Question: as diehard fans, are we on the same page about the team and about Josh ?

[Eastport bills]

Anyone even asking the question about the value of our franchise QB deserves to relive the mediocrity we endured for the 25 years since the last SB appearance.The revolving door of futility at the QB position. The years of being the doormat of the division and celebrating a 500 season. Let those critics feel the shame of watching Josh play great football for the rest of his career, and realize it took one poor performance for them to jump ship. As a long suffering fan, these doubters don’t deserve the success that this guy will bring to the fans.

[oldmanfan]

30 minutes ago, The 9 Isles said:

I might also add he needs to do the little things off the field as well. The QB series on Netflix really showed how much off site work someone like Kirk Cousins puts in.  Mahomes puts in work with specific private training. Clean up his diet can’t wouldn’t either.
 

The leadership aspect of not just being the fun buddy but also calling out people’s when they need it. 
 

He should have his management team scale back the commercials and the appearances so he can perfect his craft at which he is being compensated to the tune of a quarter of a billion dollars. 
 

these are all assumptions on my, maybe he already does all of these things to a certain extent. 
 

With how physically talented he is, if he were to commit more to being the best QB he can be could go down as one of the all time greats.
 

He could also fizzle out just like Cam Newton. 

 

We have no idea how much work he puts in.  Don’t listen to rumors.  Plus you can’t watch TV for more than 30 minutes without seeing a Mahomes commercial.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

I'm losing faith that Josh will be patient with this roster construction. 

 

We don't have the horses to play the way he wants to play. A complete mismatch in styles. 

 

Brady would love this team - a plethora of running backs, two capable Tight Ends, a dominant route-running #1 WR. 

 

Allen wants what the Dolphins have (what QB wouldn't) - but speed demon WRs that get open deep. He wants to uncork - but to who? Harty is 5'6" - he's going to high point and out jump guys down the field? 

 

 

[Airseven]

My outlook hasn’t wavered.

[SoonerBillsFan]

2 hours ago, Italian Bills said:

Usually i take few days before commenting a loss, because i need to elaborate it without let my emotions drive my thoughts. 
 

That said and agreeing with all of your different analysis that can be all correct, i want to ask you this: 

 

do we still believe that the Bills can have a great season, going deep in the playoff, dunno if reaching the SB and that Josh is a top elite QB ? 
 

Or this loss changed your point of view on this judgment ? 

Coming into the season I felt like Shaw, I was feeling good. What I saw Monday night WAS Josh Allen in his truest form and that is a very bad thing. 7th season in the NFL he shouldn't play the way he did, no discipline, selfish, hero ball.  No team can survive that from a guy you tabbed your franchise QB. Can it change...yes. Will it?  I seriously doubt it.   I feel Josh is what he is and its the old Scorpion and the Frog fable, he is what he is and I just don't think he will be able to do enough to win us a superbowl.

Reality is this, we are stuck with him 3 more years with his contract and Pegula just extended McDermott, so nothing is going to change soon.  We just have to keep cheering and supporting the Bills and pray for the best. 

[mjt328]

After 13 seconds, the talk about Sean McDermott has been that although he was responsible for reshaping the locker room, changing the culture and turning us into a legitimate contender... maybe he's just not the leader needed to win us a Lombardi trophy.  And it's a fair question to ask.

 

Nobody wants to say it, because he's easily the most popular player in Buffalo.  But maybe it's time to have that same tough discussion about our star Quarterback as well.

 

Yes, Josh Allen is the main reason this team has been a Super Bowl threat the last 3 seasons.  Without question.  He's a Top 5 quarterback in the NFL.  Without question.  He's on pace for a Hall of Fame career.  Without question.  But as the on-field leader of this football team, does he have the mental capability to win this team a championship?  I'm really starting to wonder.

 

Think about the QBs with all the rings like Tom Brady and Joe Montana.  They were known for being cool, calm and collected in even the highest pressure situations.  Then think about what Allen is like.  Chaotic.  Undisciplined.  Out of control.  Flustered.  Impatient.  Unwilling to trust his teammates.  For all the strides Allen made mechanically to develop himself into a star QB, we haven't seen the same growth from him mentally.  The guy I saw on Monday night was the same guy stupidly lateralling the ball in the Texans playoff game four years ago.

 

[Dan]

2 hours ago, Italian Bills said:

Usually i take few days before commenting a loss, because i need to elaborate it without let my emotions drive my thoughts. 
 

That said and agreeing with all of your different analysis that can be all correct, i want to ask you this: 

 

do we still believe that the Bills can have a great season, going deep in the playoff, dunno if reaching the SB and that Josh is a top elite QB ? 
 

Or this loss changed your point of view on this judgment ? 

I do.  Week 1 does not define the entire season.  

[Ramza86]

- They made a bad decision choosing to pay for defense instead of paying for offense the last 5 years.

- Josh Allen needs to calm the eff down

- Getting real tired of this staff

 

Anything else?

[RyanC883]

2 hours ago, Italian Bills said:

Usually i take few days before commenting a loss, because i need to elaborate it without let my emotions drive my thoughts. 
 

That said and agreeing with all of your different analysis that can be all correct, i want to ask you this: 

 

do we still believe that the Bills can have a great season, going deep in the playoff, dunno if reaching the SB and that Josh is a top elite QB ?   Nope.  We can win games this season, but it's not just Josh causing me concern.  Poyer and Hyde look like the Dolphins WRs will have a field day.  The lack of a running game for us and coherent play calling by Dorsey is an issue.    And finally, sadly, Josh is not an "elite" QB.  Really, there may be only one "elite" QB in the NFL now--Mahomes, but we would have won last night if we had Goff for example.  Josh has been a turnover machine that is also incapable of sliding for the past 17 games--leading the NFL in turnovers.  You can't win big games like this, or even beat a good, but not great team.  
 

Or this loss changed your point of view on this judgment ?  It was not this loss, but looking back at how the Bills played 1/2 of last season and into this season.  We kept hearing this or that would be better, JA was better, Dorsey was better, and after the 1st game, it was all lies.  

 

great questions.  Answers above in bold.  

[HOUSE]

I don't normally post negative links here but there is some truth to this. The guy is not crazy , We are on the same page if you do some reading here.

Don't blame me, just the messenger 

https://www.si.com/nfl/2023/09/12/bills-josh-allen-long-on-ability-but-short-on-football-iq-jets-loss

Edited September 13, 2023 by HOUSE

[RyanC883]

17 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

Coming into the season I felt like Shaw, I was feeling good. What I saw Monday night WAS Josh Allen in his truest form and that is a very bad thing. 7th season in the NFL he shouldn't play the way he did, no discipline, selfish, hero ball.  No team can survive that from a guy you tabbed your franchise QB. Can it change...yes. Will it?  I seriously doubt it.   I feel Josh is what he is and its the old Scorpion and the Frog fable, he is what he is and I just don't think he will be able to do enough to win us a superbowl.

Reality is this, we are stuck with him 3 more years with his contract and Pegula just extended McDermott, so nothing is going to change soon.  We just have to keep cheering and supporting the Bills and pray for the best. 

 

extending McDermitt can be undone by eating the contract.  JA could be traded for a top pick if people wanted to get crazy if JA keeps playing like this and try to draft someone like Williams, Maye, or Nix.  

 

The easiest solution would be to can McD, and get a offensive HC in here and a good OC that can actually teach Josh.  He has all the talent, but none of the training to be an elite QB mentally.  

 

[B-Large]

The irony here is if Josh would settle in and play the short dink and dunk, defenses would have to adapt and probably open up field quite a bit for the big plays... 

 

There is also nothing wrong with running the ball, playing field position, and let the Defense deliver- I mean, that our strong point via McD, right? 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Bills are a great team that faced a great defense with bad Josh Allen.

He will play better. Bills will be fine.

Pass rush looked good. Corners looked good. Oline was spotty but there were signs of better things to come with Torrence. 

Diggs is a star.

Kincaid looks the part of a weapon.

 

McD is still a liability. 

 

Deep playoff run is still my prediction 

[pigpen65]

This was clearly a psychological, stressed out performance. For some reason, he thought he had to create highlight reel, showstopping plays. And when he didn't do it early he went into a gamblers style spiral out of control mode. It's not like this is the first time it's happened. He will be fine. Allen isn't the long term concern. Having somebody around to recognize it and talk him down while its happening is the long time concern. There's a reason they kept bringing Matt Barkley back. Allen needs somebody on the sidelines to talk him down. Dorsey has shown no ability to do it. I don't even know who the QB coach is. Kyle Allen..... who knows. If the plan wasn't to bring in a vet OC, at least they should have a vet Backup QB.

[corta765]

Every year is different and every SB champ has a different path then the next (whether that is BUF or not). Prior history and the current talent on this roster show they at worst should be in the playoff race at best 1 seed. The QB usually is anywhere from good to really great most weeks while averaging 2-3 really bad games a year like Monday so it will be fun with him and should be for another 6-7 years while he is in prime.

 

As bad and frustrating as Monday was, if they are 6-2 heading into CIN you won't care. They also could be 7-6 again after KC and then go on a run like in 2021 and finish 11-6 looking at their best. My point is you really do not know much until season is finished and football is so freaking weird with things year to year and what happens come post season I've given up thinking I know a lot other then the fact teams with good QBs tend to do well consistently and make the playoffs a lot. Buffalo has a good QB and history reflects well that they well at least get another ticket into the dance. What the heck happens from there IDK, I will just enjoy and hope its our turn I guess.

[ALG1130]

4 hours ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

Coming into the season I felt like Shaw, I was feeling good. What I saw Monday night WAS Josh Allen in his truest form and that is a very bad thing. 7th season in the NFL he shouldn't play the way he did, no discipline, selfish, hero ball.  No team can survive that from a guy you tabbed your franchise QB. Can it change...yes. Will it?  I seriously doubt it.   I feel Josh is what he is and its the old Scorpion and the Frog fable, he is what he is and I just don't think he will be able to do enough to win us a superbowl.

Reality is this, we are stuck with him 3 more years with his contract and Pegula just extended McDermott, so nothing is going to change soon.  We just have to keep cheering and supporting the Bills and pray for the best. 

Oh noooo, are we really for certain we are going to be "stuck" with the guy who carries the team on his back(for better or worse) and made The Bills relevant again? Please say it aint so!!!

 

I mean, it would be nice to have a QB who could at least get the team into the playoffs!! Oh wait. Well, the least he could do is get us to an AFCCG, hell, he could do that, and then do everything in his power to ensure a back to back trip to the AFCCG, even if coaching undoes it in 13 seconds. I mean, it would at least be giving the team a chance, but clearly he cannot do that.

 

"But but, he hasn't taken us to a Super Bowl or won us one!!". I know right? The lazy bum. It's such an easy thing to do and all QB's do it.

 

My god, Bills fans are a miserable bunch, aren't they? Let's trade Josh away, go back on the QB carousel and keep missing the playoffs. Now those were the good old days, and quite possibly, what some Bills fans are more comfortable with.

[SoonerBillsFan]

1 minute ago, Aimee75 said:

Oh noooo, are we really for certain we are going to be "stuck" with the guy who carries the team on his back(for better or worse) and made The Bills relevant again? Please say it aint so!!!

 

I mean, it would be nice to have a QB who could at least get the team into the playoffs!! Oh wait. Well, the least he could do is get us to an AFCCG, hell, he could do that, and then do everything in his power to ensure a back to back trip to the AFCCG, even if coaching undoes it in 13 seconds. I mean, it would at least be giving the team a chance, but clearly he cannot do that.

 

"But but, he hasn't taken us to a Super Bowl or won us one!!". I know right? The lazy bum. It's such an easy thing to do and all QB's do it.

 

My god, Bills fans are a miserable bunch, aren't they? Let's trade Josh away, go back on the QB carousel and keep missing the playoffs. Now those were the good old days, and quite possibly, what some Bills fans are more comfortable with.

Yes stuck. If he can't stop being sugar high josh then we aren't going anywhere with him. We succeeded in a very weak AFCE that the last 2 off-season's has gotten much stronger, heck the entire AFC has.  What I don't get is why fans have to be so knee jerk and emotional when the truth and facts are pointed out. Josh since last mid season is becoming a liability vs an asset, he literally was THE reason we lost Monday night and he is getting worse, not better. 

Can he turn it around? I don't know anymore. He keeps TALKING that he is improving, that he knows what he must do, but then pulls a Monday night.  There is a long rest of the season and all of us hope he says "pop" and pulls his head out of his butt and starts acting more mature, calm and consistent on the field.  We will see.

And can we please stop with the hyper emotional "we are going back to the stone ages" stuff if we didn't have josh?  This team is way more talented, and believe it or not better coached then in the drought.  Good lord.

[ALG1130]

18 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

Yes stuck. If he can't stop being sugar high josh then we aren't going anywhere with him. We succeeded in a very weak AFCE that the last 2 off-season's has gotten much stronger, heck the entire AFC has.  What I don't get is why fans have to be so knee jerk and emotional when the truth and facts are pointed out. Josh since last mid season is becoming a liability vs an asset, he literally was THE reason we lost Monday night and he is getting worse, not better. 

Can he turn it around? I don't know anymore. He keeps TALKING that he is improving, that he knows what he must do, but then pulls a Monday night.  There is a long rest of the season and all of us hope he says "pop" and pulls his head out of his butt and starts acting more mature, calm and consistent on the field.  We will see.

And can we please stop with the hyper emotional "we are going back to the stone ages" stuff if we didn't have josh?  This team is way more talented, and believe it or not better coached then in the drought.  Good lord.

This is the same guy who got us to the AFCCG. A year later he was unstoppable in the playoffs. Do you think, if 13 seconds did not happen that we would not have won it all? I think we would have. That loss was not on him. He kept bringing us back from the dead in that game, converted two 4th and longs, to win us the damn game, only to have the defense and coaches ***** the bed.

 

Absolutely not. Without Josh, I don't think this team is going to the playoffs. We have a decent team. I don't think the team as a whole is as good as some people claim it is. I think Josh and Diggs have been carrying the team. We never have a good run game, or OL, and our main, legit weapons are Josh and Diggs, so no, I don't think some mythical new QB is going to come into this team and save it.

 

Monday night or not, Josh and Burrow are regarded as the two QB's fighting for the QB2 spot. Now maybe that changes this year, but we are one game in, and because of a bad game by Josh Monday night, we are talking about how we are "stuck" with him, and will just find something better in the draft? Okay. Sure. Let's throw away the guy that gives us a chance every year and just find someone better. These generational QB's grow on trees. Should be easy enough, and I am CERTAIN this new QB will take us to the promiseland and win the SB for us. No doubt.

 

[Dr.Sack]

We will go only as far as Allen’s level of play. If Josh implodes weekly it will be a very long and painful season. If Allen cuts down his turnovers to 0-1 per game we have a strong chance to defend our AFC East title. 
 

Allen needs to bring his B or A game for us to win. If he brings his C game we have a chance. If he brings his D or F game it’s game over. 

[AuntieEm]

7 hours ago, Italian Bills said:

Usually i take few days before commenting a loss, because i need to elaborate it without let my emotions drive my thoughts. 
 

That said and agreeing with all of your different analysis that can be all correct, i want to ask you this: 

 

do we still believe that the Bills can have a great season, going deep in the playoff, dunno if reaching the SB and that Josh is a top elite QB ? 
 

Or this loss changed your point of view on this judgment ? 

 They can go on a unbeaten streak they are fully capable of doing that.  Will they. Not likely and it isn't even needed to get to the goal of Sb Champs.  I am interested in how the players respond.  Do they become more focused and become a unstoppable machine that makes fewer mistakes going forward or do they wilt and crumble more till the season is truly list.  It can go either way.  I don't expect my Bills to crumble, but if they do it will be what they earned.  No one should be handed an easy ride no matter how likeable or based on potential they have to put in the work and get the job done.