Training Camp 8/1 9:45

[Beck Water]

4 minutes ago, Big Blitz said:

Didn’t Biadasz start over him?  They had a bunch of injuries last year and when Pollard wasn’t blowing off the occasional 50 yard run they couldn’t run well.  

 

I can't claim to know the intricacies of the Cowboys OL, but I thought Tyler Biadasz was their C and started every game but Week 18

31 minutes ago, Toledo Bill said:

He has regressed big time. I know quality left tackles don’t grow on trees but he is not the player he was a couple of years ago.

 

I hope Dion gets it together.  I have trouble assessing how he played last season because it's true that when an OLman is playing next to a guy who is struggling, he struggles.  More true for IOL but still true at OT.

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

9 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

So now, all of a sudden, Leonard Floyd is not good. You really can’t make this ***** up.
 

Perhaps the defensive line of the Buffalo Bills is just that good

I still don’t get how the Floyd signing isn’t talked about more by the national media lol is it because it was late in free agency?  
 

once von gets healthy this dline is gonna be scary 

[Big Blitz]

4 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I can't claim to know the intricacies of the Cowboys OL, but I thought Tyler Biadasz was their C and started every game but Week 18

 

 

You’re right that’s my bad.  

 

 

4 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I hope Dion gets it together.  I have trouble assessing how he played last season because it's true that when an OLman is playing next to a guy who is struggling, he struggles.  More true for IOL but still true at OT.

 

If Dawkins isn’t good it won’t matter what we do.   

They originally thought Tyler Smith would start at Guard - Tyron got hurt and that led to shuffling.  

Edited August 1, 2023 by Big Blitz

[Don Otreply]

20 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

So now, all of a sudden, Leonard Floyd is not good. You really can’t make this ***** up.
 

Perhaps the defensive line of the Buffalo Bills is just that good

Better to not respond, he will think he is included in the conversation…, 

[BIGFOOTspaceman]

4 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

More Butler interview:

 

Basically, I think what that translates to is saying Elam does not (yet) excel as an off-ball CB in the zone defense the Bills primarily rely on.

That ain't a good sign for a 1st round pick.

 

Whereas he's saying Benford really gets it when it comes to playing zone.

 

Anyone else see it differently?

 

I put this on the coaches and draft team not on Elam.  The needed a corner and went into panic mode after McDuffie was selected by the Chiefs.  They selected a man cover corner knowing full well they would have to coach that out of him to run the defense they wanted.

[ngbills]

19 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

So now, all of a sudden, Leonard Floyd is not good. You really can’t make this ***** up.
 

Perhaps the defensive line of the Buffalo Bills is just that good

Leonard Floyd is good. Versus Spencer Brown he is elite. Spencer Brown is playing awfully bad right now and it is not surprising. He was arguably the worse starter on both sides of the ball last year. 

[John from Riverside]

Just now, ngbills said:

Leonard Floyd is good. Versus Spencer Brown he is elite. Spencer Brown is playing awfully bad right now and it is not surprising. He was arguably the worse starter on both sides of the ball last year. 

Iron, sharpens iron

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

The injury concern with Sharty is everything.  He's basically always been hurt.   Even the 1 year he had some measurable receiving yardage he missed games injured.   He's had like a dozen inury/re-injury situations with his hammies.   He was re-injuring them in the offseasons even.   Missing almost all of last season with turf toe was only the latest concern for a 5'6" guy who needs to be lightning quick/fast to be of any use in the NFL.    If he stays healthy he is a nice player to have.   It just seems unlikely.

 

Yeah, its a legit concern for sure.  The one thing I would say that he might benefit from our state of the art facilities and staff.  Other injury prone guys have held up better here than previous stops, so hopefully that happens with him too.  

[That's No Moon]

19 minutes ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

I still don’t get how the Floyd signing isn’t talked about more by the national media lol is it because it was late in free agency?  
 

once von gets healthy this dline is gonna be scary 

The middle of the defense is still nougaty soft.

[JGMcD2]

8 minutes ago, BIGFOOTspaceman said:

 

I put this on the coaches and draft team not on Elam.  The needed a corner and went into panic mode after McDuffie was selected by the Chiefs.  They selected a man cover corner knowing full well they would have to coach that out of him to run the defense they wanted.

This just doesn't track. All they've told us this whole time is that he's got the physical tools and needs to get more comfortable with the scheme. It's been the same message from day 1 with Elam.

 

They didn't go into "panic mode." They had one player left on their board that had a RD1 grade - Kaiir Elam. That's not panic mode... he wouldn't have been on the board if they didn't feel like he was worthy of the selection.

[Nephilim17]

7 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Yeah, its a legit concern for sure.  The one thing I would say that he might benefit from our state of the art facilities and staff.  Other injury prone guys have held up better here than previous stops, so hopefully that happens with him too.  

I'd be more concerned if the team expected Harty to handle a 80% of the slot snaps.

 

Kincaid should eat up the lion's share and Harty and Sherfield can take the rest. If and when Harty gets Hurt we have Kincaid, Sherfield and then Shakir. 

Shakir should be pretty low on the depth chart here so no fears about him having to handle a significant load ever this year.

[John from Riverside]

1 minute ago, JGMcD2 said:

This just doesn't track. All they've told us this whole time is that he's got the physical tools and needs to get more comfortable with the scheme. It's been the same message from day 1 with Elam.

 

They didn't go into "panic mode." They had one player left on their board that had a RD1 grade - Kaiir Elam. That's not panic mode... he wouldn't have been on the board if they didn't feel like he was worthy of the selection.

We’re gonna be glad we have him whenever we face the team that destroys zone defense

[Alphadawg7]

3 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said:

This just doesn't track. All they've told us this whole time is that he's got the physical tools and needs to get more comfortable with the scheme. It's been the same message from day 1 with Elam.

 

They didn't go into "panic mode." They had one player left on their board that had a RD1 grade - Kaiir Elam. That's not panic mode... he wouldn't have been on the board if they didn't feel like he was worthy of the selection.

 

And draft coverage showed they were high on him all offseason and he had won them over big time with his dedication to being better and his notebook he had on all his mistakes and areas to improve.  

 

This notion we "panicked" to take him is not rooted in the reality of what went down.  Like Kincaid, he was the last player with a first round grade on their board, which is pretty typical when you draft late that there are few to no players left with a first round grade.  

[That's No Moon]

6 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

We’re gonna be glad we have him whenever we face the team that destroys zone defense

This. You can be a zone team, but you still need to play man sometimes. It gives you flexibility to run some different stuff also.

[BADOLBILZ]

8 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Yeah, its a legit concern for sure.  The one thing I would say that he might benefit from our state of the art facilities and staff.  Other injury prone guys have held up better here than previous stops, so hopefully that happens with him too.  

 

 

Yeah I believe soft tissue injuries can be significantly reduced by good training.   We've seen it first hand.  When Wade Phillips took over the Bills in 1998 with his hands-off player-coach approach the team immediately started pulling hammies left and right.   It's fluctuated from coach to coach since, depending on their attention to detail.   The McDermott Bills have very few such injuries compared to the Rex Ryan Bills.

 

 

My concern is that Harty has just had so many that he might not be able to get back to a good baseline.  The player also really has to want to.   Fans think these guys eat great, stretch extensively and sleep in a hyperbaric chamber every night to avoid injuries but I know from knowing that the players who go to great lengths to make sure they stay on the field every day are actually the minority.    And a turf toe bad enough to require season ending surgery is a fairly significant injury and considerable risk for re-injury that can take some mph off of a speed player.    It was a curious decision by Beane to pay that price for him.   He surely seemed like a $1.7M flyer type given his lack of success and injury history.

[Beck Water]

https://www.audacy.com/wgr550/sports/bills/stefon-diggs-has-been-unguardable-at-training-camp?utm_campaign=sharebutton&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_term=WGRAM

 

Sal C's take

 

Quote

The linebacker shuffle

The linebackers continued to move around to different spots with different groups on Tuesday.

Matt Milano and Tyrel Dodson started with the first group on the weakside and in the middle, respectively.

After that, initially, it was A.J. Klein in the middle with Terrel Bernard outside.

Dorian Williams got his chance to play the WILL with Baylon Spector in the middle.

While those were all generally the pairings, sometimes the groups after Milano/Dodson shuffled between the second and third units.

 

 

Elam battling

2022 first round pick Kaiir Elam got the majority of looks with the first unit at cornerback opposite White. Dane Jackson and Christian Benford were behind them.

 

Bates vs. Torrence

At this point it looks like there is a legitimate competition going on for the starting right guard spot.

Veteran Ryan Bates and rookie O'Cyrus Torrence both got first team reps again on Tuesday.

 

 

[Solomon Grundy]

1 hour ago, That's No Moon said:

He's also rushing against a series of pylons.

If that's what you want to call Spencer Brown...so be it!!

[stevewin]

Random observations from practice today:

 

- Shorter out there again early on JUGS machine - spent a long time doing nothing but over the shoulder which I had never seen anyone do so long on a JUGS machine before.  Isabella joined him later - did all his reps while high stepping.  These two seem to work hard am rooting for them both

- Tre and Elam went over to JUGS next - Tre in bare feet.  He also walked out onto the field in bare feet - that's definitely the first time I've seen that

- Shakir has signed for everyone last two days at VIP fence before tunnel.  A couple guys flagged down Floyd and each had an 8x10 of him with the Rams, and at first I was thinking wow there's a couple serious Leonard Floyd fans - then I saw later they had a whole portfolio of 8x10s of players and they would bring out the proper pic as players walked by.  Later I saw them talking to DJ Milk - figure maybe it was for charity or something vs them just selling for profit later

- Each day when Kyle Allen runs out there's a big cheer then pause then chorus of laughter when people realize it is not Josh.  Do people not know Josh's number?

- Before stretch they did half speed goal line - with defense not trying they still absent-mindedly knocked down a shovel pass.  It seems offense is intent on making the goal line shovel pass a thing

- During the stretch a trainer was off with Josh working on his arm again - I assume that is a daily routine now to stretch him out vs it being treatment for something bothering him

- Majority defense off to side field, STs work and offense working on run plays

- Diggs with nothing much to do on far side during this period throws a ball into the stands then mostly trolls them the rest of the time after he's worked kids into a frenzy "Diggs! Diggs! Diggs!"  trying to get him to throw another (never understood why kids scream a players last name for attention/autographs - comes off as rude to me)

- Never seen so many people in VIP area in front of far stands - 4-5 deep.  Until recently the far last section of stands was also reserved for VIP which was sweet if you were in that group - could watch practice from stands then wander down to field level if you wanted - now all stands are general

- Another long boring ST session - OL doing drills far EZ, QBs practicing movment in pocket drills

- QBs throwing to TEs against air, WRs doing a drill getting hit with pad about 5yds from release.  In previous years with Chad Hall I remember the receivers doing a ton of hand fighting and very physical get off the line drills against press punishment - haven't seen that this camp the two practices I've been to

- Kincaid makes a nice one handed grab gets a rise out of crowd - looks like he stumbled just a bit on his break and recovered with one hand stab

- Caught a T-shirt

- QBs rotating w/ WRs against air.  Josh and DIggs had a long discussion after one rep

- Full def comes back - OL/DL batttles one side, more ST middle, far left WR/DB 1-1s at goal line

- I missed a lot of the 1-1 battles (one of my favorite parts) because stupid people standing in the aisle and constant traffic in/out of my row (get off my lawn).  Few that I saw

   - Isabella held by Benford after nice release

   - Harty beats Jackson to the corner

   - Neal shut down Davis not sure wth Davis was doing dancing around

   - Shorter nice over the shoulder corner route over Ingram (same thing he was practicing on JUGS)

   - Cam Lewis nice PBU on Shakir

   - Diggs abuses Tre quick slant.  Nasty

- 11-11 - this session was almost exclusively dedicated to runs - included

   - Cook nice speed outside

   - Murray gets around edge nice gain

   - Barkley (the one pass) nice rollout to Morris - same play as yesterday

   - Barkley fumble snap

   - Spector awesome stuff on RB for TFL

   - Another TFL up middle didn't get number

   - One other attempted pass defense just engulfed Josh immediately - whistle blows for sack and in frustration Josh jumps and fires a 30 yd laser sidearm which hits Diggs in the numbers

   - Tre TFL coming off edge

   - Murray nice run up the middle - one of the few times anything got through the middle of the line

- Offense walk through of plays against air - started out with 4-5 diff screens - then just WRs doing respective routes for play call

- Some more 11-11, not sure if goal was to make a first 3rd and long each time - included

   - Harty gets lit up over middle by Rapp short of 1st

   - Sweet bullet by Josh to Davis between defenders

   - Sack

   - 20 yds Sahkir

   - Diggs beats Tre sideline

   - Josh throws long but misses Kincaid short who got behind entire defense by 5 yds would have been easy TD (Hamlin was one safety not sure who the other was)

   - Oliver chases Josh right back into line of players watching - hardly had time to react

   - Epenesa comes untouched - Josh had a few words for Dion

   - Epenesa looks fast the times I've noticed him (even with actual players impeding his way) - haven't noticed Basham at all

   - Cam Lewis lights up murray - crazy good hit - made a very big man go flying

   - Next play Murray gets ball in flat and turning up field could see he was looking for revenge - and revenge he got - stiff armed Dane into the ground and possibly further

   - At one point Diggs caught a contested sideline catch against Elam, started upfield, then turned around and stopped and stared at him before continuing up the field 😛 

   - Josh throws a rocket - a ROCKET - to Davis flying down the sideline who stretches out and makes a beautiful catch with his fingertips in stride.  Looked like defenders might have let up after he caught instead of trying to light him up, so live action might have been tackled before taking it to house.  When Josh let it rip my first thought was he is PISSED (the O was not clicking) and just whipped that ball as hard as he could.  It was one of those throws you shake your head afterwards and mutter "oh my god"

   - Cook nice catch out of backfield and upfield turn.  He is so natural catching the ball and getting right upfield - will be exciting to see him involved more this year

   - Milano breaks up sideline pass to Kincaid.  Splitting hairs, but Kincaid didn't make the best play on the ball from what I saw - kind of let it hit him in the chest - but for sure elite play by Milano to stay on him step for step all the way down the field and break up the play

   - Josh flushed out, Cam Lewis sack consecutive plays

   - Josh bomb to Shakir - Lewis and Rapp both converge and knock ball away.  If ball was a few feet further Shakir would have had a better chance to hold on

- Overall D has just been taking it to O, but they have been throwing a lot of stuff at them -  I saw CB blitzes, zone blitzes with all diff DL dropping, players coming from everywhere.  While undoubtedly the idea is to get the O to learn under fire, I don't think they are getting as many quality live reps in passing game because a lot of the time a QB is under duress just checking down if they even get it off.  I guess that will come with time - or maybe some practices they will designate more vanilla D

- Shane Ray jumped out a few times - dude looks like a LB but is fast and strong - I learned pretty quick who #49 was and was able to stop having to reference roster sheet 

- It will make for a nice scene in the Disney film - but Hamlin's "int" was def not a pick six 1) Whistle blew, play was dead 2) QB just chucked the ball in the air in frustration after play was dead and ball just floats to Hamlin playing centerfield 3) Hamlin starts running down the field with a convoy of defenders while most of offense just stands there thinking hey play was whistled sack 4) Quesenberry hustled over to knock him out of bounds way before the EZ just to make sure

- Just after Hamlin came off and the little dude from yesterday, his brother, came over and excitedly jumped all over him.  Was a nice scene.  His parents were also on the field

- Kyle Alen has not looked sharp the amount I've seen him

- Overall kind of a low energy practice IMO - with lots of sloppiness on offense - multiple delays, Offside, blown up plays - some to the credit of the D.  Didn't realize unti halfway thru that McD wasn't there - that might have had something to do w/ the overall lack of energy/execution 

- Didn't realize til after that Kay Adams was in the house - prob a good thing - if I knew I likely would have missed majority of actual practice with my binocs peeled on sideline trying to find her 😛 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 1, 2023 by stevewin

[Lost]

JA17 post practice interview with Kay Adams.   I think she's smitten by him

 

 

[GoBills808]

15 minutes ago, stevewin said:

Random observations from practice today:

 

- Shorter out there again early on JUGS machine - spent a long time doing nothing but over the shoulder which I had never seen anyone do so long on a JUGS machine before.  Isabella joined him later - did all his reps while high stepping.  These two seem to work hard am rooting for them both

- Tre and Elam went over to JUGS next - Tre in bare feet.  He also walked out onto the field in bare feet - that's definitely the first time I've seen that

- Shakir has signed for everyone last two days at VIP fence before tunnel.  A couple guys flagged down Floyd and each had an 8x10 of him with the Rams, and at first I was thinking wow there's a couple serious Leonard Floyd fans - then I saw later they had a whole portfolio of 8x10s of players and they would bring out the proper pic as players walked by.  Later I saw them talking to DJ Milk - figure maybe it was for charity or something vs them just selling for profit later

- Each day when Kyle Allen runs out there's a big cheer then pause then chorus of laughter when people realize it is not Josh.  Do people not know Josh's number?

- Before stretch they did half speed goal line - with defense not trying they still absent-mindedly knocked down a shovel pass.  It seems offense is intent on making the goal line shovel pass a thing

- During the stretch a trainer was off with Josh working on his arm again - I assume that is a daily routine now to stretch him out vs it being treatment for something bothering him

- Majority defense off to side field, STs work and offense working on run plays

- Diggs with nothing much to do on far side during this period throws a ball into the stands then mostly trolls them the rest of the time after he's worked kids into a frenzy "Diggs! Diggs! Diggs!"  trying to get him to throw another (never understood why kids scream a players last name for attention/autographs - comes off as rude to me)

- Never seen so many people in VIP area in front of far stands - 4-5 deep.  Until recently the far last section of stands was also reserved for VIP which was sweet if you were in that group - could watch practice from stands then wander down to field level if you wanted - now all stands are general

- Another long boring ST session - OL doing drills far EZ, QBs practicing movment in pocket drills

- QBs throwing to TEs against air, WRs doing a drill getting hit with pad about 5yds from release.  In previous years with Chad Hall I remember the receivers doing a ton of hand fighting and very physical get off the line drills against press punishment - haven't seen that this camp the two practices I've been to

- Kincaid makes a nice one handed grab gets a rise out of crowd - looks like he stumbled just a bit on his break and recovered with one hand stab

- Caught a T-shirt

- QBs rotating w/ WRs against air.  Josh and DIggs had a long discussion after one rep

- Full def comes back - OL/DL batttles one side, more ST middle, far left WR/DB 1-1s at goal line

- I missed a lot of the 1-1 battles (one of my favorite parts) because stupid people standing in the aisle and constant traffic in/out of my row (get off my lawn).  Few that I saw

   - Isabella held by Benford after nice release

   - Harty beats Jackson to the corner

   - Neal shut down Davis not sure wth Davis was doing dancing around

   - Shorter nice over the shoulder corner route over Ingram (same thing he was practicing on JUGS)

   - Cam Lewis nice PBU on Shakir

   - Diggs abuses Tre quick slant.  Nasty

- 11-11 - this session was almost exclusively dedicated to runs - included

   - Cook nice speed outside

   - Murray gets around edge nice gain

   - Barkley (the one pass) nice rollout to Morris - same play as yesterday

   - Barkley fumble snap

   - Spector awesome stuff on RB for TFL

   - Another TFL up middle didn't get number

   - One other attempted pass defense just engulfed Josh immediately - whistle blows for sack and in frustration Josh jumps and fires a 30 yd laser sidearm which hits Diggs in the numbers

   - Tre TFL coming off edge

   - Murray nice run up the middle - one of the few times anything got through the middle of the line

- Offense walk through of plays against air - started out with 4-5 diff screens - then just WRs doing respective routes for play call

- Some more 11-11, not sure if goal was to make a first 3rd and long each time - included

   - Harty gets lit up over middle by Rapp short of 1st

   - Sweet bullet by Josh to Davis between defenders

   - Sack

   - 20 yds Sahkir

   - Diggs beats Tre sideline

   - Josh throws long but misses Kincaid short who got behind entire defense by 5 yds would have been easy TD (Hamlin was one safety not sure who the other was)

   - Oliver chases Josh right back into line of players watching - hardly had time to react

   - Epenesa comes untouched - Josh had a few words for Dion

   - Epenesa looks fast the times I've noticed him (even with actual players impeding his way) - haven't noticed Basham at all

   - Cam Lewis lights up murray - crazy good hit - made a very big man go flying

   - Next play Murray gets ball in flat and turning up field could see he was looking for revenge - and revenge he got - stiff armed Dane into the ground and possibly further

   - At one point Diggs caught a contested sideline catch against Elam, started upfield, then turned around and stopped and stared at him before continuing up the field 😛 

   - Josh throws a rocket - a ROCKET - to Davis flying down the sideline who stretches out and makes a beautiful catch with his fingertips in stride.  Looked like defenders might have let up after he caught instead of trying to light him up, so live action might have been tackled before taking it to house.  When Josh let it rip my first thought was he is PISSED (the O was not clicking) and just whipped that ball as hard as he could.  It was one of those throws you shake your head afterwards and mutter "oh my god"

   - Cook nice catch out of backfield and upfield turn.  He is so natural catching the ball and getting right upfield - will be exciting to see him involved more this year

   - Milano breaks up sideline pass to Kincaid.  Splitting hairs, but Kincaid didn't make the best play on the ball from what I saw - kind of let it hit him in the chest - but for sure elite play by Milano to stay on him step for step all the way down the field and break up the play

   - Josh flushed out, Cam Lewis sack consecutive plays

   - Josh bomb to Shakir - Lewis and Rapp both converge and knock ball away.  If ball was a few feet further Shakir would have had a better chance to hold on

- Overall D has just been taking it to O, but they have been throwing a lot of stuff at them -  I saw CB blitzes, zone blitzes with all diff DL dropping, players coming from everywhere.  While undoubtedly the idea is to get the O to learn under fire, I don't think they are getting as many quality live reps in passing game because a lot of the time a QB is under duress just checking down if they even get it off.  I guess that will come with time - or maybe some practices they will designate more vanilla D

- Shane Ray jumped out a few times - dude looks like a LB but is fast and strong - I learned pretty quick who #49 was and was able to stop having to reference roster sheet 

- It will make for a nice scene in the Disney film - but Hamlin's "int" was def not a pick six 1) Whistle blew, play was dead 2) QB just chucked the ball in the air in frustration after play was dead and ball just floats to Hamlin playing centerfield 3) Hamlin starts running down the field with a convoy of defenders while most of offense just stands there thinking hey play was whistled sack 4) Quesenberry hustled over to knock him out of bounds way before the EZ just to make sure

- Just after Hamlin came off and the little dude from yesterday, his brother, came over and excitedly jumped all over him.  Was a nice scene.  His parents were also on the field

- Kyle Alen has not looked sharp the amount I've seen him

- Overall kind of a low energy practice IMO - with lots of sloppiness on offense - multiple delays, Offside, blown up plays - some to the credit of the D.  Didn't realize unti halfway thru that McD wasn't there - that might have had something to do w/ the overall lack of energy/execution 

- Didn't realize til after that Kay Adams was in the house - prob a good thing - if I knew I likely would have missed majority of actual practice with my binocs peeled on sideline trying to find her 😛 

 

 

 

 

Great stuff ty🤙🤙