Training camp 7/27 9:45 AM

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

28 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I mean what, do you want them to hand Elam the job if he isn't progressing in understanding his role and how to defend in a zone defense well enough?  Reports from camp yesterday was that he was giving up receptions in coverage, while running with the 2's.

 

People have a Jones here talking about how McDermott won't play rookies (or young players) for mysterious reasons even though the poor trodden upon rookies are so much better than the guy who is out there.

 

News flash, when rookies have been better than the alternative, they've played. 

Tre White: 16 starts as a rookie.

Dion Dawkins: 11 starts as a rookie

Zay Jones: 10 starts as a rookie (no, he wasn't good, but he was better than the alternative)

Tre Edmunds: 15 games as a rookie (again, made mistakes, but better than the alternative)

Ed Oliver: 7 starts as a rookie, including being benched for a few games.  Phillips was better.

Cody Ford: 15 starts as a rookie

 

As a team overall improves, and is more attractive to FA, it becomes harder and harder for a rookie to be "better than the alternative"

 

But the truth is, rookies get playing time if they deserve it by being better than the alternative, and lose playing time if they don't.  And deserving isn't limited to a few good plays fans see, it means understanding the play call and their role and being in the right place doing the right thing every play.

 

My problem is that when in actual games I have seen better standout play from Elam than Jackson or even Benford. Maybe McDermott doesn't like how he's fitting in the scheme, but it's discouraging to see someone who we all know has hit an unimpressive ceiling being given a shot over someone who we have seen surpass it.

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

Gimme that presnap motion.

[Manther]

32 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Sherfield is going to look really good in gym shorts… until the pads and games start and he’ll go back to being a JAG… cross fingers for Kincaid to take off running and one of Shakir/Harty to emerge/stay healthy. 

Sherfield could be more than a JAG.  He was behind some great WRs in Miami last year.  If he gets reps I think he will make plays.  When he plays his stats are solid.

[HappyDays]

I have never been this excited about a Bills rookie.

[Don Otreply]

29 minutes ago, teef said:

It’s raining.  A lot.  That’s all I can add.  

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

29 minutes ago, teef said:

It’s raining.  A lot.  That’s all I can add.  

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

29 minutes ago, teef said:

It’s raining.  A lot.  That’s all I can add.  

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

[Roundybout]

Screw Hopkins!

[Don Otreply]

29 minutes ago, teef said:

It’s raining.  A lot.  That’s all I can add.  

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

29 minutes ago, teef said:

It’s raining.  A lot.  That’s all I can add.  

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

29 minutes ago, teef said:

It’s raining.  A lot.  That’s all I can add.  

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

[Beck Water]

 

I mean yes, but during the days when the Bills WR were John Brown, Cole Beasley, and Isaiah McKenzie, physical press man teams just mugged them in press man, and took them away.   A small guy can play bigger than his size, and a big guy won't necessarily play physically enough, but other things being equal, size does matter.***

 

***obligatory "That's What She Said"

Edited July 27, 2023 by Beck Water

[78thealltimegreat]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

I have never been this excited about a Bills rookie.

All these early reports are confirming what Daniel Jeremiah said on draft night ….if the league allows Dalton Kincaid to play with Josh Allen it gets what it deserves…

[Beck Water]

1 minute ago, Roundybout said:

Screw Hopkins!

 

 

 

[BeavercreekBillsFan]

21 minutes ago, SCBills said:

 

Yup.  For as long as Josh Allen is here, we have a Super Bowl window, but with his cap hits starting to become reflective of the QB he is... there isn't going to be the ability to bring in another Von Miller because we can't hit on DL picks.

 

We have got to start getting production from young players, early in their rookie contracts.  

 

Can't have a guy like AJE finally click when we have to pay him, or Ed Oliver finally become what we want him to be when he's making big money... these guys have to start producing in Year 1...Year 2...  Is Boogie Basham even going to make the team?

 

Now Year 2 for Kaiir Elam, at a money position. I can live with Benford if he wins it.. he might just be very good while overlooked at a small school.. but we know what Dane Jackson is, and Dane Jackson should not be beating out a Year 2 RD1 Corner.  This can't keep happening if we want to stay a top contender. 

 

This. Too many AJE, Basham, Bernard, Elam type picks to continue to remain viable in the AFC where everyone else at the top is nailing their draft picks. Elam is clearly better and should be getting the reps. He could form that dynamic duo with Tre. Instead we think Dane will be able to hang with the #2 WRs on the other teams? Yeah right. Beane has hit on some nice picks but we are going to look back and wonder what if when it comes to this era of bills football. We can’t keep lighting 3rd round picks on fire like they don’t matter. We can’t keep putting Spencer brown out there thinking josh won’t get murdered again all year while the bengals and chiefs make the right moves. 

[Beck Water]

 

[whorlnut]

2 minutes ago, BeavercreekBillsFan said:

This. Too many AJE, Basham, Bernard, Elam type picks to continue to remain viable in the AFC where everyone else at the top is nailing their draft picks. Elam is clearly better and should be getting the reps. He could form that dynamic duo with Tre. Instead we think Dane will be able to hang with the #2 WRs on the other teams? Yeah right. Beane has hit on some nice picks but we are going to look back and wonder what if when it comes to this era of bills football. We can’t keep lighting 3rd round picks on fire like they don’t matter. We can’t keep putting Spencer brown out there thinking josh won’t get murdered again all year while the bengals and chiefs make the right moves. 

Elam is “clearly” better?  I think Benford might have something to say about this competition before it’s said and done. He missed a lot of time last year and also some good development opportunities. At this point, it completely reasonable that benford might be better than Elam. 

[Beck Water]

 

 

[boyst]

1 hour ago, Beck Water said:

 

Does anyone know what the blue object Diggs is holding in his had might be?  He had one in his hand as he came out of the tunnel yesterday, as well.

 

It looks like a rubber band commonly used to help warm up glutes and legs. 

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

3 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

All these early reports are confirming what Daniel Jeremiah said on draft night ….if the league allows Dalton Kincaid to play with Josh Allen it gets what it deserves…

The more I see, the happier I am with the pick.

 

One, because I am in general a fan of 2 TE sets. Two, because the biggest weakness we had on offense last year was when teams devoted their gameplan to purely shutting down Diggs we never had a consistent second punch to make them pay. If Kincaid is what we hope, if teams put in an extra safety to treat him as a possession slot WR you are locking them into nickel while having Know on the field to block for Cook. If they put a LB on him there aren't many in the league that will be able to keep coverage on him. Do the Bills need a third and short, but want to keep the personnel grouping for the D? Congrats, you can go no huddle and have Kincaid act as a FB.

 

That's the plan anyway. 

[Don Otreply]

40 minutes ago, teef said:

It’s raining.  A lot.  That’s all I can add.  

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

40 minutes ago, teef said:

It’s raining.  A lot.  That’s all I can add.  

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

[Beck Water]

 

 

 

[Lost]

11 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

 

11 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

 

1 minute ago, Don Otreply said:

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

I understand that everything gets wet when that happens, 

 

Are you okay?  🤣

[Big Blitz]

Maybe Benford is just the real deal.  
 

I still believe it’s the tackling that separates him from Elam - at the moment.  
 

But it’s possible he’s just a better corner.   

[Beck Water]

3 minutes ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

The more I see, the happier I am with the pick.

 

One, because I am in general a fan of 2 TE sets. Two, because the biggest weakness we had on offense last year was when teams devoted their gameplan to purely shutting down Diggs we never had a consistent second punch to make them pay. If Kincaid is what we hope, if teams put in an extra safety to treat him as a possession slot WR you are locking them into nickel while having Know on the field to block for Cook. If they put a LB on him there aren't many in the league that will be able to keep coverage on him. Do the Bills need a third and short, but want to keep the personnel grouping for the D? Congrats, you can go no huddle and have Kincaid act as a FB.

 

That's the plan anyway. 

 

I don't think Kincaid will have the blocking chops to act as a fullback, not first thing as a rookie, anyway.  JMO based on scouting reports pre-draft.  If he learns to release off the line against press man and outfight physical NFL play as a receiver, that will be enough.

 

 

 

 

Edited July 27, 2023 by Beck Water