Outside of MLB, Where are the Bills Worse in 2023?

[Bangarang]

On 8/2/2023 at 4:19 PM, RyanC883 said:

Nowhere.  And not even sure they are worse at LB, I think Dorian Williams will fill the Edmunds role very well.  

We are 100% worse at LB.

[JerseyBills]

We're better at every positional group besides MLB. 

Edited August 4, 2023 by JerseyBills

[Beast]

LT-Dawkins. A year older and a year lazier.

 

Most overrated player on the Buffalo Bills.

[ColoradoBills]

I'm fairly certain Dion Dawkins will be ready for the season.  Vets like him and Morse are not going 100% during camp like some UDFA.

Nor should they.  It's a long season.  Dion's contract is up after next year and I could see a LT drafted in the near future.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

RT looks like its going to be a problem again all this season. 

 

Worse? I don't know, but nothing out of camp says Brown has taken a big step forward. 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

1 hour ago, ScottLaw said:

Tackle, WR are possibly worse as well.

In 2022, there was nothing after Gabe Davis. 

 

I think they're marginally better. 

 

Edited August 4, 2023 by Straight Hucklebuck

[Straight Hucklebuck]

Just now, ScottLaw said:

The corpse of John Brown and Cole Beasley might be better than JAG Trent and often injured Harty… if Harty can stay healthy than yea I agree.

It was so erratic. 

 

Kumerow and Crowder were 0's. 

 

John Brown catches a bomb, and nothing else. 

 

Beasley scores in the Dolphins Playoff game, but his usage was off from 2020/2021. 

 

McKenzie was so inefficient that just getting him off the field and replacing him with Shakir should be better (if Josh looks his way). 

 

I have to think between Harty, Sherfield, and Shorter there has to be more than 500 yards and 4 TDs in there. 

 

 

7 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

The corpse of John Brown and Cole Beasley might be better than JAG Trent and often injured Harty… if Harty can stay healthy than yea I agree.

Agree with you at OT though. 

 

Brown is a red flag and he doesn't appear to be any better physically. 

 

[Ayjent]

On 8/1/2023 at 9:40 PM, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

It really is NOT.

 

The $18M AAV contract is the reason we let him walk.

 

They've made it abundantly clear, over and over and over again, that they loved Tremaine, they wanted him back, and they couldn't afford it and stay in decent cap shape.

 

Who says we are worse at MLB? Everyone. 

 

Hopefully the new guys will step up, though, as they see time and reps.

 

 

 

 

Nobody thought around the league Edmunds was a pariah and a weak point. It was only a group of folks here in Buffalo who mostly wanted someone more like Brandon Spikes.

 

You're right that things could change, but right now it absolutely looks like we're worse off there. That's no hot take or knee jerk reaction.

 

Oh, and Milano was in no way whatsoever considered a JAG before he got his contract. He's been excellent really since the middle of year two.

 

 

Edmunds was definitely talented and has the size and speed to make him attractive to other teams who may want to use his attributes differently.  However, you see this all the time in the NFL with measurables.  It’s why the Bills drafted him so high and it’s why he’s getting paid so well by the Bears - it’s not about his body of work as much as his perceived potential.  I didn’t think he was awful but I also didn’t think he was very consistent at being a vital part of the D.  He was okay, and he didn’t have the instincts to be great.  It’s debatable whether our coaching wanted him to do anything more than he was doing, but if that’s what they needed then he would never be worth what the Bears paid.  You have to think they wanted more than that with where he was drafted and that if he was fulfilling their vision of what he would be he wouldn’t have made it to FA status. 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

Age of the overall roster is one of my worries.

 

Age of a lot of our top end guys is also something that could factor in. Even Diggs is around that age where he could lose a step. But I thought he would lose that step last year and he proved me wrong. Really had his best year yet as a Bill.

 

But Von, Hyde and Poyer, yes on paper it is better to have this trio on the roster rather than out or banged up like they were last year. But strictly in terms of where we were last offseason compared to this offseason, those players were a year younger and healthy this time last year. Now they are a year older and coming off of injuries. 

 

Tre White even turns 29 come playoff time. Milano is 29 now. Mitch Morse 31 and already showing injuries last year.  Dion Dawkins 29. Not every player will break down at 29+ but with seemingly so many in that age group I would expect one of two to start to slide in productivity. 

[Nextmanup]

1 hour ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

Tre White even turns 29 come playoff time.

Never mind about White's age!  We still don't know if he can play anywhere CLOSE to who he was before his last injury.

 

Jury still very much out on him.

 

 

[Luka]

Might want to watch the season play out before you declare we are worse at middle linebacker. Removing the young, statuesque kid from the middle and putting someone who knows how to read a run play in there might actually benefit the defense. 

[PrimeTime101]

On 8/1/2023 at 4:11 PM, Limeaid said:

 

Isaiah McKenzie was a feast or famine WR; I cannot see Harty matching McKenzie's performance against New England (11 catches on 12 targets for 125 yards and a touchdown) where the GOAT DC & HC had no solution for him.  He might replace Hines for a year but that is it and I think he was overpaid.  

 

I think its interesting you picked one really good game from McKenzie and not put in account all the MEH games he had.  Harty has been plagued by injuries his entire career. 2 years ago he had a 59 target 570 yards 15 yard average in 13 games. McKenzie best year was 65 targets 423 yards averaging around 10 yards. I would easily argue that a healthy Harty = McKenzie. 

 

Health is the biggest issue. But lets not talk about one great game. McKenzie had a Dude named Josh Allen.. Who was throwing to Harty? Winston? Taysom Hill?

 

Perspective...

[EmotionallyUnstable]

What’s up with all the Dawkins hate? I mean, come on. He’s been a pillar here for quite some time, a great community contributor and personality. He has a few poor games, and people rag on him like he’s lazy because his body image? 
 

Am I missing something? The amount of hate people have is wild to me. You can dislike his play, or think they need to improve, just not sure why a fan would bash a guy for something like this. 

[Saxum]

1 hour ago, PrimeTime101 said:

I think its interesting you picked one really good game from McKenzie and not put in account all the MEH games he had.  Harty has been plagued by injuries his entire career. 2 years ago he had a 59 target 570 yards 15 yard average in 13 games. McKenzie best year was 65 targets 423 yards averaging around 10 yards. I would easily argue that a healthy Harty = McKenzie. 

 

Health is the biggest issue. But lets not talk about one great game. McKenzie had a Dude named Josh Allen.. Who was throwing to Harty? Winston? Taysom Hill?

 

Perspective...

 

I stated he was a Feast or Famine  player - I acknowledged he had as you call them "meh" games.  And McKenzie won that game for us with Josh Allen throwing to him.

 

Talking about Perspective Hardy is being paid far more than McKenzie was.  And "healthy Harty" ?  The check that McKenzie could not cash was his mouth - he talked too much and should have used energy on his skills more.

 

He cannot stay healthy - why do you think he will be with Buffalo?  McKenzie played almost every game for Buffalo, was used on scout team (he took Lemar Jackson's role in practice for playoff game where Bills beat Ravens) and even played on defense when necessary.

[billsfan89]

5 hours ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

Age of the overall roster is one of my worries.

 

Age of a lot of our top end guys is also something that could factor in. Even Diggs is around that age where he could lose a step. But I thought he would lose that step last year and he proved me wrong. Really had his best year yet as a Bill.

 

But Von, Hyde and Poyer, yes on paper it is better to have this trio on the roster rather than out or banged up like they were last year. But strictly in terms of where we were last offseason compared to this offseason, those players were a year younger and healthy this time last year. Now they are a year older and coming off of injuries. 

 

Tre White even turns 29 come playoff time. Milano is 29 now. Mitch Morse 31 and already showing injuries last year.  Dion Dawkins 29. Not every player will break down at 29+ but with seemingly so many in that age group I would expect one of two to start to slide in productivity. 

 

There are a lot of players in their late 20's and early 30's at key positions. Which is a concern short term and a massive concern long term. They are going to have to draft really well in the next 2 drafts to sustain the current success. You always need to draft well but once you are up against the cap your drafting needs to be even more impactful. I like what they did in the past draft, adding the best TE and Guard are going to help Josh out a lot long term hopefully. They need to likely spend 3 out of the first 4 picks on offense next year as well and then hit on some mid to late-round defensive players. 

 

Luckily the Bills have been fairly good at drafting and they make smart mid-level free agency additions. But for 2023 I don't expect the team's age to be a massive issue just yet. 

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

On 8/1/2023 at 11:10 AM, wppete said:

Losing Edmunds is going to hurt. 

McD will have to get creative w/ blitz packages to protect the gaping hole in the middle of the field. I think Klein is the best option until Beane addresses it in the next draft. Knows the system and is only a couple years removed from a pretty productive season w/ the Bills (5 sacks, 2 FF.) 

[oldmanfan]

15 minutes ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

McD will have to get creative w/ blitz packages to protect the gaping hole in the middle of the field. I think Klein is the best option until Beane addresses it in the next draft. Knows the system and is only a couple years removed from a pretty productive season w/ the Bills (5 sacks, 2 FF.) 

I expect a lot of 6 DB looks with Milano as the single LB.

[ngbills]

10 hours ago, Ayjent said:

Edmunds was definitely talented and has the size and speed to make him attractive to other teams who may want to use his attributes differently.  However, you see this all the time in the NFL with measurables.  It’s why the Bills drafted him so high and it’s why he’s getting paid so well by the Bears - it’s not about his body of work as much as his perceived potential.  I didn’t think he was awful but I also didn’t think he was very consistent at being a vital part of the D.  He was okay, and he didn’t have the instincts to be great.  It’s debatable whether our coaching wanted him to do anything more than he was doing, but if that’s what they needed then he would never be worth what the Bears paid.  You have to think they wanted more than that with where he was drafted and that if he was fulfilling their vision of what he would be he wouldn’t have made it to FA status. 

 

On 8/4/2023 at 3:06 AM, SoMAn said:

Overhyped players are frequently overpaid. In a couple of years when the Bears figure out what they're getting for their money, Edmunds will be looking for another team. 

I've re-watched games from the past 3 seasons, specifically focusing in on Edmunds.

More often than not he was a liability in my opinion. He had a couple of decent games, but most of the time he can be seen chasing the play, getting blocked out of the way, not creating fumbles, not getting interceptions, 'assisting' on tackles when an opposing ball carrier is already halfway to the ground from another defender, or just being in close proximity to that ball carrier after the tackle.  

His condor-like wing span was supposed to be integral in clogging up passing lanes. That doesn't work unless your in a position to do that. Edmunds' poor instincts prevented him from being in position. My guess is he followed the defensive playbook to the letter, making him predictable. 

It was weird watching him trail a ball carrier when it appeared another Bill would be there to make the tackle, and it looked like Edmunds was running at half speed, assuming the teammate would make the tackle. Seriously, he sometimes looked like he was out for a morning jog. 

I have nothing against him personally, and by all accounts was well-liked by his teammates. I just don't believe he was all he was made out to be by the press and some fans.

The organization is very loyal to their players and would never disparage any of them publicly, but I believe if they had really wanted to keep him, they could have found a way.

Prediction: in a couple of years he'll come knocking on the door at One Bills Drive as a FA, just like the numerous other players that came back home after a stint with another team.

Tremaine played as close to 100% of the snaps as a player can play. It is so odd how people continue to talk like he was a liability on the field. The Bears and other NFL teams only see his size. The bills played him from day 1 and kept him on the field and never looked to replace or even support him. Yes he sucks and only has size. This stuff makes no sense. If Josh walked rather than resigning is this what the narrative would be? People just love his arm and size and speed but he was terrible. 

[John from Riverside]

It’s only a middle linebacker
 

But we’re going to see this year just how much it’s actually going to hurt for all we know the bills coaches have a plan and I’ve already skimmed it up so that it’s not a distraction

[Nephilim17]

Does anyone who really watched Edmunds see that he made a substantial difference against QBs like Burrow and Mahomes, meaning did he really take away the middle of the field or limit throws in the middle. 

 

I could be wrong but I don't recall Cinci and the Chiefs having to rely on the short outside.