Has Miami really closed the gap?

[Doc]

22 minutes ago, eball said:

Saleh is a successful HC? I think the jury is still out on that one…

 

Yeah, getting a HOF QB to replace your QB-of-choice who flamed-out was luck.

[Beck Water]

https://www.si.com/nfl/dolphins/news/miami-dolphins-ten-things-kellly-column

11 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

Miami goes as far as Tua takes them. You pull all these stats and thump your chest about beating them stats wise.. meanwhile on the scoreboard the games were very close both under 7 points. 
 

like the Bills had twice the number of yards than Miami in week 3 but scored only 19 points and lost… ok it was disgustingly hot.. but 19 points with over 400 yards… that’s hard to do. 
 

lmao your going bring up the wildcard game where they had what a 3rd string QB playing? And yet the Bills at home barely bet them by 3 points? 
 

point is they are a very talented team and you could have lost to them in the playoffs, which would have been embarrassing. 

 

'sup, Pats Fan, trying to make that 20 -7 loss you sustained to the Fins in the season opener feel better?

 

You're not wrong that we could have lost to them in the playoffs and that it would have been VERY embarrassing, but .....if the Dolphins are indeed such talented team now, why would that embarrassment be true?  In fact, it would have been embarrassing because the Bills played a very sloppy game once they got up 17-0, including 2 picks and 4 fumbles (1 lost) and gave up 15 points off turnovers.

[Patrick Duffy]

Just now, PatsFanNH said:

Miami goes as far as Tua takes them. You pull all these stats and thump your chest about beating them stats wise.. meanwhile on the scoreboard the games were very close both under 7 points. 
 

like the Bills had twice the number of yards than Miami in week 3 but scored only 19 points and lost… ok it was disgustingly hot.. but 19 points with over 400 yards… that’s hard to do. 
 

lmao your going bring up the wildcard game where they had what a 3rd string QB playing? And yet the Bills at home barely bet them by 3 points? 
 

point is they are a very talented team and you could have lost to them in the playoffs, which would have been embarrassing. 

 

While I agree for the most part from their offense last season, however I'm interested to see what happens this season now that teams have studied their offense and knowing how to defend it better.

 

 

[Augie]

4 minutes ago, Patrick Duffy said:

 

While I agree for the most part from their offense last season, however I'm interested to see what happens this season now that teams have studied their offense and knowing how to defend it better.

 

 

 

As I believe GunnerBill pointed out, they seemed to have been at least partially figured out already last year. I think they scored about 29 ppg early in the season with a healthy Tua, then closer to 20 ppg for the last 4 games. I think I got that right, but if my memory failed me……I’ll just blame him somehow.  😋

[eball]

20 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Yeah, getting a HOF QB to replace your QB-of-choice who flamed-out was luck.

 

11-23 as a HC and riding a current 6-game losing streak.

 

[Billl]

1 hour ago, Beck Water said:

 

You said: " So my question is, if Miami hasn’t shown that they belong in a conversation with Buffalo, what has Buffalo done to belong in a conversation with Kansas City?" 

 

The answer is, beaten you at home 38-20 and 24-20 in the last 2 regular season games, and taken the game to 13 seconds and a coin flip in the 2021 AFC Division round.

You didn't ask about the Bengals, Championships won, etc.

 

If you don't like that answer, fine, but "we're 2x Superbowl Champions and You're Not, Nah Nah" doesn't seem like much of a response, especially since in fact, the Bengals pretty much embarrassed the Chiefs in the 2021 AFC championship - it wasn't as close as the final score - supporting the idea that the Bills gave the Chiefs everything they could handle and depleted them the prior game.  Then there's that 31-9 loss to Tampa in the 2020 Superbowl, wanna brag on that?

WTF is this mess supposed to mean?  The Bengals Chiefs game (that the Bengals never led until the game winning kick in OT) wasn't as close as the score indicated?  And that has something to do with the Bills relative standing to the Chiefs how?

 

The entire premise of this topic is that somehow the Dolphins haven't achieved enough to be talked about in the same breath as the Bills.  At the same time, the argument is made that the Bills belong in the same conversation as the Chiefs.  There is simply no reasonable way to square that circle.  

 

The Dolphins have beaten the Bills recently in the regular season and have played them to the wire in the playoffs.  If that doesn't qualify them to be in the same tier as Buffalo, then nothing the Bills have done puts them in the same class as the Chiefs.  

 

You chose to answer the bolded part of my question while ignoring the rest of it, so I'll ask it in reverse.  If being the Chiefs in the regular season but losing to them in the postseason means the Bills belong in the same conversation as the Chiefs, then why doesn't the Dolphins doing the same to the Bills mean they belong in the same conversation as Buffalo?

[GoBills808]

3 minutes ago, Billl said:

WTF is this mess supposed to mean?  The Bengals Chiefs game (that the Bengals never led until the game winning kick in OT) wasn't as close as the score indicated?  And that has something to do with the Bills relative standing to the Chiefs how?

 

The entire premise of this topic is that somehow the Dolphins haven't achieved enough to be talked about in the same breath as the Bills.  At the same time, the argument is made that the Bills belong in the same conversation as the Chiefs.  There is simply no reasonable way to square that circle.  

 

The Dolphins have beaten the Bills recently in the regular season and have played them to the wire in the playoffs.  If that doesn't qualify them to be in the same tier as Buffalo, then nothing the Bills have done puts them in the same class as the Chiefs.  

 

You chose to answer the bolded part of my question while ignoring the rest of it, so I'll ask it in reverse.  If being the Chiefs in the regular season but losing to them in the postseason means the Bills belong in the same conversation as the Chiefs, then why doesn't the Dolphins doing the same to the Bills mean they belong in the same conversation as Buffalo?

Chiefs are +600 to win Super Bowl, Bills are +900, Dolphins are........+2600

[Captain Hindsight]

48 minutes ago, eball said:

 

11-23 as a HC and riding a current 6-game losing streak.

 

Yeah I think Salah is overrated personally. They jumped from 32 to 4 on defense and everyone just expects them to keep rolling with that? History suggests they will regress to the mean a bit 

[LABILLBACKER]

1 hour ago, Patrick Duffy said:

 

While I agree for the most part from their offense last season, however I'm interested to see what happens this season now that teams have studied their offense and knowing how to defend it better.

 

 

The Fins are one more early Tua concussion away from going after Caleb Williams.  I just don't see any realistic path were Tua stays healthy long term.  The Bills blowing big leads in the playoffs (Houston/ Mia) feels more like a coaching issue than anything. Whether you blame Frazier,  Dorsey or McD is interchangeable. They must find a way of eliminating careless turnovers with these leads.  

[Success]

Pretty anxious for the season to start, so some of the speculating can come to a halt.

 

I'm getting AFC West 2022 vibes about the 2023 AFC East.  I don't think that many - even a lot of fans here - understand how challenging it will be to stop the Bills offense this year, with an improved line, improved running game and better weapons straight down the line after Diggs.

 

The D may be more of a question mark, but with Von, Hyde & Poyer coming back healthy, other additions, and Tre hopefully rounding back into form - as well as McD calling what one would expect to be a more aggressive philosophy overall - I think this team should be favored to win the division title by a wide margin.

 

[billsbackto81]

43 minutes ago, Billl said:

WTF is this mess supposed to mean?  The Bengals Chiefs game (that the Bengals never led until the game winning kick in OT) wasn't as close as the score indicated?  And that has something to do with the Bills relative standing to the Chiefs how?

 

The entire premise of this topic is that somehow the Dolphins haven't achieved enough to be talked about in the same breath as the Bills.  At the same time, the argument is made that the Bills belong in the same conversation as the Chiefs.  There is simply no reasonable way to square that circle.  

 

The Dolphins have beaten the Bills recently in the regular season and have played them to the wire in the playoffs.  If that doesn't qualify them to be in the same tier as Buffalo, then nothing the Bills have done puts them in the same class as the Chiefs.  

 

You chose to answer the bolded part of my question while ignoring the rest of it, so I'll ask it in reverse.  If being the Chiefs in the regular season but losing to them in the postseason means the Bills belong in the same conversation as the Chiefs, then why doesn't the Dolphins doing the same to the Bills mean they belong in the same conversation as Buffalo?

Why not the same breath? Achievement wise Miami hasn't won the division since 2008. They haven't won a playoff game in over 20 years. Bills have 3 straight afce titles and playoff appearances in 4 straight and have 4 wins in that span.

 

Because of the recent body of work, let's say the last 5 seasons. 

 

Before beating an injury riddled team in 105 degree heat while still yielding 500 yards of offense and a moral victory loss with a backup QB they've lost 9 of 10 head2head match ups. Most of them in a throttling, behind the woodshed type fashion. 

 

Not saying they won't be a better team this year. Just saying once again, what have they proven?

 

 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

50 minutes ago, Billl said:

WTF is this mess supposed to mean?  The Bengals Chiefs game (that the Bengals never led until the game winning kick in OT) wasn't as close as the score indicated?  And that has something to do with the Bills relative standing to the Chiefs how?

 

The entire premise of this topic is that somehow the Dolphins haven't achieved enough to be talked about in the same breath as the Bills.  At the same time, the argument is made that the Bills belong in the same conversation as the Chiefs.  There is simply no reasonable way to square that circle.  

 

The Dolphins have beaten the Bills recently in the regular season and have played them to the wire in the playoffs.  If that doesn't qualify them to be in the same tier as Buffalo, then nothing the Bills have done puts them in the same class as the Chiefs.  

 

You chose to answer the bolded part of my question while ignoring the rest of it, so I'll ask it in reverse.  If being the Chiefs in the regular season but losing to them in the postseason means the Bills belong in the same conversation as the Chiefs, then why doesn't the Dolphins doing the same to the Bills mean they belong in the same conversation as Buffalo?

I think the bills are closer to the Chiefs then the Dolphins are to the bills. But all the teams are pretty close. Does that basically mean the Dolphins are on the same level as the Chiefs?

 

or is it all about matchups? I think it’s pretty clear the bills match up very well with the Chiefs. Not so well with the Bengals in my opinion. 

 

much rather see the Chiefs in the playoffs as opposed to the Bengals again.

[eball]

1 hour ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

I think the bills are closer to the Chiefs then the Dolphins are to the bills. But all the teams are pretty close. Does that basically mean the Dolphins are on the same level as the Chiefs?

 

or is it all about matchups? I think it’s pretty clear the bills match up very well with the Chiefs. Not so well with the Bengals in my opinion. 

 

much rather see the Chiefs in the playoffs as opposed to the Bengals again.

 

The Bills match up just fine with the Bengals when we have our full complement of defensive players.

 

[BillsFan130]

Was there a quote from Josh saying that the bills might only get in as a wild card or something like that?

 

My dolphins buddy is chirping me about that quote but never heard him say anything like that 

Edited August 2, 2023 by BillsFan130

[Patrick Duffy]

Just now, BillsFan130 said:

Was there a quote from Josh saying that the bills might get in as a wild card or something like that?

 

My dolphins buddy is chirping me about that quote but never heard him say anything like that 

 

I don't recall such a thing either, buddy is confused or making it up to try messing with you.

[BillsFan130]

Just now, Patrick Duffy said:

 

I don't recall such a thing either, buddy is confused or making it up to try messing with you.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cvc1CuSrFUG/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
 

Ya here’s the link^.

 

doesn’t add up though 

[Beck Water]

2 hours ago, Billl said:

WTF is this mess supposed to mean? 

 

It means I answered your question.  Simple as that

 

2 hours ago, Billl said:

You chose to answer the bolded part of my question while ignoring the rest of it

 

You'd never know I answered it if from your response.  And dude, seriously - this is a message board.  People can respond to your post specifically or to any part of your post specifically.  We are not limited to the premise of the topic, or to the entirely of your post, or the point you feel we should discuss.  It's frustrating sometimes, when I make a nice post and people pick out one little bit to respond to - but that's Life on a Message Board.

 

2 hours ago, Billl said:

The entire premise of this topic is that somehow the Dolphins haven't achieved enough to be talked about in the same breath as the Bills.  At the same time, the argument is made that the Bills belong in the same conversation as the Chiefs.  There is simply no reasonable way to square that circle. 

 

Dude, seriously?  You need this answered?

 

Briefly, the Dolphins W-L record, the quality of their offense and defense as shown by league ranking, and their single playoff appearance and loss, are not on the same par as the Bills.  Yet.  Meanwhile, the Bills W-L record, the quality of their offense and defense as shown by league ranking, and their playoff appearances and wins, along with their two regular season victories and the "13 seconds" very close Divisional game in 2021, are thought by most football-knowledgeable people to put them in the same conversation as the Chiefs.  Equal, no, in the same convo, yes.

 

The Dolphins, for the past four seasons, are 5-11, 10-6, 9-8, 9-8.  They've been to one playoff game, and lost it.  We're in their division, we play twice a season, they know us well and play us hard, especially when we have to go to Miami early in the season where they par-broil their opponents.  They have a new coach, maybe they're like the 2019 Bills and they're on the rise and will take the league by storm this season.  Maybe Vic Fangio will have their defense Rockin' and Rollin.  But until they show that, the idea that they're in the same conversation as the Bills rates Not Proven. 

 

The analogous thing would be if someone asked a KC fan, Why aren't the Chargers spoken about in the same breath as the Chiefs?  In 2020 and 2021, they've beaten you. They were 10-7 last season, were within 3 points of beating the Chiefs and could have beaten you both games, went to the playoffs where they could have won (within 1 point).  They could be a team on the rise.  But until they show they are, they're not talked about in the same breath as the Chiefs because they haven't, overall, yet, shown that they deserve to be. 

 

Maybe stop trying to square circles?

 

Edited August 2, 2023 by Beck Water

[mjt328]

For the media, the offseason is all about making bold (and often ridiculous) predictions.

Without actual games, what else can they really do to catch people's attention?

 

Last year, the AFC West teams all made their big moves to catch Kansas City.  Combining that with the loss of Tyreek Hill, and there were TONS of media personalities predicting the Chargers, Raiders or Broncos to finish a top the division.  Of course none of it came remotely true, and all the doubters probably gave the Chiefs even more motivation.

 

In regards to the AFC East, I've noticed a pattern during the offseason where the talking heads keep trying to "one-up" each other.  At first, the talk was about how Buffalo's window was possibly closing soon.  Then you started hearing that Miami or New York could possibly dethrone us.  Before long, most predictions had us in a Wild Card slot.  Last week, one of the major outlets had us 9-8 and third place.  

 

 

 

[PatsFanNH]

4 hours ago, Beck Water said:

https://www.si.com/nfl/dolphins/news/miami-dolphins-ten-things-kellly-column

 

'sup, Pats Fan, trying to make that 20 -7 loss you sustained to the Fins in the season opener feel better?

 

You're not wrong that we could have lost to them in the playoffs and that it would have been VERY embarrassing, but .....if the Dolphins are indeed such talented team now, why would that embarrassment be true?  In fact, it would have been embarrassing because the Bills played a very sloppy game once they got up 17-0, including 2 picks and 4 fumbles (1 lost) and gave up 15 points off turnovers.

LOL it would have been embarrassing because they had a rookie Skylar(?) Thompson playing QB for them and he was a 7th rounder at that.  Ok think of it like this if Buffalo had lost Allen as well as  your backup QB and were down to some rookie you never heard of and came within 3 points of beating KC. Would you say that the teams are pretty close talent wise and that the QB factor was the deciding fact in the loss and if you had Allen you would have won easily? (Thats what most NON Bills fan see in that WC Game.) Mind you that was the second week in a row I thought Buffalo just looked tired and slow. I mean they let NE hang around and well my Pats absolutely stunk last year.

 

In the end anyone look at the two squads and on O your close to even with QB the Bills have an edge but WR the Phins have the edge. The gap is closed for now.

 

 

3 hours ago, Patrick Duffy said:

 

While I agree for the most part from their offense last season, however I'm interested to see what happens this season now that teams have studied their offense and knowing how to defend it better.

 

 

Valid points, I think they beefed up their D this year if I am remembering their moves correctly. I still think they will be good on 0 as long as Tua stays healthy. I just don't know if he can.

[C.Biscuit97]

Miami has one of the best rosters in the NFL. Mike Grier’s brother has done a great job. They might have a top 5 coaching staff. But Tuan’s health is a huge question mark. 
 

so I would I be shocked if Miami is a big time contender this year and has a better record than us?  Not really. But Miami teams are soft and will fade late in the season. I cannot picture a scenario where that team wins a cold weather game.