Stop blaming Josh Allen

[RyanC883]

1 hour ago, Mark92 said:

I am one of the biggest fans and supporters of Josh Allen.  We finally have our Franchise QB who is capable of winning League MVP and bringing us our coveted Super Bowl Championship.  It's also ok to say the man sucked against the Jets.  He really sucked and looked like a damn fool.  He will come out of this because it's what he does.  Go Bills. 

 

he's had this issue since the middle of last season.  It's systemic by this point.  If he doesn't snap out of it soon, Dorsey and/or McD need to go, because ultimately with a talent like JA, the coaching staff needs to figure out how to maximize it.  

[Mr. WEO]

56 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

Agreed. Getting criticized is part of the package deal that also includes incredible wealth and fame. 

 

People take this stuff personally---which is so bizarre.  Do they really think this bothers the leader of a team?  He absolutely knows (they all do) that heat comes after a tough loss.  

 

He's a big boy making lots of money.  These criticisms don't affect him.  Why would posters feel affected?  It's creepy.

[CincyBillsFan]

1 hour ago, Dopey said:

I’ve read plenty of posts calling him a god, a Superman, etc. Not throwing it out there blindly. 
Allen takes more criticism than any other Bill?!? Unless you’re referring to this week, that’s BS. 
Did Allen hand us a golden opportunity? sure. He also laid a big fat egg vs Cincy. last year. 
There were numerous Edmunds bashing threads  and posts here. Of course Allen apologists will gloss over this. 
Diggs gets crap for calling out Josh(deservedly so) and Allen is babied here. He finally gets put in the category of someone who needs to do better and his crew cries fowl. You should follow your leader’s example and place blame where it lies. He did. 

Allen laid the same egg against the Bengals that the entire team laid.  Allen would have had to be at his best to beat Cincy last season and even then I'm not sure the Bills win.  But to me this is a prime example of the type of posts that I'm complaining about.  The notion that Allen lost the Bengals game.  It's wrong IMO.

[Mango]

6 hours ago, Ray Stonada said:

I think it’s because it’s genuinely confusing. The kinds of mistakes Josh makes when he’s in that fog are such total blunders—dropping the snap, then picking it up and immediately running into the line, fumbling it again—almost moronic looking.
 

Allen has more ability, running and passing, but Kelly never had a fumble like that. It’s hard to understand from a guy who is the most talented and confident QB we ever had, but who also descends to a nearly Petermanesque level every so often.

 

 

The Josh Allen ride is such a rollercoaster,, it is addicting. It seems like every year, no matter how high he raises the bar he still has the ability to have these basement games. The constant thread of huge amounts of turnovers and mental gaffes is concerning. 

I get the comparison to Favre. I have even made it. The playing style certainly has a lot of similarities at times. But one thing to take into account is that even with all of that, by the time Favre finished his 6th year with Green Bay (7th in the league) he had won 3x NFL MVP's, 3x AP First Team All-Pro, played in 2x SB's, and won 1. His HoF jacket was sized up before he stepped under center in season 8. Josh has a lot of catch up to do to Brett Favre. 

IMO Allen still has a ceiling of Favre with a couple of championship seasons strung together and maybe an overall floor of Stafford if he never went to Detroit. A good comp might be Eli Manning who had lots and lots of success, but tons of ups and downs. That means Josh is still really good. But there will always be some fan frustration. Unless he puts a hot streak like Favre's together he'll never get the "one bad game" benefit of the doubt like Brady and Manning. It seems as though some fans expect this and that just isn't the way the league has ever worked. 

Edited September 15, 2023 by Mango

[CodeMonkey]

16 hours ago, Bills Bud said:

Fans, players and his own coaches bashing him is not a good look. You are going to drive him out of town. He is the best QB we ever had imo, definitely since Jim Kelly. I blame the coaches, we need an offensive minded head coach. Imagine if Kyle Shannan had Josh Allen, we need a guy like that. That’s the only way we will finally get that Super Bowl, defense doesn’t win championships anymore. McDermott has to go!

FFS, Allen SUCKED. Everyone knows it,  including him.  He is not some little sissy that is going to take his ball and go elsewhere because people state the obvious.  Get over it and move on.

[Mango]

1 hour ago, RyanC883 said:

 

he's had this issue since the middle of last season.  It's systemic by this point.  If he doesn't snap out of it soon, Dorsey and/or McD need to go, because ultimately with a talent like JA, the coaching staff needs to figure out how to maximize it.  

 

I think part of the trigger is fear and a lot of it.  He entered the league this way. His first season and a good portion of his second were full of these bonkers moment. The Houston game is a great example. That was totally absurd. Then we saw this epic leap in 2021, the 13 seconds game, and everything changed. We thought we had THE GUY. Buffalo had arrived. And we have to a certain extent. 

 

 Mahomes is hands down "THE GUY". There is no 1a/1b conversation anymore. You start to have smart QB's like Warner go "Allen is great but decision making can be really bad", but you write it off because of this stretch in 2021. Then you have this very weird second half of the season where the game starts to be such a struggle for him again. There aren't moments anymore, there are halves of games, or a whole game, or a stretch of games.

 

The fan base isn't hating Allen. They don't want to run him out of town. Their criticisms are all valid. The stuff people are seeing are correct. It is erratic and careless at times. The collective "negative" voice around Allen right now is critical, but the emotion behind it isn't "You suck". They mean "Please don't hurt me!". 

[PBF81]

17 hours ago, Bills Bud said:

Fans, players and his own coaches bashing him is not a good look. You are going to drive him out of town. He is the best QB we ever had imo, definitely since Jim Kelly. I blame the coaches, we need an offensive minded head coach. Imagine if Kyle Shannan had Josh Allen, we need a guy like that. That’s the only way we will finally get that Super Bowl, defense doesn’t win championships anymore. McDermott has to go!

 

Here's the thing, everyone always chides others for not being coaches or "experts" otherwise, but this is not complicated and it's mystifying as to why it hasn't been corrected.

 

I mean how difficult is it, Allen's very intelligent.  

 

You sit him down, show him the litany of plays on which he went deep with wide open guys underneath, and on the wings/flats, OTM, etc.;  reiterate to him why a simple 1st-Down is adequate;  explain that there's far less risk on those throws;  and tell him that's how all the greats got great and how you want him to do it, in the best interests of the team.  

 

Either that's been done, or it hasn't. 

 

If it has and he's ignoring it, then that's on him.  He's not so stupid that he doesn't get it.  It's trivial and fundamental.  

 

If it hasn't, then whiskey tango foxtrot.  

 

Before all of this came out, I was prepared to compile a running season long video of all the plays that he did that, which, while not the intent, could have easily served as a coaching tool in that regard.  But I'm no expert in that way, I've never coached college or pro ball.  

 

The point is that it should be far from difficult to correct, it shouldn't require Don Shula or Bill Walsh to correct.

 

My only question is why is this an issue in Allen's 6th season.  That would seem to reflect directly on coaching.   

 

As to the heat he's taking, it'll happen.  He'll be a hero when it doesn't.  But that's not the core issue and it will cost the team in the playoffs when our D goes on vacation.  

 

... which would also implicate coaching for that matter.  

 

 

Edited September 15, 2023 by PBF81

[PBF81]

1 hour ago, RyanC883 said:

 

he's had this issue since the middle of last season.  It's systemic by this point.  If he doesn't snap out of it soon, Dorsey and/or McD need to go, because ultimately with a talent like JA, the coaching staff needs to figure out how to maximize it.  

 

He's had the issue otherwise as well, it did not begin last season. He did it in 2020 to albeit to a lesser extent.  That's when I began contemplating putting together a running montage of it.  It was annoying to watch.  

 

It's beyond mind-boggling that the issue still exists on his watch and in McD's 6th season and Allen's 5th and with two different OCs now.  For any astute observer the reason why should be clear, there's only one commonality in the scenario. 

 

 

Edited September 15, 2023 by PBF81

[BarleyNY]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

People take this stuff personally---which is so bizarre.  Do they really think this bothers the leader of a team?  He absolutely knows (they all do) that heat comes after a tough loss.  

 

He's a big boy making lots of money.  These criticisms don't affect him.  Why would posters feel affected?  It's creepy.

 

Agreed. Most fans project how they’d feel. They don’t understand that players who let fan criticism negatively affect them are quickly out of the league. If Allen doesn’t succeed it won’t be because of anything said by fans on a message board or the media. 

[JohnBonhamRocks]

Not combing through 8 pages so apologies if already posted, but…

 

Anyone else read the title in the “Leave Brittney Alone!” person’s voice?

[BarleyNY]

3 minutes ago, JohnBonhamRocks said:

Not combing through 8 pages so apologies if already posted, but…

 

Anyone else read the title in the “Leave Brittney Alone!” person’s voice?

It was also my first thought when I read the OP. 

[Brand J]

Don’t know if it’s been posted, but Broussard’s take on Allen’s presser after the game was hilarious (3:48). 
 

First Things First

[Max Fischer]

I'm betting this is just a troll, but I'll still say, I'm a huge believer in Josh Allen, but he shares the most blame for the loss.  If he played just OK, the Bills could have won. 

[Toyo321]

17 hours ago, Chaos said:

Game had five awful plays in regulation:
 

1. Int by allen
2. Int by allen
3. fumble by allen
4. 83 yard defensive collapse
5. Bad decision to decline a penalty and concede 3 points to to the Jets

There was also another interception by allen that had the same consequencence as if he had thrown it way, and then we punted.  Didn't really alter the game. 

Despite these five awful plays the team played well enough to tie the game in regulation.  
In a fact based world, Allens regulation performance resulted in a tie.  To reiterate, at the end of regulation the game was tied. This cannot be disputed.  All of the turnovers and other bad plays did not lead to a win.  It also did not lead to a loss. 

The overtime was a complete shitshow, the team choked massively and the team lost the game collectively. 
 

Yeah we were lucky as hell even to get that tie,   Doink!!!!  Off the post and luckily through the uprights.  90% of the time that kick fails to go in.  This is football not hockey. 

Edited September 15, 2023 by Toyo321

[4merper4mer]

6 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

Drive him out of town?  

 

Where do fans appreciate sloppy QB play?  Cleveland is tied up with Watson for years...

At least you have Zappe hour to fall back on.

[zow2]

On The Herd show today, James Jones said Allen's turnover issues cannot be corrected.  This is Josh.  He used his experiences with Brett Favre and described the "gunslinger" mentality as basically meaning "careless with the football".  He said the good outweighs the bad so Josh should be OK but don't expect the turnovers to just dramatically slow down or cease to happen.

Edited September 15, 2023 by zow2

[Toyo321]

 

Maybe we just need a coach that shows some passion and anger when it's deserved and appropriate.

Instead of the clappy...happy....itis syndrome that we get now.

 

[SoonerBillsFan]

34 minutes ago, JayBaller10 said:

Don’t know if it’s been posted, but Broussard’s take on Allen’s presser after the game was hilarious (3:48). 
 

First Things First

Its perfect. Allen acts like he had no control when HE is the one that did it. These were conscious decisions. Look Fans, Media, coaches, hell Peyton Manning are tired of hearing it. Fix it, don't talk about it anymore, just fix it.

6 minutes ago, zow2 said:

On The Herd show today, James Jones said Allen's turnover issues cannot be corrected.  This is Josh.  He used his experiences with Brett Favre and described the "gunslinger" mentality as basically meaning "careless with the football".  He said the good outweighs the bad so Josh should be OK but don't expect the turnovers to just dramatically slow down or cease to happen.

Scorpion and the Turtle (or Frog). He is what he is. He is going to do better than not, but he is going to cost us games, he just can't help himself.  At this point, hell, just implement Mouse Davis' Run and Shoot offense and be done with it.

[Beck Water]

2 hours ago, RyanC883 said:

 

he's had this issue since the middle of last season.  It's systemic by this point.  If he doesn't snap out of it soon, Dorsey and/or McD need to go, because ultimately with a talent like JA, the coaching staff needs to figure out how to maximize it.  

 

I'd like to raise to your attention the Curious Case of Carson Wentz

 

Very promising 1st 2 years in the league.  Team is 11-2 with him his 2nd season, wins Superbowl after he's injured.  Doug Pederson, Frank Reich, John DeFilippo as QB coach. 

 

Loses Reich AND DeFilippo before next season, replaced with Mike Groh and Press Taylor.  Plays well but is injured again next season, signed to a big contract while his backup Nick Foles is shown the door. 

 

Following year, Wentz puts up good numbers and wins Comeback Player of the Year his 4th but...things aren't all well.  Not as many YPG as one might like, team record of 9-7 so not as many wins.  There is chatter about Wentz getting a full of himself, demanding an extended warmup routine and starting to object to criticism.  And there is criticism, for his reckless style of play and passing up quick, short targets in favor of lower percentage riskier throws.

 

Next year, Pederson takes over as OC trying to "right the ship" and Wentz goes to hell in a handcart.  Completion % tanks, Ints soar, YPG plummet.  Eventually, Wentz gets benched for Hurts, Pederson gets fired, and Wentz gets  traded to Indy where he reunites with...Frank Reich but a new OC Marcus Brady.

 

Wentz plays better than the previous year in terms of avoiding INTs, but the passing production is not there (200 ypg) and the Colts barely eke out a winning season.    Again, there is talk of issues with Wentz taking coaching/criticism and maintaining a reckless style of play that cost the Colts games.

 

Following year, Wentz gets shipped off to Washington where he has different coaches (Scott Taylor, Ken Zampese).  Wentz continues his struggles with not enough passing production and reckless play.  Taylor Heineke outplays him, and Wentz is now "footloose and fancy free", out of a job at present.

 

---------------

 

Why am I bringing this up here?  Because when Wentz started to struggle with reckless play and poor passing production (passing up open targets in favor of low percentage, riskier throws, more INT), he got exactly what you suggest Allen needs - new coaches.  Several times.  And it didn't help.

 

----------------

 

The solution to Josh Allen, is between Josh Allen's ears.  If Josh is self-aware (he seems to be) and truly wants to right his ship and turn things around, he can probably do it with whatever coaches are around.  But if he doesn't. new coaches aren't necessarily going to help him.

 

 

 

 

[MJS]

Winning cures everything. If Josh goes out and has a good game and brings home the win, the criticism will reduce. If he strings together a bunch of good games, like we know he can, the criticism will be a distant memory.

 

It's up to him to do that.