Pokebball Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 (edited) On 8/19/2023 at 2:42 PM, SectionC3 said: That’s sort of my point. Populists are their own thing. They aren’t really D or R now. Should have their own branding, too, for their own benefit. Probably would do well in a lot of elections, especially if they cut out the conspiracy theory nonsense. And yet, here we are with our 2 party system. I think you're comparing the theme of the song to, what, a classical definition of an R? We haven't had that for a very long time, really? Nor have we had a classical definition of a D, or a liberal. The folks that might still be true to these classical definitions are certainly in that party, but they really aren't representative of the overall themes or policies of that party. There is s no such thing as purity, in that sense, any longer. People and the world is much more complicated than that. Personally, I embrace positions in both parties; I think both parties are both wrong on certain issues; and I think both parties are probably both right on certain issues. I believe, more and more everyday, that my most significant issues with our current system is between the DC elite and us common folks. The elite do a whole lot of yelling, kicking and screaming at each other, yet when push comes to shove, they do what keeps us common folks under their collective control. Edited August 21, 2023 by Pokebball
Joe Ferguson forever Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 5 minutes ago, BillStime said: Rich men up north Yes, but somehow the trumps and koch's are immune from the label "elites". 1
cle23 Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 On 8/11/2023 at 10:50 AM, SCBills said: Amazing song. And while I don’t support him in the primary, if people want to know why Trump has such a die hard following… it’s because I guarantee you that song speaks to his followers more than anyone. People who, rightly or wrongly, perceive this country as moving to a place where they are low man on the totem pole, barely getting by, as their government tells them to go **** themselves. I like the song, and the message overall. What I don't understand is how anyone who supports Trump could think this relates to Trump as all? The dude has been mega rich his entire life, even well before his "self made" billions. The song is as much about Trump as it is Biden or any other politician in DC. The message of the song is true, and the guy has talent for sure. But to immediately associate it with Trump supporters makes little sense. The current country was created by people just like Trump, and just like all the other politicians in DC. And everyone, not just Trump supporters, is feeling the effects of 50+ years of garage politics. 1 1
Joe Ferguson forever Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 4 minutes ago, cle23 said: I like the song, and the message overall. What I don't understand is how anyone who supports Trump could think this relates to Trump as all? The dude has been mega rich his entire life, even well before his "self made" billions. The song is as much about Trump as it is Biden or any other politician in DC. The message of the song is true, and the guy has talent for sure. But to immediately associate it with Trump supporters makes little sense. The current country was created by people just like Trump, and just like all the other politicians in DC. And everyone, not just Trump supporters, is feeling the effects of 50+ years of garage politics. True, but the people buying this recording are largely trumpers. That's why it is associated with him. As to the rest: Campaign finance and election reform. That's what we should all be fighting for but are so easily distracted.
Pokebball Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 9 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson forever said: Yes, but somehow the trumps and koch's are immune from the label "elites". You think? They're not in my opinion
Joe Ferguson forever Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 (edited) 1 minute ago, Pokebball said: You think? They're not in my opinion Ok then. How bout tucker carlson? Edited August 21, 2023 by Joe Ferguson forever
BillsFanNC Posted August 21, 2023 Author Posted August 21, 2023 Trump is most definitely an elite. He is most definitely NOT a Washington elite north of Richmond. He isn't in their club. See multiple idictments criminalizing political apeech. 3
The Frankish Reich Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, BillsFanNC said: He is most definitely NOT a Washington elite north of Richmond. Oh really? https://www.wsj.com/world/middle-east/jared-kushners-deal-making-career-off-to-sluggish-start-d245fea8 Jared Kushner set up last year at Tel Aviv’s Hilton Hotel overlooking the Mediterranean Sea, aiming to spend some of the $3 billion that Gulf nations had pledged for him to invest. For five days, Kushner and his team at Affinity Partners listened to pitches from promising Israeli companies hoping to secure funding from the former White House senior adviser, who is also former President Donald Trump’s son-in-law. Kushner had raised the money from Saudi, Emirati and Qatari investors, after presenting himself as a unique business leader able to bridge the region’s economic and cultural divides. To that end, he had secured unique approval from Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman to invest the kingdom’s money in the Jewish nation for the first time. Kushner left Tel Aviv last spring without writing any checks. *** Kushner’s post-White House work has drawn scrutiny from some in Congress who question whether the business arrangement is a Saudi reward for all the work Kushner did in government to advance the kingdom’s interests in Washington. The Trump Tower is also North of Richmond. But Oliver may want to take a southward look too, toward Palm Beach. 1
cle23 Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 12 minutes ago, BillsFanNC said: Trump is most definitely an elite. He is most definitely NOT a Washington elite north of Richmond. He isn't in their club. See multiple idictments criminalizing political apeech. Trump chanted for years to "Lock her up." He is all on board with the Biden "corruption." He would is trying to push the same narrative on his opponents that he complains about happening to himself. And just to clarify, anyone committing crime, fraud, tax evasion, corruption, etc. should be tried and convicted if the evidence is shown, regardless of party. 1
Pokebball Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 22 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson forever said: Ok then. How bout tucker carlson? Tucker feeds off of the dynamic.
Joe Ferguson forever Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Pokebball said: Tucker feeds off of the dynamic. what dynamic? That he's an elite who is capitalizing on stupidity? Pretty common occurrence among R leaders. Edited August 21, 2023 by Joe Ferguson forever 1
BillStime Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 20 minutes ago, BillsFanNC said: Trump is most definitely an elite. He is most definitely NOT a Washington elite north of Richmond. He isn't in their club. See multiple idictments criminalizing political apeech. 👆🤡🤣 JFC - Look at these idiots turn themselves into pretzels trying to convince THEMSLVES that Conald is not an elite north of Richmond - lmao Remember when Trump told us the White House was a dump? And you freaks cheer him on. LINK: https://golf.com/lifestyle/celebrities/first-golfer-donald-trumps-relationship-with-golf-has-never-been-more-complicated/ GTFOH - TDS is strong with these nutters. 1
Pokebball Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 Just now, Joe Ferguson forever said: what dynamic? That he's an elite who is capitalizing on stupidity? The dynamic between the elite and the non elite
BillStime Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 31 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson forever said: Ok then. How bout tucker carlson? Notice how these insecure freaks all need a superhero because the one they have isn't exactly super?
Joe Ferguson forever Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 1 minute ago, Pokebball said: The dynamic between the elite and the non elite So ole tuck is not an elite? He still wears a club tie but I think he ditched the bowtie...Still into fly fishing. Who knows if his kids are in equestrian events. 1
Pokebball Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 Just now, Joe Ferguson forever said: So ole tuck is not an elite? He still wears a club tie but I think he ditched the bowtie...Still into fly fishing. Who knows if his kids are in equestrian events. He needs the elite to make his living. Without the elite, he wouldn't have a gig.
BillStime Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 5 minutes ago, Pokebball said: He needs the elite to make his living. Without the elite, he wouldn't have a gig. Exactly - millionaires for billionaires. 1
The Frankish Reich Posted August 21, 2023 Posted August 21, 2023 Let's get away from the name calling. What could we, as a country, have done to help Oliver Anthony succeed in life? - Education. He dropped out of school at 17. Why? Were the schools bad? Was he unmotivated? Not terribly bright? All of the above? - Job Training. He says he wanted to be a cattle rancher. That's like me wanting to be a MLB player when I was a kid. I don't know of any job training we could have for that. He could've moved to a ranch out west and started to learn the trade from the bottom up. He didn't. He stayed in Virginia and NC working at a dead-end factory job. - That factory job: I don't disagree with him here. This is the source of a lot of frustration in the country. My old Buffalo relatives had factory jobs. They were hard. They sometimes got injured. But they bought homes with money from those jobs and entered the solid middle class. That doesn't seem possible today. I see the lefty songwriter Billy Bragg says the best thing to do is organize a union. And yes, that was a difference between then and now. My old relatives were unionized. But there also wasn't the constant threat of moving the factory overseas. Protectionism + unions? Do we want to go back to that? I don't since it seems kind of stopgap/temporary. And I doubt young Oliver would've been happy even if he'd been making a living wage in a soul destroying job. The one thing I know: welfare payments to someone else weren't the cause of his plight. That's envy, not a cause. Maybe he wanted welfare payments too. Why should anyone get them if they're able bodied and can work for a living? I understand the frustration, but frustration at someone else who's better at gaming the system isn't a cure for your pain. So ... what would all the Oliver Anthony's do if they replaced those Rich Men North of Richmond? 1
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