Tenn where he was on injury report with a knee injury, but he couldn't seem to lift his R arm into blocking position).  It happens that a guy who shows a lot of athleticism and physical promise and flashes as a rookie, fizzles because injuries derail him.  (That may become true of Spence Brown, by the way.)

 

Beane's second 2019 off-season priority was to bring in experienced, solid WR who were already solid route runners and who would help Josh Allen develop and expand his passing vocabulary as "player coaches".  And it paid off handsomely with Cole Beasley, who bonded with Allen then started arguing with Allen in training camp about throwing with anticipation and how to read the D.  Allen wouldn't be the QB he is today without Beasley and to a lesser extent, John Brown.

 

Has Beane neglected the WR position (in fact, the offense) overall?  I would say "yes".  But it doesn't come down to one year or one round.  And part of it comes down to misses, or to players who have all the athletic potential in the world but for some reason, take a while to get their head in the right place and live up to it (Zay Jones, I'm talking about you). 

 

And Yes, the guys who drafted AJ Brown and Metcalf have their misses, too - how many Lombardis does Jon Robinson have again?  Oh that's right - he's 47 and home sitting on the couch. 

 

So no, you can't say "whooo, if Beane had drafted AJ Brown or Deebo Samuel in the 2nd we woulda won at least one Lombardi by now", any more than the 8th grade girls CYC Bball team can say "we would have won the championship if I sunk that 3 pointer at the half".  (DK Metcalf was drafted before we picked, so that's Top Drawer Revisionism there).  You change one thing, and everything else in the game changes.

 

 

The Bills passed on AJ Brown and DK Metcalf. 

 

Looks like they traded up from 40 to 38 to draft Ford. 

 

The 49ers took Deebo 36th overall. 

 

Hard to know whether Bills make the Stefon Diggs move while also having AJ Brown or DK Metcalf on the roster. They were 1,000 yard and 900 yard WRs as rookies. 

 

Edited October 20, 2023 by Straight Hucklebuck

[SoTier]

15 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

Because they're wide receivers Beane could have chosen. What's your point?

 

For your sake I'll assume your first paragraph is sarcasm.

 

We don't need two #1 WRs (although Miami has that). We need a #2 and a #3. We have neither. Davis ain't it. Nor is anyone else on the roster.

 

Since this is a thread about Davante Adams trade speculation, I assumed that you were pushing for the Bills to trade for Adams.  

 

The sad reality is that teams find affordable high-end WRs in the draft not often via trades or FA signings.  Their draft success is dependent upon the WRs available in the draft and where the teams draft.   It's further complicated by how the teams rank their priorities in each draft.

 

 

 

 

[machine gun kelly]

2 hours ago, SoTier said:

 

I think that they'll manage to keep at least one, hopefully AJE, most likely at the sacrifice of veteran DBs like White, Poyer, and/or Hyde. 

 

Hyde’s contract is up after this year.  It’s unlikely we extend him at his age.  AJE knows he has been erratic until the Jags game.  He’ll have to settle in on a reasonable contract.

 

As far as Adams, I don’t see it happening given the cap hit next year, but D. Hop is on a team going nowhere and his impact would be minimal.  It’s possible the Titans may be comfortable with that trade.

[Wayne Arnold]

24 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

Since this is a thread about Davante Adams trade speculation, I assumed that you were pushing for the Bills to trade for Adams.  

 

The sad reality is that teams find affordable high-end WRs in the draft not often via trades or FA signings.  Their draft success is dependent upon the WRs available in the draft and where the teams draft.   It's further complicated by how the teams rank their priorities in each draft.

 

I've submitted evidence that Beane is poor at drafting wide receivers - either because he is gun-shy about drafting them or has difficulty evaluating them.

 

Therefore, the only solution is having to spend resources on proven commodities like Diggs in 2020.

 

So if Adams is available then Beane has to do what he has to do. Although I'd settle for a WR that isn't considered a #1.

[dollars 2 donuts]

9 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

 

Hyde’s contract is up after this year.  It’s unlikely we extend him at his age.  AJE knows he has been erratic until the Jags game.  He’ll have to settle in on a reasonable contract.

 

As far as Adams, I don’t see it happening given the cap hit next year, but D. Hop is on a team going nowhere and his impact would be minimal.  It’s possible the Titans may be comfortable with that trade.

 

 

Seven years here.  Him and Poyer and although I hope this isn't the case they may walk out of here without even a super bowl appearance.

 

That's what possibly stinks. That's what doesn't seem right.

 

 

[DCofNC]

5 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

I've submitted evidence that Beane is poor at drafting wide receivers - either because he is gun-shy about drafting them or has difficulty evaluating them.

 

Therefore, the only solution is having to spend resources on proven commodities like Diggs in 2020.

 

So if Adams is available then Beane has to do what he has to do. Although I'd settle for a WR that isn't considered a #1.

I don’t see that as an unfair argument, he has not hit on WRs in general.  Diggs was a proven player, though he has blossomed more here, so I’ll give credit there.   Draft wise, he hasn’t done anything.  Davis is a nice player for a 4th round pick, but he’s shown exactly why he was a lower pick, he’s still inconsistent.  The rest are fringe players at best. 
 

I have not gone digging to see who might be available, but if there was a chance to enter a WR into the mix, I’d love to.  Unless Kincaid burst on to the scene (which is impossible with his usage early on), this team is Diggs or nothing.

[BaaadThingsMan]

3 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Nope,  as was very clearly stated in english,  just pointing out that we need a response standard to address the unnecessary, random absolutes that some attention seekers create when they are eventually proven 100% wrong.    Like a Darwin award.    You may be proven 100% correct, though.   Time will tell but you are playing a long game with those absolutes and huge contract guys tend to get cut and change teams late in their careers, if nothing else.   

 

Ok I'll accept it if I'm wrong.

 

It wasn't necessarily meant as an absolute( just my opinion) because i understand it's a business and the Raiders will make the best? decision for them when and if it's needed in regards to Adams.

 

I do know however, it's important to Adams to have played in front of his family who are all long time Raiders fans and the reason he forced the original trade. 

 

[DCofNC]

30 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

 

Hyde’s contract is up after this year.  It’s unlikely we extend him at his age.  AJE knows he has been erratic until the Jags game.  He’ll have to settle in on a reasonable contract.

 

As far as Adams, I don’t see it happening given the cap hit next year, but D. Hop is on a team going nowhere and his impact would be minimal.  It’s possible the Titans may be comfortable with that trade.

I agree, I think Hyde and Poyer are gone after this year, wouldn’t mind Hyde coming back on a reasonable deal like Poyer did, but Po looks cooked.

 

AJE is going to get paid, make no mistake.   Pass rushers get paid, he’s on pace for at least double digit sacks, he’s been batting down balls, causing havoc.   While it’s great, the better he plays the remainder of the year, the less likely the Bills can pay him.   Unless you consider 15+ a year “reasonable” he’s a goner.

 

The Titans are in a tough spot.  Supposedly, D-Hop wants to win, and they clearly aren’t going to, but they also need to know what they have at QB and that’s a lot harder to figure out with no targets to throw to.  I’d venture to guess, they won’t trade him, he’s cheap and pretty valuable to them.

 

Adams is just too much to make happen.