Why Dorsey is not the answer

[Motorin']

Just now, ScottLaw said:

Sorry, but Allen created a lot of those sacks on his own…bailing pockets because he was flustered…. Apparently he still very much needs a veteran guy to reel him in. 

 

And a solid RT. No coincidence his best year was the season that D Williams played his best football at RT. 

 

But yeah, Josh done lost his mind last night.

 

[dave mcbride]

2 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

This. And that is not on Dorsey. Just like it isn’t on McD. Just like it wasn’t in Daboll. I get it we are going to live and die with Josh Allen like all teams do. 
 

but it is also ok to put the blame on him when warranted and not the OC like has been the history of a lot of this fan base with Josh Allen. 

I'm sorry, but there are reasons that teams run the ball on occasion. And they especially run the ball when they have the lead. By my count, the Bills called running plays 27 percent of the time against an EXCELLENT pass defense from front to back. And they had the lead for close to two thirds of the game.

Edited September 12, 2023 by dave mcbride

[Dillenger4]

7 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

Ok so we lost it at the end and HOW is this all on DORSEY?

Because he called a brutal game. Calling runs up the middle with a smurf back like Cook is insane vs a D like the Jets. Then, we put Harris and Murray in for a quick rep and bingo - the run works. But nooo, we go back to Cook and forcefully feed him the ball up the middle.

When things start working Dorsey always calls it the opposite. Hes brutal.

[BillsFan2313]

This game was on Josh. He wasn't seeing open guys all night and made some horrible throws when guys were open. 

[ngbills]

Play action? How many times? Against that D. Clueless. 

[PBF81]

With the lone exception of the FG drive to tie it, we did nothing in the second half.  

 

Or staff routinely gets out-adjusted.  

 

I'll have to rewatch it, but when we're on offense I'm routinely looking to see which receivers Allen ignores in flavor of the deep balls, guys that are wide open.  I was planning on making an ongoing montage video off it this season.  But I didn't see a lot of those yesterday.

 

If anyone has the time stamps for them let me know, I'll include them.  

 

 

[MasterStrategist]

1 minute ago, MAJBobby said:

Yes thought about it. 
 

dorsey had a heck of a game plan for that defense. All Josh needed to do was take the open player. He didn’t. 
 

that is an often thing with him and will get put in the OC. 
 

just like it did with Daboll and now it is with Dorsey. I think people need to start putting a lot of the blame on the shoulders of 17 where it belongs 

I think it's 90% Josh/10% Dorsey right now.

 

Concerns I have with Josh:

1. Not seeing the field as well as he needs to

2. Too ancy/not trusting the OL (OL does need to play better)

3. Mentally seems out of whack/not sure if this is him being too hard on himself. He just needs to be more confident and take what the defense is giving

4. Running: I think he's got to learn it's OK to run, but needs to protect his body/not take unnecessary hits

 

Dorsey:

1. I'm not a fan of lining up in shotgun 99% of the time: it limits running attack primarily

2. Absolutely need more playaction/roll outs

3. Screen game and creativity in general is severely lacking

4. Running game: I'm not a 50/50 advocate, but we do need alot more balance.  Especially helps the dline from just teeing off.  

 

Dorseys tendencies are basically the same issues I had with Daboll.  Daboll was more creative/did adjust 2nd half of 2021 into the playoffs.

 

Again alot of blame on Josh, but he's our entire offense.  Feel like taking a bit off his plate, could be beneficial in alot of ways.  Right now, it just seems like alot of mental stuff-and reverting back to feeling like he has to carry the offense.  Dorsey needs to be find that "balance", because it's not working against top tier defenses.

 

[Iverwig]

I don’t care for Dorsey at all but last night was not in him. He had a couple of head scratchers in play calling but that’s most OC’s. Josh straight sucked and played like a rookie. He made quite a few bad decisions last night and against the Jets defense you can’t have that. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

12 minutes ago, Yobogoya! said:

 

Yeah, but it isn't just his brain that fails him on the short passes. 

 

Josh's touch on short passes has always been, well... basically non existent. Even if we could block for a screen pass worth a game, Josh routinely fails to place the ball in an easy way for the catcher to grab and run. It's a real problem, for an elite defense like the Jets that can take away the long game and apply great pressure there's almost no answer for it. 

Speaking of screens. There was one play they set up a play to Harty which was kind of a handoff pass. The FB motions outside, Harty in the backfield. Allen throws quick to Harty with only the FB leading vs like the entire Jets defense. Obviously the play was blown up.

 

Im not exactly sure what Dorsey was thinking when he drew up that play. No lineman got out in front of Harty to block. All stayed at the line of scrimmage.

 

I think it was on the first FG drive but it stood out to me. It had zero chance of working. BUT I think it was read by Josh Allen to be honest. The WRs didn’t even block. 

Edited September 12, 2023 by Buffalo_Stampede

[LABILLBACKER]

12 minutes ago, zow2 said:

Dorsey's whole plan is "hey Josh, throw a couple quick passes to Harty, Cook and Kincaid...then when things go sideways make chicken salad, 'er lemonade...or whatever that saying is, Okay Josh?"

 

Dorsey stinks.  I expect things to get better vs. anyone but the Jets, but the O needs to look ALOT better this week.  Dorsey needs a bounce back game as much as Josh.

Josh has to grow up and stop being so stupid. You'd think after 5+ years he'd self correct his reckless mistakes. But he's still doing the same ones.

>Throwing into double coverage 

>Not securing the ball

>Not sliding or running OB

>Not taking the short stuff

....yes Dorsey is a problem but last night was Josh being a stubborn teenager. 

[Yobogoya!]

2 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Speaking of screens. There was one play they set up a play to Harty which was kind of a handoff pass. The FB motions outside, Harty in the backfield. Allen throws quick to Harty with only the FB leading vs like the entire Jets defense. Obviously the play was blown up.

 

Im not exactly sure what Dorsey was thinking when he drew up that play. No lineman got out in front of Harty to block. All stayed at the line of scrimmage.

 

I think it was on the first FG drive but it stood out to me. It had zero chance of working. BUT I think it was read by Josh Allen to be honest. The WRs didn’t even block. 

 

Yeah our plays that are designed specifically to get guys into space with room to run never seem to have any space or room to run...

 

It's a bit of a problem. 

[zow2]

1 minute ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Josh has to grow up and stop being so stupid. You'd think after 5+ years he'd self correct his reckless mistakes. But he's still doing the same ones.

>Throwing into double coverage 

>Not securing the ball

>Not sliding or running OB

>Not taking the short stuff

....yes Dorsey is a problem but last night was Josh being a stubborn teenager. 

 

I agree but I've already ripped Josh's performance to pieces in other threads.  This is about Dorsey and he needs to step up his game...coach and scheme 'em up, not just Josh but everyone on O.

[BillsFan2313]

4 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

He had a deer in headlights look the entire night…. Even a weird, awkward grin at times…. Dude looked lost.

 

Exactly. He seems to be fighting some confidence issues dating back to last year. 

[MAJBobby]

25 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Hardly ever running it leads to jailbreaks on pass rushes versus an overmatched o-line. And that's what happened -- 5 sacks and a lot of hits. Of course Allen was terrible too, but the OC didn't help him. 

Not my point; of course he was terrible. But more than one thing was bad last night, and the two things -- OC and QB -- fed each other.

More with the more running stuff. Take the short passes those are your runs. We win that game easily if Josh stays playing inside the script of the offense.

 

instead he decided to press 

[Bangarang]

I can already tell it’s going to be a very frustrating year watching this offense. 
 

Things already look difficult much like last year.

[Scott7975]

18 minutes ago, Drew21PA said:

Weird - because I saw theee times where we were moving the ball consistently and then - boom josh Allen gave it back to the jets?

 

What I saw was it was working a little bit but mostly leaving Josh behind the sticks.  This game is on Josh because ultimately, he had too many turnovers but what you saw was a short game that Josh made up for when that short game left him behind the sticks.  Dorsey sucks too.

[MAJBobby]

23 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

I'm sorry, but there are reasons that teams run the ball on occasion. And they especially run the ball when they have the lead. By my count, the Bills called running plays 27 percent of the time against an EXCELLENT pass defense from front to back. And they had the lead for close to two thirds of the game.

This isn’t the 1970s. The short passes (runs) were called. Josh ignored them 

[Fan in Chicago]

30 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

 

Not my point; of course he was terrible. But more than one thing was bad last night, and the two things -- OC and QB -- fed each other.

Purely my opinion but I think if Dorsey calls too many runing plays by RBs, Allen will simply change the play at the line of scrimmage. He just cannot help running it himself or looking for deep shots. If they aren't there, dont take it! At this point, I am convinced his stubbornness and boneheaded decision making in the moment is holding this team back. 

[Chandler#81]

32 minutes ago, stevestojan said:

We’re still not ready to admit Josh played like ***** again, huh? 

He was abysmal. Played like a scared rookie. Completely unacceptable performance. Someone said he needs to be neutered. He’s like a teenage cat. He needs to be clipped. Josh Peterman

[Brand J]

It’s easy to blame the coordinator when the offense isn’t working, but no coordinator can overcome a QB who’s not reading the field well and doesn’t know where to go with the ball post snap. These are the issues plaguing Allen. We marvel at Mahomes for hitting open receivers and give tons of credit to Andy Reid, but if you swapped QBs and Allen played in KC, the Allen of last night would look just as rough against comparable defenses and all those open players Mahomes routinely hits wouldn’t get targeted. Your QB has to know where to go with the ball. He cannot panic and run into sacks if the pocket is clean. For the Bills to win the Super Bowl Allen has to be the reason, not the liability he was last night. I can remember Mahomes being the sole reason his team lost the game. How many such games does Allen have?