Any Breakout Stars This Year?

[machine gun kelly]

5 hours ago, Beast said:

I don’t see him making the roster. He needs to show something big in the return game to have a chance.

 

The Bills appear to have real good depth at WR.

I can see Isabella possibly making it as a returner, and Shakir may get relegated to the PS.

[Buffalo716]

14 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

I can see Isabella possibly making it as a returner, and Shakir may get relegated to the PS.

I've said this in a bunch of other threads but Isabella is not a "viable" return option..  if he is trotted out there it will be desperation 

 

If he makes the team it's because he can stretch the field vertically with JA17

 

He has like 10 total kick and punt returns in 4 years of college... at UMASS..  He's not a return Man

 

He's a guy who you can throw back there in practice to "shag" punts ... But he's not gonna be doing it in game time ..  because he didn't even at UMASS

 

They will have Micah hyde shagging punts before him in regular season games 

 

 

[BuffaloBillyG]

1 hour ago, NoSaint said:

a guy earning the fourth safety spot isn’t a breakout star. 

Hence what I said "if pressed into snaps"

 

Let's face it. Both Poyer and Hyde are on the wrong side of 30 and each coming off injury plagued seasons. Rapp will have a role outside of just the Safety position. There is a very solid chance Hamlin or whoever is the 4th safety is will see a chunk of playtime this year. 

[mrags]

1 hour ago, machine gun kelly said:

I can see Isabella possibly making it as a returner, and Shakir may get relegated to the PS.

This. Isabella is exactly everything they were looking for last year. Quick. Speedy. Run after the catch. So far he’s looked pretty good. 
 

Shakir on the other hand has not looked good. And has dropped quite a few balls between the game today, and the 3 practices I’ve been to this off-season. 

[Charles Romes]

7 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

He's Not a returner...

 

Just because the bills have them back there shagging punts and kickoffs doesn't mean he has any viable chance of doing it... You need bodies catching them in camp

 

The dude has like 10 total kick and punt returns in college.. in 4 years... He's not a return Man

 

If he's Making the team it's because his wide receiver skills

Isabella’s path to carving out an NFL career is becoming a returner 

[mrags]

1 minute ago, Charles Romes said:

Isabella’s path to carving out an NFL career is becoming a returner 

Not for nothing. He looked like a pretty good slot guy today 

[Buffalo716]

Just now, Charles Romes said:

Isabella’s path to carving out an NFL career is becoming a returner 

That's easy to type on the internet ... With guys who have played football for 20 years at a high level ? And he has 10 returns total in his college career ?

 

He's not a returner ... And Arizona didn't draft him in the 2nd round to be a returner ... It's because he could stretch the field in a vertical offense

 

His return game is lagging 

Just now, mrags said:

Not for nothing. He looked like a pretty good slot guy today 

He's a better receiver than returner 

[Saxum]

1 hour ago, NoSaint said:

a guy earning the fourth safety spot isn’t a breakout star. 

 

Breakout star on publicity.

[machine gun kelly]

1 minute ago, mrags said:

This. Isabella is exactly everything they were looking for last year. Quick. Speedy. Run after the catch. So far he’s looked pretty good. 
 

Shakir on the other hand has not looked good. And has dropped quite a few balls between the game today, and the 3 practices I’ve been to this off-season. 

Agreed.  Heck it’s one preseason game, but it seems they are serious about Sherfield and Harry, and you know Davis and Diggs are locked in as 1 and 2.  Isabella has a chance with that speed, and then a fight for the 6th slot.  There is also the possibility they slot Gilliam as the 4th RB.  It sounds like they are going to have DK and DK2, Morris has looked sharp and is athletic.  The choice then becomes another WR or another TE.  We’ll see.  Trust McBeane.  They’ll make the right call.

 

Think of it this way, if they trusted Shakir that much, why did they get Brown and Beasely off the couch at the end of the year?  Shakir is on shaky ground and he wasn’t a high draft pick.  A mid round 5th pick is not going to be a lock each year.  Sometimes you hit gold like Milano and Diggs, and sometimes you get crapps.

[Saxum]

18 minutes ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Hence what I said "if pressed into snaps"

 

Let's face it. Both Poyer and Hyde are on the wrong side of 30 and each coming off injury plagued seasons. Rapp will have a role outside of just the Safety position. There is a very solid chance Hamlin or whoever is the 4th safety is will see a chunk of playtime this year. 

 

Hyde and Damar had equally injury plagued seasons.  They were injured and did not return for rest of season.   

Poyer could have been put on IR but clearly did not want to be even making the effort to be driven to away game since he had no clearance to fly.

[mrags]

2 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

Agreed.  Heck it’s one preseason game, but it seems they are serious about Sherfield and Harry, and you know Davis and Diggs are locked in as 1 and 2.  Isabella has a chance with that speed, and then a fight for the 6th slot.  There is also the possibility they slot Gilliam as the 4th RB.  It sounds like they are going to have DK and DK2, Morris has looked sharp and is athletic.  The choice then becomes another WR or another TE.  We’ll see.  Trust McBeane.  They’ll make the right call.

 

Think of it this way, if they trusted Shakir that much, why did they get Brown and Beasely off the couch at the end of the year?  Shakir is on shaky ground and he wasn’t a high draft pick.  A mid round 5th pick is not going to be a lock each year.  Sometimes you hit gold like Milano and Diggs, and sometimes you get crapps.

4 locks imo:

Diggs 

Davis

Harty

Sherfield 

 

Fighting for the last 2, maybe even 3 spots:

Shakir

Isabella

Shorter

Patmon

Atemon

 

imo I think Shakir will make the team just because they will feel like fools if they cut him or send him to the PS. I know you can’t think that way, but I think he makes it based off that. Who the last guy or 2 will be is up in the air. Could likely store Patmon, Atemon, and Shorter on the PS. I think Isabella is the best bet. Unless someone really breaks out the next 2 preseason games. 

[Saxum]

4 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

Think of it this way, if they trusted Shakir that much, why did they get Brown and Beasely off the couch at the end of the year?  Shakir is on shaky ground and he wasn’t a high draft pick.  A mid round 5th pick is not going to be a lock each year.  Sometimes you hit gold like Milano and Diggs, and sometimes you get crapps.

 

I think if Shakir is put on practice squad some team will sign him to their 53 even if he is inactive.

Staff will believe they can correct problems and he has been shown he has potential.

 

Shakir needs to put in extra time outside facility. 

Eric Moulds needs to get access to game tape and help Shakir correct his problems.

[NickelCity]

I liked what I saw from Andy in the slot. As mentioned above, he's not a returner. If he keeps playing well - and we keep 6 WRs - I think he has a shot. 

Edited August 13, 2023 by NickelCity

[Doc Brown]

25 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

That's easy to type on the internet ... With guys who have played football for 20 years at a high level ? And he has 10 returns total in his college career ?

 

He's not a returner ... And Arizona didn't draft him in the 2nd round to be a returner ... It's because he could stretch the field in a vertical offense

He has 32 total in college so it's not completely foreign too him.  He may have realized it's his only way onto a roster whether it's this one or another one.

Edited August 13, 2023 by Doc Brown

[machine gun kelly]

If you listen to Movin the Chains training camp tour, Pat and Jim interviewed among others Hyde.  Hyde made a point to let them know he remained in the stadium, not going back to San Diego.  He said had the Bills won he would’ve played in the AFCCG.  He was already cleared to play and shortened his rehab down from 6 to 4 months by staying with our trainers in the facilities.  
 

Laslty, he made a point to tell the guys he’s never had a season shortened in his sports career from HS, College, and the pros.  I remember before last year he and Poyer had played the 5 years prior with the Bills at around 94% of the snaps from 2017-21.

 

To say Hyde or Poyer are injury prone makes about as much sense that Milano was injury prone vs. just he had a couple of bad breaks.  He also made 1st team all pro, and in 2021 both Hyde and Poyer made 1st and 2nd team all pros.  If anyone gets some playing time, it will most likely be Rapp.  Rapp can fill in at Safety, but he also can sub in for Taron when we are playing a TE heavy and run heavy teams.  He’s perfect for that role, and that doesn’t take anything away from Taron’s success.  He’s built more for the pass happy WR teams who are heavy in 11.  This will be one of the best secondary units we’ve had and that’s saying something that for 5 years has been a top 5 pass defense.

[Buffalo716]

6 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

He has 31 total in college so it's not completely foreign too him.  He may have realized it's his only way onto a roster whether it's this one or another one.

23 kick returns and 9 punt returns in 4 years is not a good track record 

 

Punt return is out of question.. you can't trot a dude back there with that limited experience in the NFL .. that's a muff waiting to happen 

 

Mckelvin was one one of the best in the world and had problems holding onto it

 

At best he's a emergency KR... It's not a learned skill... You either have it or don't back there ... It's not an effort position like gunner 

 

It's super dangerous 

Edited August 13, 2023 by Buffalo716

[Doc Brown]

Just now, Buffalo716 said:

23 kick returns and 9 punt returns in 4 years is not a good track record 

 

Punt return is out of question.. you can't trot a dude back there with that limited experience in the NFL .. that's a muff waiting to happen 

 

Mckelvin was one one of the best in the world and had problems holding onto it

 

At best he's a emergency KR... It's not a learned skill... You either have it or don't back there 

 

It's super dangerous 

I agree but you said 10 in multiple posts.  He also has nine in the pros.

[Sierra Foothills]

The Bills stated that they wanted to get bigger at WR.

 

They also stated that they wanted to get faster.

 

The thing that possibly works in favor of Isabella making the final 53 (in addition to another small, speed guy in Harty) is that Kincaid counts as a big receiver.

 

When you add Kincaid to Davis and Sherfield, the Bills probably have enough big targets on game day.

 

This may be a factor in Isabella making the final 53 ahead of size guys like Shorter, Shaver, Johnson, Atemon, and Patmon.

 

Also, we're talking about a former 2nd rounder against a bunch of guys with not as much pedigree. A lot of teams loved Isabella coming out. It's not like he's JAG.

 

 

Finally, Harty has a history of injuries.

 

It might be wise to have 2 small, really fast guys who are interchangeable.

 

 

[Buffalo716]

8 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

I agree but you said 10 in multiple posts.  He also has nine in the pros.

Well to be fair i haven't checked in a while ..  I was literally going off my head and my college scouting report and I knew it wasn't a prolific number .. so i said literally like 10

 

Under 10 punt returns in his career tho

 

And not the greatest college average,  with 0 house calls... I would just be nervous if he was taking punts 

Edited August 13, 2023 by Buffalo716

[Doc Brown]

5 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Well to be fair i haven't checked in a while ..  I was literally going off my head and my college scouting report and I knew it wasn't a prolific number .. so i said literally like 10

 

Under 10 punt returns was correct 

They put Shakir in last year and he only had 31 total in college so I wouldn't completely rule it out if Isabella doesn't muff any in the games or practice.