Elam a healthy scratch part deux (now part TRES) (now part QUATRO)

[buffblue]

18 minutes ago, dorquemada said:

 

mostly untested 2nd year bench warmer vs tyreek hill is the feel good story we need right now oh wait

Fleezoid is right. Elam actually looked good in real games last year when given the opportunity. You are not going to have a prayer of slowing Miami down playing soft. The ball is coming out too quickly and their receivers are too fast. Incorporating some press coverage, while riskier, offers a better opportunity to get home against Tua by making him hold the ball just a bit longer. We need to be physical off the line against their smaller receivers, something which Elam excels at. I'll take a few holding penalties in exchange for throwing off their timing

Edited September 19, 2023 by buffblue

[dorquemada]

1 minute ago, buffblue said:

Fleezoid is right. Elam actually looked good in real games last year when given the opportunity. You are not going to have a prayer of slowing Miami down playing soft. The ball is coming out too quickly and their receivers are too fast. Incorporating some press coverage, while riskier, offers a better opportunity to get home against Tua by making him hold the ball just a bit longer. We need to be physical off the line against their smaller receivers, something which Elam excels at. I'll take a few holding penalties in exchange for throwing off their timing

 

fair enough, no whining if Hill scorches Elam tho.  Philosophically im in favor of a more aggressive D.  KC never has a better D than us statistically, but theirs shows up in the big moments, i'd like to see that for us

[buffblue]

4 minutes ago, dorquemada said:

 

fair enough, no whining if Hill scorches Elam tho.  Philosophically im in favor of a more aggressive D.  KC never has a better D than us statistically, but theirs shows up in the big moments, i'd like to see that for us

I think it's likely we will get burned over the top by Hill or Waddle at some point. But to me that is preferable to sitting back and watching Miami complete 10-15 yard slants at will all game where Tua gets the ball out almost immediately after taking the snap 

Edited September 19, 2023 by buffblue

[Paup 1995MVP]

On 9/18/2023 at 9:27 AM, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

 

Completely agree.  Not sure how Tre's contract lines up if they can easily do that in this coming off season or not.  But yeah unless he improves, his time will be somewhat limited.

Yes sir.  Elam has looked solid if not spectacular IMO when on the field.  Speaking of CB's.  Wow Levi Wallace looked awful for the Steelers last night.  Very surprised that he is starting for the Steelers.  He has no twitchiness or athleticism.  

[dorquemada]

Just now, Paup 1995MVP said:

Yes sir.  Elam has looked solid if not spectacular IMO when on the field.  Speaking of CB's.  Wow Levi Wallace looked awful for the Steelers last night.  Very surprised that he is starting for the Steelers.  He has no twitchiness or athleticism.  

 

Was a huge Wallace fan going back to Alabama but he was a good example of a system CB that thrived (?) in the type of D the Bills were running

[Einstein]

Just now, buffblue said:

 Elam actually looked good in real games last year when given the opportunity. 

Do you mean in the playoffs? If so, I agree.

 

But in the regular season, he was borderline awful. 76% of the times he was targeted, the opposing offense completed the pass. That's brutal. His run support was awful very poor. He played 12 games last season and he missed 20% of more of his tackles in a quarter of them.

[buffblue]

1 minute ago, Einstein said:

Do you mean in the playoffs? If so, I agree.

 

But in the regular season, he was borderline awful. 76% of the times he was targeted, the opposing offense completed the pass. That's brutal. His run support was awful very poor. He played 12 games last season and he missed 20% of more of his tackles in a quarter of them.

Yes, as the season wore on he improved

[Paup 1995MVP]

5 minutes ago, dorquemada said:

 

Was a huge Wallace fan going back to Alabama but he was a good example of a system CB that thrived (?) in the type of D the Bills were running

That's a good point.  Because he could not cover Amari Cooper to save his life last night.  

[AuntieEm]

25 minutes ago, Paup 1995MVP said:

That's a good point.  Because he could not cover Amari Cooper to save his life last night.  

I also have a theory on why Elam is bordering on bust even when he shows flashes.  It's similar to the Edmunds underwhelming when his physical stats jump out as elite. 

 

Both are sons of retired players.  Elam also had an uncle in league.  They both saw the toll of injuries their relatives suffered as children.  They will have formed a decision how much they love the game over long term effects on their health.  It probably depends how successful the relatives were as well as there are many 2nd gen nflers who play well. 

 

For some reason the ones we've drafted don't seem to be hungry to earn their place on the team.  At least not when they've been stars up until this point and were catered to its a wake up call for some of these privileged players who didn't claw their way thru college to get a shot at NFL.  So they either put their nose to the groundstone or they wash out of the league.  Edmunds didn't come close to the ceiling his physical stature provides, but that same physical stature also raised his floor higher than typical 1st round talent so he snagged a big payday that I doubt he'll live up to, so he just shifted when he'll wash out of league but having secured a nice little nest egg.  

Edited September 19, 2023 by AuntieEm

[AuntieEm]

3 hours ago, FireChans said:

Lmao yes the Steelers are bursting at the seams with OL talent, didn’t you watch last night?

 

True.  I actually was reconsidering as Spencer Brown shut down Maxx Crosby and if he did lose a rep it never impacted the play where it was a big concern.  Now will he continue?  If Josh continues to take the easy  steady matriculation down the field yes Brown will have done enough.   As the interview they had with watt where he says yes there is holding on every play and that he understands it won't be called every play....   it isn't like Josh and our offense can't convert penalized yardage on a high percentage of penalized downs.  So maybe they give up a higher draft pick than what he'd otherwise fetch.  I didn't watch the game intently  so I don't even know if Pittsburg has m a ny defensive players that we might find use for.   As it is feel our defense is more than capable of maintaining a proper complementary role to the methodical Josh.  Maybe Dorsey needs to implement the methodical process to Josh.  It would mean there is a method to Dorseys madness.  Break a tablet Josh,  if any future failure of other key role players offense or defense fail to do their part.  Rather that than see him gazing with the deer in headlights look.

 

 

[FireChans]

4 minutes ago, AuntieEm said:

 

True.  I actually was reconsidering as Spencer Brown shut down Maxx Crosby and if he did lose a rep it never impacted the play where it was a big concern.  Now will he continue?  If Josh continues to take the easy  steady matriculation down the field yes Brown will have done enough.   As the interview they had with watt where he says yes there is holding on every play and that he understands it won't be called every play....   it isn't like Josh and our offense can't convert penalized yardage on a high percentage of penalized downs.  So maybe they give up a higher draft pick than what he'd otherwise fetch.  I didn't watch the game intently  so I don't even know if Pittsburg has m a ny defensive players that we might find use for.   As it is feel our defense is more than capable of maintaining a proper complementary role to the methodical Josh.  Maybe Dorsey needs to implement the methodical process to Josh.  It would mean there is a method to Dorseys madness.  Break a tablet Josh,  if any future failure of other key role players offense or defense fail to do their part.  Rather that than see him gazing with the deer in headlights look.

 

 

Spencer Brown was aided a lot schematically, and also lucky the Raiders don’t have any other quality defenders.

[AuntieEm]

9 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Spencer Brown was aided a lot schematically, and also lucky the Raiders don’t have any other quality defenders.

That plays a 0art indeed but it is good to see Kromers schemes gelling a bit better than last year.  Helps that the league is allowing some leeway for QB protection leaguewide.  The Aaron Rodgers effect likely will aide in the vision eras refs will have over some ol infractions provided they aren't very blatant or risky to player health.   The bigger shortage is olineman and doesn't seem to be changing soon.

 

 

[Paup 1995MVP]

On 9/19/2023 at 1:36 PM, AuntieEm said:

I also have a theory on why Elam is bordering on bust even when he shows flashes.  It's similar to the Edmunds underwhelming when his physical stats jump out as elite. 

 

Both are sons of retired players.  Elam also had an uncle in league.  They both saw the toll of injuries their relatives suffered as children.  They will have formed a decision how much they love the game over long term effects on their health.  It probably depends how successful the relatives were as well as there are many 2nd gen nflers who play well. 

 

For some reason the ones we've drafted don't seem to be hungry to earn their place on the team.  At least not when they've been stars up until this point and were catered to its a wake up call for some of these privileged players who didn't claw their way thru college to get a shot at NFL.  So they either put their nose to the groundstone or they wash out of the league.  Edmunds didn't come close to the ceiling his physical stature provides, but that same physical stature also raised his floor higher than typical 1st round talent so he snagged a big payday that I doubt he'll live up to, so he just shifted when he'll wash out of league but having secured a nice little nest egg.  

That's an interesting theory about Edmunds.  The Bears have a losing culture.  Did Edmunds do anything positive to make a difference for the Bears in either of their first two games?  He was not a difference maker for the Bills in his 5 years.  But he didn't need to be because he had Milano Poyer Hyde Trey White and some pretty good D lineman around him.  The Bears just looked at his physical stature, and maybe his tackle numbers.  But they obviously did not look at his film.  Because he was not nearly the difference maker he could have been.  And made a lot of tackles 5+ yards downfield.  He plays slow because he has no instincts for the game.

 

That's why the Bears are the Bears.  They pay 18 mill to an average player at a position that is not nearly as important as it used to be.  And the Bills are the Bills because we let that player walk, and are playing a guy at a fraction of the cost who will at least be the player that Edmunds is if not better (Bernard) because he has instincts for the position and works hard.  

[Breakout Squad]

If Elam is a healthy inactive as a 1st round pick, it shows that he has been outplayed by Dane and Christian. Even Cam Lewis although he’s more of a Swiss Army knife out there. I think it would be more disappointing if they played Elam just because of his draft status. 

[Special K]

On 9/19/2023 at 1:03 PM, buffblue said:

I think it's likely we will get burned over the top by Hill or Waddle at some point. But to me that is preferable to sitting back and watching Miami complete 10-15 yard slants at will all game where Tua gets the ball out almost immediately after taking the snap 

 

That's right.......the Bills need to be able to get to Tua........he's always one hit away from a season ending injury, or at least a game ending injury.

[Sestak4ever]

When we play the fish it will be critical for us to build a lead and force Tua to hold the ball longer and take shots downfield. That will allow the defense time to get to him. Need to throw them off their game plan.

[wppete]

Trade him to Chicago for Tremaine Edmunds 😂. Why not? 🤷‍♂️ 

[YattaOkasan]

Honestly considering that Commanders have multiple WR options with speed I wouldnt be surprised to see him to start this game (not sure who gets inactivated though).  I think hes our counter to teams like Miami that have speedsters.

[Alphadawg7]

On 9/19/2023 at 9:58 AM, buffblue said:

Fleezoid is right. Elam actually looked good in real games last year when given the opportunity. You are not going to have a prayer of slowing Miami down playing soft. The ball is coming out too quickly and their receivers are too fast. Incorporating some press coverage, while riskier, offers a better opportunity to get home against Tua by making him hold the ball just a bit longer. We need to be physical off the line against their smaller receivers, something which Elam excels at. I'll take a few holding penalties in exchange for throwing off their timing

 

Everyone is so worried about Miami...in 2 games agasint Tua last year he averaged 201 yards passing against us.  And that was with our secondary banged up with injuries.

[boyst]

11 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Everyone is so worried about Miami...in 2 games agasint Tua last year he averaged 201 yards passing against us.  And that was with our secondary banged up with injuries.

We are very good at stopping the top player for the opposite team. We aren't so good against the rest but historically we shut down the #1. Even Hill against us isn't lighting it up ever.