Who else is in the let’s get Gabe Davis signed to an extension camp?

[whorlnut]

8 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

SF, Miami, Philadelphia, Cinci and Seattle all clearly have two dynamic WR1 talents as their second receiver.   That's 5 indisputable examples not 3.  There are a bunch of other teams that have have two WR1 talents when both are healthy or if the QB play is even adequate.   Some of them even have WR3's that could be fringe WR1's like Cinci with Boyd and Seattle with JSN.  

 

The Bills are not one of these teams.   They have a very clear WR1 and a big drop-off to Gabe as a WR3 talent with clear limitations.

 

So to imply that it's "unrealistic" to have a WR1 level talent opposite your primary target is not so.........it's closer to a 25% scenario than "unrealistic" and most of the teams that have such setups are SB contenders.  

 

Why you choose to look like a fool on hills like this and those of Star Lotulelei and Tremaine Edmunds etc.. is a curiosity.

Yeah I don’t get it either. Acting as if having another top 1B type of receiver is inconceivable is beyond me.

[Einstein's Dog]

I've seen enough.  The inconsistency is still there.  This is not an injury thing.   We have one of the top 30 yard laser throwing QBs ever, all in a mobile 6'4" sturdy frame.  You do not scrimp on getting two premier downfield WRs.

 

I do not want to wait another season.  This team with a M Evans or C Kupp is back to talking about the Superbowl.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

2 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I've seen enough.  The inconsistency is still there.  This is not an injury thing.   We have one of the top 30 yard laser throwing QBs ever, all in a mobile 6'4" sturdy frame.  You do not scrimp on getting two premier downfield WRs.

 

I do not want to wait another season.  This team with a M Evans or C Kupp is back to talking about the Superbowl.

Not sure the team can do it with the salary cap, as 2024 is already projected to be the same amount over as 2023 was. 

But the debate that was going last year about the Bills lack of speed and lack of talent level, is still valid. 

Dalton Kincaid, Sherfield, Harty, Shorter didn't take those concerns away.

To overcome the basic nature of Dorsey's offense, this team needs a better #2 WR (really another high end #1) to get over the hump. 

 

This is what I've said forever when WGR equates the Bills and Chiefs on the same level justified by betting odds and lines. We're not the same. Mahomes is better than Allen, so he can do things with a collection of JAGS at WR that Allen simply can't. Overcome that gap with an emphasis on talent. 

 

The 2023 Draft was a step in that direction with Kincaid and Torrence. 

 

But a big reason this team has plateaued is we added Diggs in 2020 and then stopped. 

 

 

 

 

[NoSaint]

22 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

SF, Miami, Philadelphia, Cinci and Seattle all clearly have two dynamic WR1 talents as their second receiver.   That's 5 indisputable examples not 3.  There are a bunch of other teams that have have two WR1 talents when both are healthy or if the QB play is even adequate.   Some of them even have WR3's that could be fringe WR1's like Cinci with Boyd and Seattle with JSN.  

 

The Bills are not one of these teams.   They have a very clear WR1 and a big drop-off to Gabe as a WR3 talent with clear limitations.

 

So to imply that it's "unrealistic" to have a WR1 level talent opposite your primary target is not so.........it's closer to a 25% scenario than "unrealistic" and most of the teams that have such setups are SB contenders.  

 

Why you choose to look like a fool on hills like this and those of Star Lotulelei and Tremaine Edmunds etc.. is a curiosity.

And we may soon see Jordan Addison in Minnesota join those ranks 

 

the lions have invested in creating that dynamic. 
 

tampa has been that type of team 

 

Heck, if not for Russ, sutton/jeudy could be an interesting pair as having a high end WR2. It hasn’t worked out but it’s certainly the plan. 

[thenorthremembers]

Gabe Davis has very close numbers to Mike Williams for the Chargers.  Ask yourself would you pay 14 million dollars a year to have Mike Williams?  Think 50 receptions, 900 yards, and 8 touchdowns a year.  Personally feel like you could get the same output for a lot less money.   

[NoSaint]

34 minutes ago, JaCrispy said:

If true, this would tell me the Bills aren’t serious about improving their offense like the Dolphins are…They will always be limited so long as Davis is the #2…And with Diggs getting older and slower, the Bills are simply going to need more speed…

 

Just look at what Cook’s speed is doing for the run game…Now imagine the upgrade to the WR room that speed would bring…👍

 

Gabe Davis is the “Devin Singleterry” of WRs…

 

 

I think that’s not a terribly unfair comparison - good guy, well liked, hard worker, and has a spot in the league but not the guy for this roster or scheme. 
 

because he is a wr instead of running back the pay is also about 5-10x, which makes it even worse to sign on for a veteran contract. He’s a guy a team with a rookie qb can splurge on as part of a 3 WR platoon that costs too much for us

[Straight Hucklebuck]

5 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

I think that’s not a terribly unfair comparison - good guy, well liked, hard worker, and has a spot in the league but not the guy for this roster or scheme. 
 

because he is a wr instead of running back the pay is also about 5-10x, which makes it even worse to sign on for a veteran contract. He’s a guy a team with a rookie qb can splurge on as part of a 3 WR platoon that costs too much for us

If he’s Devin Singletary it means we should be able to draft someone in R1-R3 that can do what Gabe does. 
 

Would this offense look better with Pickens at #2 instead of Gabe? 

[Dopey]

14 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

SF, Miami, Philadelphia, Cinci and Seattle all clearly have two dynamic WR1 talents as their second receiver.   That's 5 indisputable examples not 3.  There are a bunch of other teams that have have two WR1 talents when both are healthy or if the QB play is even adequate.   Some of them even have WR3's that could be fringe WR1's like Cinci with Boyd and Seattle with JSN.  

 

The Bills are not one of these teams.   They have a very clear WR1 and a big drop-off to Gabe as a WR3 talent with clear limitations.

 

So to imply that it's "unrealistic" to have a WR1 level talent opposite your primary target is not so.........it's closer to a 25% scenario than "unrealistic" and most of the teams that have such setups are SB contenders.  

 

Why you choose to look like a fool on hills like this and those of Star Lotulelei and Tremaine Edmunds etc.. is a curiosity.

 

31 minutes ago, JaCrispy said:

If true, this would tell me the Bills aren’t serious about improving their offense like the Dolphins are…They will always be limited so long as Davis is the #2…And with Diggs getting older and slower, the Bills are simply going to need more speed…

 

Just look at what Cook’s speed is doing for the run game…Now imagine the upgrade to the WR room that speed would bring…👍

 

Gabe Davis is the “Devin Singleterry” of WRs…

 

 

You're entitled to your opinion, but not everyone agrees. Resigning a WR who averages almost 17 yds per catch for his career is not a bad thing. Counting this season, we've been a top 3/top 2 offense over the past 3 seasons. In the entire league. Gabe has been a big part of that production. You might not like it, but bringing Davis back wouldn't be a bad signing. Obviously, dependent on how much. As far as being serious about improving the offense, I guess the mention of Cook by you, improving the interior of the o-line and trading up for Kincaid means they aren't serious? You're going to base this on 1 signing, forgetting everything else done to improve the offense? O-line improvements, Kincaid this year alone. Damian Harris, Murray, not to mention Cook last year. The #2 scoring offense this year and all of last year. In the entire league. Please don't try to flip this into "it's cuz of Josh". That is not only false, but also as lazy as saying "fire Dorsey". 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

3 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

If he’s Devin Singletary it means we should be able to draft someone in R1-R3 that can do what Gabe does. 
 

Would this offense look better with Pickens at #2 instead of Gabe? 

Yes. But impossible. The Bills would never replace Gabe Davis or bring in anyone that would replace him. It’s a Edmunds situation. Just have to wait for him to walk in free agency.

[Alphadawg7]

Here is where I am at:

 

3 games played, in two of those games he had just 4 targets each, and in those 8 targets he only caught 3 of them, including at least 1 drop that I know for sure last week.  

 

I entered the season down on my confidence in Davis.  Then as the offseason progressed suddenly we heard a lot about how his ankle injury affected him more and longer than we knew last year.  Everyone from Davis to Beane talked about it and how a bounce back season was expected amongst them.  Then camp opens up and we keep hearing about how Davis is having one of the best camps of anyone, we see clips of crazy catches, etc.  Heading into week 1, Davis had nothing but rave reviews from camp and seemed poised potentially for the breakout year we thought was coming last year, especially now that this is also a contract year.

 

So, my optimism suddenly rose again on Davis heading into the season, heck even my fantasy drafts, and thought with the new OL, better and additional weapons around him, it could really open things up for him and we just might see the season from him we expected last year.

 

BUT - Fast forward 3 games now, and to be totally honest, I don't see a lot of difference out there.  Week 1 he had just 2 receptions on 4 targets and even during Kurt Warners film breakdown of Allens turnovers, he brought a lot of questions up about how either Davis ran some poor routes or Dorsey just had terrible play design, and given the pretty obvious nature of the route issues, it seems like its probably less on Dorsey and more on the receivers (although without being in the Bills meetings, there is no way for us to know for sure).  

 

He has a good game week 2 against a pretty weak defense and then comes back out and is non existent sans 1 reception which was a TD.  And yes, its great to see him get a TD in back to back weeks, but in this game he had another drop and only caught the 1 pass on 4 targets.  

 

And this is the Davis conundrum.  His impact games are too few and far in between.  In his previous 3 seasons he literally just has 3 total 100 yard games, literally 1 each season.  For a team who has been a prolific passing team, its astonishing to me that he hasn't found a way to be more consistently involved.  Personally, I don't think his route tree is very diverse and I think he struggles with sharper cuts.  A lot of his routes feel more rounded than cuts.  

 

I am not ready to condemn him or anything, but I also haven't seen anything from him yet to make me think he can offer much more than he has already done in the past. 

 

If we don't see more, let him leave via FA, resign Sherfield and draft a rookie to compete with him for WR2 next year.  Lets be real, Sherfield is capable of giving us the same level of production Davis has thus far, so if Davis can't be better than that then we shouldn't spend the money on him.  

[Buffalo_Stampede]

 I’ve gone nuclear on Gabe Davis. So far 2 ints when targeting Davis. He’s only been targeted 15 times.

 

Gabe Davis offers nothing athletically. 

Edited September 28, 2023 by Buffalo_Stampede

[Straight Hucklebuck]

42 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Here is where I am at:

 

3 games played, in two of those games he had just 4 targets each, and in those 8 targets he only caught 3 of them, including at least 1 drop that I know for sure last week.  

 

I entered the season down on my confidence in Davis.  Then as the offseason progressed suddenly we heard a lot about how his ankle injury affected him more and longer than we knew last year.  Everyone from Davis to Beane talked about it and how a bounce back season was expected amongst them.  Then camp opens up and we keep hearing about how Davis is having one of the best camps of anyone, we see clips of crazy catches, etc.  Heading into week 1, Davis had nothing but rave reviews from camp and seemed poised potentially for the breakout year we thought was coming last year, especially now that this is also a contract year.

 

So, my optimism suddenly rose again on Davis heading into the season, heck even my fantasy drafts, and thought with the new OL, better and additional weapons around him, it could really open things up for him and we just might see the season from him we expected last year.

 

BUT - Fast forward 3 games now, and to be totally honest, I don't see a lot of difference out there.  Week 1 he had just 2 receptions on 4 targets and even during Kurt Warners film breakdown of Allens turnovers, he brought a lot of questions up about how either Davis ran some poor routes or Dorsey just had terrible play design, and given the pretty obvious nature of the route issues, it seems like its probably less on Dorsey and more on the receivers (although without being in the Bills meetings, there is no way for us to know for sure).  

 

He has a good game week 2 against a pretty weak defense and then comes back out and is non existent sans 1 reception which was a TD.  And yes, its great to see him get a TD in back to back weeks, but in this game he had another drop and only caught the 1 pass on 4 targets.  

 

And this is the Davis conundrum.  His impact games are too few and far in between.  In his previous 3 seasons he literally just has 3 total 100 yard games, literally 1 each season.  For a team who has been a prolific passing team, its astonishing to me that he hasn't found a way to be more consistently involved.  Personally, I don't think his route tree is very diverse and I think he struggles with sharper cuts.  A lot of his routes feel more rounded than cuts.  

 

I am not ready to condemn him or anything, but I also haven't seen anything from him yet to make me think he can offer much more than he has already done in the past. 

 

If we don't see more, let him leave via FA, resign Sherfield and draft a rookie to compete with him for WR2 next year.  Let’s be real, Sherfield is capable of giving us the same level of production Davis has thus far, so if Davis can't be better than that then we shouldn't spend the money on him.  

It’s Year 4 now. 
 

It’s not a question of can we do better than Gabe Davis, it’s we need better than Gabe Davis. 
 

He’s reached his ceiling, and this offense is capped, in part, because of his limited skill set. 
 

There are 30 draft able WRs every year now and Beane trades up frequently.

 

Move up in R1 and get a real playmaker. 
 

You're going to need it anyways with Diggs now at the 30 year old mark. 

 

 

[78thealltimegreat]

12 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

You know what they call a number 3 receiver masquerading as a number 2? 

 

They call them a number two. 

 

If  you can do the things a number two can - and Gabe absolutely does - you're a #2. And the people who call you a #3 are wrong.

 

Gabe is currently on track for 901 yards and 11.3 TDs. That would make him 27th in yards and put him in a four-way tie for 3rd in TDs if you put him into last year's rankings.

 

Now in reality three games isn't a big enough sample size. We don't really know how he'll do yet. Duh. But he's performing well.

 

He just is.

 

 

Yeah and do you know what I call someone that would give Gabe the 15 million plus he is going to seek on the open market…the front offices of the NY Giants, Chicago Bears, and Houston Texans 

[PBF81]

Say what people will about Davis, but all 9 of his catches have gone for 1st-Downs or TDs.  They've been heavily instrumental in scoring drives and putting points on the board.  

 

Some of the throws to Davis that he didn't catch were on him.  And now we're blaming Davis for those?  

 

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

If Gabe is Devin Singletary, Beane and his scouts should be able to find someone who potentially can do more on the field. 

 

What was the reason he was drafted? 

 

He's 6'2" and runs a good go-route. 

 

But as time has gone one, when is the last time Gabe won a real jump ball? Not the Raiders endzone TD where he came back for a perfect Allen pass. 

 

When has Gabe broke some tackles? 

 

Can Gabe go in the slot, or would that be like asking the Titanic to turn quicker before the iceberg? 

 

 

[PBF81]

47 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

 I’ve gone nuclear on Gabe Davis. So far 2 ints when targeting Davis. He’s only been targeted 15 times.

 

So now you're blaming Davis for Allen's underthrown pass in the Jets game and for throwing into perfect coverage against Fuller in the Skins game?  

 

I mean really, look at that coverage.  I don't see Diggs much less any other receiver on our team making that catch either.  

 

I'm not defending or attacking Davis here, just laying out some facts, but dang, there's clearly an anti-Davis agenda at work here.  

 

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

1 minute ago, PBF81 said:

Say what people will about Davis, but all 9 of his catches have gone for 1st-Downs or TDs.  They've been heavily instrumental in scoring drives and putting points on the board.  

 

Some of the throws to Davis that he didn't catch were on him.  And now we're blaming Davis for those?  

 

 

No we're saying Gabe is inefficient as a WR because he's physically limited while eating up 95% of snaps. 

[Alphadawg7]

1 minute ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

It’s Year 4 now. 
 

It’s not a question of can we do better than Gabe Davis, it’s we need better than Gabe Davis. 
 

He’s reached his ceiling, and this offense is capped, in part, because of his limited skill set. 
 

There are 30 draft able WRs every year now and Beane trades up frequently.

 

Move up in R1 and get a real playmaker. 
 

You're going to need it anyways with Diggs now at the 30 year old mark. 

 

 

 

I agree...the only thing had been year 3 he had played on a bum ankle, so entering the season this was his chance to prove he was more than he showed last year.  But to be honest, no matter what happened this year I still didn't expect him back in 2024.  If he had a big year they wouldn't be able to afford him and if he plays at a similar level then he isn't worth resigning.  

 

So for me, my expectation for next year has always been a WR early in the draft between I don't see a path where we would have resigned Gabe and Diggs is over 30, so we need to find a heir apparent to Diggs and no matter how well Davis ends up playing this year, he is definitely not a WR1 in this league who could be the long term heir to Diggs.  

 

And when you look around the league and you see the impact young WR's are having early every year, to me it is a no brainer to look towards the draft and take one, maybe 2 WR's next year.  

 

Personally I think the 3 positions highest on our draft board this offseason will be WR, RT, and C

[78thealltimegreat]

4 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

So now you're blaming Davis for Allen's underthrown pass in the Jets game and for throwing into perfect coverage against Fuller in the Skins game?  

 

I mean really, look at that coverage.  I don't see Diggs much less any other receiver on our team making that catch either.  

 

I'm not defending or attacking Davis here, just laying out some facts, but dang, there's clearly an anti-Davis agenda at work here.  

 

 

Yeh cause he drops a ton of catchable passes, only runs 3 routes according to Patrick Peterson, and is going to want 15 million plus a year as well 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

5 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

So now you're blaming Davis for Allen's underthrown pass in the Jets game and for throwing into perfect coverage against Fuller in the Skins game?  

 

I mean really, look at that coverage.  I don't see Diggs much less any other receiver on our team making that catch either.  

 

I'm not defending or attacking Davis here, just laying out some facts, but dang, there's clearly an anti-Davis agenda at work here.  

 

 

Gabe Davis is the reason gas prices are high also.

 

He needs to go to the bench.