The Bills biggest problem on offense remains unchanged

[Straight Hucklebuck]

Our GM and Coaches have been steadfast that all Brown needed was full offseason and no surgeries. They were asked about this on several occasions. 

 

They had their chance in the Draft to select an OT in the 3rd, but instead drafted a 223 pound linebacker from Tulane, a depth WR, a Corner and another Guard. 

 

The cap was maxed out in Free Agency, so the obvious upgrade was not there. 

[Lost]

51 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

The Bills are not a perfect team. And….neither is anyone else. 

 

But...I want a perfect team...is that too much to ask for?  Jeez

[Chaos]

49 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea. The improvement is that he now stands out as such. Last year we had three guys out there who had no business as NFL starters (and bear in mind Brown wasn't even good in the run game in 2022, he was as a rookie and has been decent run blocking so far this year... in 2022 he was bad at everything). 

One thing I noticed in the last two games is that seemed often when Brown was "beaten in Pass protection", It almost seemed as if Brown was getting beaten, he then let himself get beat inside on purpose, and Allen was already rolling right simultaneously with Brown being beaten.   The Bills version of Jujitsu.

Edited September 27, 2023 by Chaos

[Straight Hucklebuck]

6 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I agree.  The OLine and Spencer both seem improved.  Of course they could improve more.

 

Meanwhile our real "biggest problem on offense"  (WR2) does not seem to have been addressed or improved.  The inconsistency of G Davis is still there.   His lackadaisical route against the Jets cost us the game.  Another baffling drop against Wash.  I've seen enough, the trial is over.  Do what it takes to get a stud WR - M Evans or C Kupp.  

 

10 minutes ago, Dunkirk Donski said:

I couldnt agree more with this.  Josh needs another weapon he can trust and Gabe is NOT the answer

Yes.

 

Cook's speed has improved the running back room, but the other other gap in our team that hasn't been solved is speed at WR. 

 

 

Edited September 27, 2023 by Straight Hucklebuck

[BADOLBILZ]

14 hours ago, Simon said:

It continues to be the same problem that has been plaguing them for three years, and that problem is Spencer Brown.

I give them credit for the solid job they have done hiding him so far, but the fact that they continue to have to go out of their way to protect him every week is absolutely handicapping what should be a much more efficient offense. When you have to commit skill players to blocking roles that often, it's like they're playing 10 on 11 out there.

If you wonder why Kincaid and Knox aren't having big impacts check and see how long it takes them to actually get into their routes when they have to spend extra time protecting Spencer Brown before they can leave the LOS.

If you wonder where Damien Harris and Latavius Murray are, look how often they are being asked to cover Spencer Brown. Hell, the Bills are actually using Murray on the LOS just to engage DE's while Brown is still getting set up in pass pro.

 

I really like Spencer Brown and am glad he is on the roster. You tell him to bury the guy in front of him on a 34 dive, and that's what he'll usually do. But he simply does not have the feet to be a complete OT in the modern NFL and is never going to. The necessity for the Bills to take skill players and put them on their heels to protect Brown instead of using them to attack defenses is making it impossible for them to maximize their offensive talent. And as long as they insist on putting a Tackle out there who can't play Tackle in this league, it's going to continue to be a problem all year.

I'm not a GM and have no idea what the in-season solution could be, or if there is even one available. The time to address the issue was the offseason and they didn't do enough solve the problem. I'm not saying it is going to sink their season down the road, but it is certainly going to make things much harder then they needed to be on offense for the rest of this year.

 

 

Bills biggest problem is a lack of playmakers in the pass game beyond Diggs.

 

Just running more non-separators and ball-droppers out on passing plays doesn't resolve the issue of Gabe Davis or Dawson Knox not being able to elevate their games to be a top second option despite Allen being great.    They both tend to need Allen to run around and buy time for them to make much of an impact.

 

The Bills still need another very good WR to elevate their offense to the very top.

[oldmanfan]

1 minute ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Our GM and Coaches have been steadfast that all Brown needed was full offseason and no surgeries. They were asked about this on several occasions. 

 

They had their chance in the Draft to select an OT in the 3rd, but instead drafted a 223 pound linebacker from Tulane, a depth WR, a Corner and another Guard. 

 

The cap was maxed out in Free Agency, so the obvious upgrade was not there. 

The 220 some pound LB they drafted in the 3rd round last year seems to be working out.  Rather than just random criticism, can I ask you to go back to that 3rd round or lower and identify a T that could have been drafted who is currently starting and playing at a higher level than brown?

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

If Brown is our biggest problem start packing for the SB!

[Straight Hucklebuck]

1 minute ago, oldmanfan said:

The 220 some pound LB they drafted in the 3rd round last year seems to be working out.  Rather than just random criticism, can I ask you to go back to that 3rd round or lower and identify a T that could have been drafted who is currently starting and playing at a higher level than brown?

 

Dawand Jones taken in the 4th Round by the Browns. 

[oldmanfan]

6 minutes ago, Chaos said:

One thing I noticed in the last two games is that seemed often when Brown was "beaten in Pass protection", It almost seemed as if Brown was getting beaten, he himself get beat inside on purpose, and Allen was already rolling right simultaneously with Brown being beaten.   The Bills version of Jujitsu.

Would be interesting to ask the brain trust for the Bills O about this

3 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

 

Dawand Jones taken in the 4th Round by the Browns. 

So one guy?  And not that I’m a big believer in PFF rankings but they have Brown ranked above Jones.

 

Thanks for trying.

Edited September 27, 2023 by oldmanfan

[JerseyBills]

2 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I agree.  The OLine and Spencer both seem improved.  Of course they could improve more.

 

Meanwhile our real "biggest problem on offense"  (WR2) does not seem to have been addressed or improved.  The inconsistency of G Davis is still there.   His lackadaisical route against the Jets cost us the game.  Another baffling drop against Wash.  I've seen enough, the trial is over.  Do what it takes to get a stud WR - M Evans or C Kupp.  

I mean I'd love another elite wr but i just don't see it happening with the cap, Idk , I really like Gabe , he had a phenomenal week 2, big TD last week.  Ya he's a bit inconsistent but we could do alot worse at WR2. I think he's top 10 WR2. 

In the AFC the only with better WR2s are

Mia

LAC , well not anymore with Williams down

Cincy

That's it.

 

You can argue Denver with Jeudy and Pitt with Dionte Johnson i guess but I'd still take Gabe personally 

 

[GunnerBill]

4 minutes ago, Chaos said:

One thing I noticed in the last two games is that seemed often when Brown was "beaten in Pass protection", It almost seemed as if Brown was getting beaten, he himself get beat inside on purpose, and Allen was already rolling right simultaneously with Brown being beaten.   The Bills version of Jujitsu.

 

I have always been of the view that if the other 4 are solid Josh can work around a below par RT. 

 

I'd still spend my assets on another receiver before a right tackle.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

1 minute ago, oldmanfan said:

The 220 some pound LB they drafted in the 3rd round last year seems to be working out.  Rather than just random criticism, can I ask you to go back to that 3rd round or lower and identify a T that could have been drafted who is currently starting and playing at a higher level than brown?

Also, let's see on Bernard, we're not totally out of the woods yet. 

 

In the Jets game he crashed the line to stop the run and was swallowed and pushed out of the way. 

 

You'll hear no complaints out of me if he continues to gather sacks and turnovers of course, but I wouldn't say it's problem solved just yet. 

 

When a team wants to run at the Bills, can they stop it. I still think that question needs answered. Josh Jacobs and the Raiders are way off this year from what they were in 2022. 

[Dopey]

13 hours ago, Simon said:

 

I just watched the Bills 3 RBs and 2 TEs combine for a grand total of about 30yrds receiving (or about 6 yrds per player) because they're busy spending half the game playing RT. It's a problem just about every week, regardless of whether they win.

So, our other whipping boy (Dorsey) is hamstrung in his play calling by shoddy RT play? 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

3 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Would be interesting to ask the brain trust for the Bills O about this

So one guy?  Ok.

Did I not follow your instructions to "identify a T" taken in the 3rd or later? 

 

 

[SCBills]

I think we have two weak spots on the offense..

 

RT and WR2

 

-RT we can scheme to help.  There's also the "hope" he continues to improve.

 

-WR2 we can't necessarily scheme up help .. he has to win his routes.. and unless Gabe steps up, he is holding us back.  

 

 

Edited September 27, 2023 by SCBills

[oldmanfan]

2 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Did I not follow your instructions to "identify a T" taken in the 3rd or later? 

 

 

Yes.  Inherent in that question would be a T who would be an improvement over Brown. Sorry that escaped you.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

Just now, oldmanfan said:

Yes.  Inherent in that question would be a T who would be an improvement over Brown. Sorry that escaped you.

Yes, I'm sure you've watched a lot of Dawand Jones my apologies. 

 

 

[Chaos]

3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I have always been of the view that if the other 4 are solid Josh can work around a below par RT. 

 

I'd still spend my assets on another receiver before a right tackle

Josh, Allen escapability skllls are probably the best in NFL history and what I saw the last couple of games could entirely be that. However, I am suggesting there is an element of design and what is happening and that Josh knows what direction Brown is going to let the defender beat him, if need be. And that a certain count in his head Allen is going to confidently roll right knowing the DE assigned to Brown is not

going to be an issue. 
 

[oldmanfan]

Just now, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Yes, I'm sure you've watched a lot of Dawand Jones my apologies. 

 

 

As I pointed out since so many fawn over PFF around here, Brown is ranked higher.  Sorry if that also escaped you.  And since you brought up Jones as a guy that you apparently think is better than Brown, tell me how many Browns games you’ve watched.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

2 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Of course.  When the Bills do something good, it’s because the other team is bad.  When the other team does something good, it’s because the Bills are bad.  
 

This is why I brought up why some in the fan base seem to need to have something, usually an individual player, to criticize.  

That's fine oldman, the Dolphins just ran for over 300 yards. 

 

The Bills (and Bernard) shut them down, or hold them to reasonable yardage, I will readily admit I'm wrong. 

 

I think media, some fans, see the Commanders game: 2 sacks, a FR, and a Interception (great) and conclude we're all set. 

 

I do think the risk is there that he is small against the run. 

 

Can't have it all, and for sure he's been much better than I thought he'd be. His last game matched Edmunds best game ever and he had 5 years here.