The 3 Kincaid catches- we have another elite weapon on o

[FireChans]

4 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Very good point that I failed to mention. 

I agree. Don't you think they should change his position to WR rather than TE? 

For sure NOT. Call him a TE and you can pay him less when he’s an FA.

[newcam2012]

18 minutes ago, Simon said:

 

No TE on the Bills roster looks anything like Kincaid.

I agree mainly because he's a WR and not a TE. 

[eball]

20 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

I’ll certainly stop bitching so much about the WRs if Kincaid emerges as a great 2nd target for Allen out the gate.

 

Or Davis plays the way he has shown the entire camp.

 

 

Edited August 24, 2023 by eball

[newcam2012]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

For sure NOT. Call him a TE and you can pay him less when he’s an FA.

He better get a solid agent to work the WR angle for a bigger pay day. 

[newcam2012]

Just now, eball said:

 

Or Davis plays the way he has shown the entire camp.

 

 

I would like to see Davis excell. That would really put the offense at another level. 

 

Personally, I think a lot of Davis success will depend on Kincaid and other receivers. If Davis is the true number 2 WR, I'm not super enthusiastic about Davis breaking out.

[FireChans]

5 minutes ago, eball said:

 

Or Davis plays the way he has shown the entire camp.

 

 

WR’s generally don’t wait til year 4 to emerge.

[eball]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

WR’s generally don’t wait til year 4 to emerge.

 

And he didn't.  He was hurt last year.

 

5 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

I think Davis is who he’s always been

 

Yes, I'd eagerly take January 2022 Gabe Davis.

 

[Buffalo716]

27 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He isn't going to be asked to block. If they play Kincaid as a single tight end in 11 I will come back and apologise to you. They will do that very little. He isn't a blocker. The Bills ain't going to use him to block. He will be our leading slot receiver as a rookie.

He's a better and more willing blocker than you give him credit for 

 

Is he gronk? No 

 

But blocking ALL comes down to intensity and desire... He always brings intensity when run blocking which is something to build on and coachable

 

He isn't lax in it ... He has effort 

 

He will be able to run in line in a few years 

 

 

Edited August 24, 2023 by Buffalo716

[Airseven]

5 minutes ago, FireChans said:

WR’s generally don’t wait til year 4 to emerge.

And the one area he showed promise was the tough (sideline) catches which went out the window last season. 
 

That being said, and against my better judgment, I think he’ll have a decent season.

[Einstein's Dog]

6 minutes ago, FireChans said:

For sure NOT. Call him a TE and you can pay him less when he’s an FA.

Also, you have him work on his blocking.  It's not like he can't get better.   That's what they did the first preseason game.

 

And when teams start putting in a DB when Kincaid is  out there, then his assignment could be to handle a DB 60 pounds lighter than him.   That kind of blocking assignment/mismatch can really help the appearance of someones blocking skills.

[NewEra]

1 hour ago, ngbills said:

I could have made those plays. So yes any TE on the Bills roster could have as well. It is nothing against the guy just that these are normal plays. Just watch any of the 3 guys highlights and you will see plenty of catches that show they are capable of beating a LB for a quick slant. 

 

Dawson Knox

Quentin Morris

Jace Sternberger 

 

Like @HappyDays said, if you don’t see a special skill set, that’s on you.  

[Shaw66]

1 hour ago, NewEra said:

https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/10073149-dalton-kincaid-nfl-draft-2023-scouting-report-for-buffalo-bills-te.amp.html

https://draftwire.usatoday.com/lists/2023-nfl-draft-dalton-kincaid-scouting-report/

https://www.syracuse.com/buffalo-bills/2023/04/5-thoughts-and-a-grade-on-buffalo-bills-drafting-utah-tight-end-dalton-kincaid.html?outputType=amp

 

https://athlonsports.com/nfl/2023-nfl-draft-profile-dalton-kincaid

https://sports.yahoo.com/why-utah-tight-end-first-045409121.html

 

yes….. many consider Kincaid to. be “smooth”.  I could link another 10 pages but you get the point. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here's what those links say: 

 

The first says this:  Smooth, efficient route-runner on routes that allow him to pick up speed and stride into space.

 

The second says this:  Kincaid is smooth as a route runner, gliding in and out of route breaks before hitting his second gear in an instant after the ball hits his hands. 

 

The third says this:  Kincaid is explosive in his release and is a smooth/fluid route runner. 

 

The fourth says this:  Smooth, nuanced route runner 

 

So, notice in every one of these quotes, "smooth" is an adjective that either is superfluous because there is another adjective or describes how he looks.   Read each one leaving out the word smooth and you get the same information about 

 

The first: smooth is how he looks.  Leave it out, and it says he is an efficient route runner, which is what matters. 

 

The second:    Smooth describes how he looks, gliding and out of breaks.  Leave it out, and it say he hits his second gear an instant after the ball hits, which is what matters.  

 

The third, smooth and fluid describe how he looks.  Leave it out and what it says is that he's explosive in his release, which is what matters.

 

The fourth, smooth again is how he looks.  Leaved it out and it says he's a nuanced route runner, which is what matters.  

 

I'm telling you, smooth is just a word that describes how he looks.   There is no smoothness index, no smoothness stat.   Some of the best receivers are smooth, some of the worst receivers are smooth.  The fact that he's smooth doesn't make him good.     

[NewEra]

1 hour ago, Shaw66 said:

Maybe.   But what I'm reacting to is that many, many posters here who are excited about Kincaid say they're excited because he's smooth.  As I said, what matters are things you mentioned.  Hands, speed, intelligence, route running.   There are plenty of excellent receivers who have those things whom I wouldn't describe as smooth.  Like Deebo Samuel.  I wouldn't describe him as smooth, and it doesn't matter all.  George Kittle isn't smooth.  

 

I just don't see how being smooth is what's going to make Kincaid a success.  I think a receiver who is smooth is fun to watch; there's some kind of elegance to the efficiency of his movement.   But as I suggested, Shakir is smooth, but it isn't getting him into the starting lineup.  

You're right about this.   On those replays, he's more fluid than Davis would have been, and clearly a different animal from any tight end on the roster.  

This really is a strange hill to defend.  It seems as if you’re agitated because fans (and scouts) are excited about Kincaid because he has extremely fluid movement skills. That’s what smooth is.  We aren’t ONLY excited about how smooth he is, but it stands out as one of his best attributes
 

As you mentioned, route running matters.   Why wouldn’t you think that being and extremely fluid athlete wouldn’t have an impact on one’s route running?  

 

 

44 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Very good point that I failed to mention. 

I agree. Don't you think they should change his position to WR rather than TE? 

Why would they voluntarily give him a (future). 10M pay raise…… for no reason for that.  It’s a title.  That’s all.

 

answer this:  how would they benefit in changing his position to WR?

41 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

I agree mainly because he's a WR and not a TE. 

No.  He IS a tight end. 

[Shaw66]

1 minute ago, NewEra said:

  Why wouldn’t you think that being and extremely fluid athlete wouldn’t have an impact on one’s route running?  

 

 

Fluid athletes can be lousy route runners.  They can round off their cuts, for example. 

 

Most good route runners are not described as smooth.   His route running happens to be smooth.   Great.  He's pretty to watch.   Smoothness is descriptive of how he looks, not a physical behavior that is essential to athleticism, like quickness, speed, vertical leap, agility, etc., etc.   All it says is he's a pleasure to watch, because we find smoothness in motion attractive.  We like gliding.  We like how figure skaters flow through their routines.  Smoothness is pretty.   It is a characteristic of some good football players, but isn't a characteristic to being a good football players. 

 

If smoothness were so important, the combine would test for it.  

[AuntieEm]

22 hours ago, HardyBoy said:

 

I don't think so, the first one the tackler in the front takes out his legs at the thigh, the other two are different. Also looks like the first he is tackled on the logo, so around midfield, second starts around the 20.

 

Crazy how similar all three look, he's so smooth and consistent in his movements, it's pretty wild.

 

Edit: actually I think the second and third shot are the same catch, but the first one is different!

 

  Yes  and on the second/third video like how he is aware he's getting tackled he is proactively sort of tumbling to the ground as the player behind him grabs him.  Instead of fighting and exposing himself to a big hit by the player coming at him from the front.  He kinda tucks into a roll so he able to absorb the hit easier.  

[GunnerBill]

57 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

 

I agree. Don't you think they should change his position to WR rather than TE? 

 

I don't think it matters.

[GunnerBill]

42 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

He's a better and more willing blocker than you give him credit for 

 

Is he gronk? No 

 

But blocking ALL comes down to intensity and desire... He always brings intensity when run blocking which is something to build on and coachable

 

He isn't lax in it ... He has effort 

 

He will be able to run in line in a few years 

 

 

Yea. Maybe in 2 years. Maybe. Right now he isn't better than I give him credit for. His blocking sucks. He isn't a lost cause as a blocker, cos I agree he seems willing. But right now he sucks.

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea. Maybe in 2 years. Maybe. Right now he isn't better than I give him credit for. His blocking sucks. He isn't a lost cause as a blocker, cos I agree he seems willing. But right now he sucks.

 

Why do you hate Kincaid?

[Buffalo716]

21 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea. Maybe in 2 years. Maybe. Right now he isn't better than I give him credit for. His blocking sucks. He isn't a lost cause as a blocker, cos I agree he seems willing. But right now he sucks.

Sucks is way too strong of a word... I traveled to Utah to watch him play and he certainly wasn't as bad as you make it out

 

He is a willing blocker, with good aggressiveness... That alone makes it modest..  blocking is all effort 

 

He's not afraid of contact, and it's something that's easily improvable

 

He wasn't even the worst blocking tight end drafted... Not close 

 

So I can't say he sucks because that's way too harsh.. he's going to be blocking this year in some sets 

 

He has modest potential and he tries hard

 

He won't be moving people but he can keep a hat on them and he's good in space 

 

Every single scout that saw him live came away with a better impression of his blocking skills then before because he has effort 

Edited August 24, 2023 by Buffalo716

[ngbills]

1 hour ago, NewEra said:

Like @HappyDays said, if you don’t see a special skill set, that’s on you.  

Like I said, I have seen plenty of guys catch that pass. I have seen high school kids make that play that are not good enough to play college ball. I have seen college players that are never drafted. I have seen plenty of NFL players do it. Showing his preseason catches is cool and all but I dont walk away saying wow I have never seen that kind of skill. Go watch his game against USC or just his season highlights and you get a better picture of his talent. That is all I am saying.