Barbie vs Oppenheimer

[Logic]

On 8/8/2023 at 9:05 AM, Johnny Hammersticks said:

I haven’t seen either movie, but last night my wife took my 9 year old daughter and 13 year old son to see the Barbie movie.  I didn’t think my son would be too interested, but he was bored so he tagged along.

 

When he got home I asked him how the movie was, and his response was interesting and kind of caught me off guard.

 

He was noticeably a bit miffed, and felt as though the movie really portrayed men in a crappy and unfair way.  He said during one point in the movie when the characters went into the “real world” the men were depicted as misogynistic (my word based on his description) pigs…essentially.

 

He was kind of upset about the whole thing.  Anyway, just sharing the perspective of a very well adjusted, bright, and kind 13 year old boy.  My wife and daughter both enjoyed the movie.

For those that haven't seen Barbie or don't plan to...

The basic premise of the movie is that Barbie lives in perfect Barbie World, where everything is perfect and harmonious between men and women, and everything in life is perfect in general, all the time. Cracks start to show (like Barbie spontaneously pondering the notion of death), and she ends up venturing out into the real world (our world) to try to find answers. 

Once there, she discovers that things are not as harmonious as they are in Barbie World. That men and women do not seem to be on equal footing in society, that sexualization and mistreatment of women seems to happen frequently (for instance, she's cat-called by construction workers, leered at by a few male passers-by, etc), and that the real world features a patriarchal society -- a notion and term with which Barbie was not familiar. She is quite miffed and discouraged by this turn of events, and the movie proceeds from there.

Now, I'm not going to get pulled into a socio-political discussion about this premise or about feminism or the patriarchy. I have no interest in doing so in this setting. I WILL say that I understand why the filmmaker went this route. The Barbie toy line has a long history of promoting the idea that women can do anything, be doctors, lawyers, astronauts, presidents, etc. Even at its inception, it was the first doll for young girls that wasn't a baby doll. It switched the mode of play from "let's pretend to be moms" to "let's pretend to be stylish, beautiful women". It has always pushed a sort of empowerment of women. Having this empowerment butt up against the modern western world is an understandable filmmaking impulse, however you may feel about the specifics.

If you're reading all this and thinking "This doesn't sound like it's for children", you'd be mostly right. There are certainly lots of funny moments, bright colors, identifiable Barbie related sight gags, etc, but I'd imagine a lot of kids, especially young ones, will be bored or lost. Anyone who was familiar with the previous work of Director Greta Gerwig and co-writer Noah Baumbach, though, could have told you that it was going to be a bit weird, reflective, and melancholic. Nevertheless, the filmmakers must have done SOMETHING right, as it has topped $1 Billion at the box office and continues to do well, weekend after weekend. It's a sensation.

Edited August 9, 2023 by Logic

[muppy]

I finally have seen both of these movies. And clearly opinions are subjective so there is that.

 

But I would score the Barbie movie about a 3 out of 10 stars. I found myself rolling my eyes at much of it.  I told hubby walking to the car that it struck me as the kind of movie that could become a cult classic ....Remember the Rocky Horror Picture Show? I hated that movie when I first saw it. It was all the hoopla at midnight screenings and audience participation theater  afterwards that made it more fun for me.

 

I could see there being a Barbie cult group forming. LOL 

 

Oppenheimer on the other hand was LONG but well acted and interesting. One of those movies you see once and very likely never again. I learned a lot from watching it. Solid 8 out of 10

[LeGOATski]

TMNT: Mutant Mayhem was better than both these movies

[boyst]

On 8/9/2023 at 11:50 AM, Logic said:

For those that haven't seen Barbie or don't plan to...

The basic premise of the movie is that Barbie lives in perfect Barbie World, where everything is perfect and harmonious between men and women, and everything in life is perfect in general, all the time. Cracks start to show (like Barbie spontaneously pondering the notion of death), and she ends up venturing out into the real world (our world) to try to find answers. 

Once there, she discovers that things are not as harmonious as they are in Barbie World. That men and women do not seem to be on equal footing in society, that sexualization and mistreatment of women seems to happen frequently (for instance, she's cat-called by construction workers, leered at by a few male passers-by, etc), and that the real world features a patriarchal society -- a notion and term with which Barbie was not familiar. She is quite miffed and discouraged by this turn of events, and the movie proceeds from there.

Now, I'm not going to get pulled into a socio-political discussion about this premise or about feminism or the patriarchy. I have no interest in doing so in this setting. I WILL say that I understand why the filmmaker went this route. The Barbie toy line has a long history of promoting the idea that women can do anything, be doctors, lawyers, astronauts, presidents, etc. Even at its inception, it was the first doll for young girls that wasn't a baby doll. It switched the mode of play from "let's pretend to be moms" to "let's pretend to be stylish, beautiful women". It has always pushed a sort of empowerment of women. Having this empowerment butt up against the modern western world is an understandable filmmaking impulse, however you may feel about the specifics.

If you're reading all this and thinking "This doesn't sound like it's for children", you'd be mostly right. There are certainly lots of funny moments, bright colors, identifiable Barbie related sight gags, etc, but I'd imagine a lot of kids, especially young ones, will be bored or lost. Anyone who was familiar with the previous work of Director Greta Gerwig and co-writer Noah Baumbach, though, could have told you that it was going to be a bit weird, reflective, and melancholic. Nevertheless, the filmmakers must have done SOMETHING right, as it has topped $1 Billion at the box office and continues to do well, weekend after weekend. It's a sensation.

Young girls don't have barbie and never heard of them. The relics of barbie, Disney, etc are the parents and grandparents.

 

Girls don't know these toys. My niece & her friends, other folks I know it has come up. If you're under 15-16 you don't know Barbie as a toy. The name familiarity, sure.

 

Also, Mattel has greenlit over 40 different movie scripts to be done because of the movie.

 

And, the whole feminism in the Western world; I've read European reviews of the film. They were not kind to American ideology and how this film is hypocritical, etc.  Of course this was a few articles (one German, one English).  The view of this movie and it's appeal is very niche and very well carved out.

[teef]

21 hours ago, boyst said:

Young girls don't have barbie and never heard of them. The relics of barbie, Disney, etc are the parents and grandparents.

 

Girls don't know these toys. My niece & her friends, other folks I know it has come up. If you're under 15-16 you don't know Barbie as a toy. The name familiarity, sure.

 

Also, Mattel has greenlit over 40 different movie scripts to be done because of the movie.

 

And, the whole feminism in the Western world; I've read European reviews of the film. They were not kind to American ideology and how this film is hypocritical, etc.  Of course this was a few articles (one German, one English).  The view of this movie and it's appeal is very niche and very well carved out.

my daughter is 8 and she had tons of barbies.  we went to our friends house who has 4 girls under 7 years old, and there were barbies everywhere.

[LeGOATski]

I've never seen a shortage of Barbie stuff in the toy aisle. Definitely still a toy for the current generation

[boyst]

23 minutes ago, teef said:

my daughter is 8 and she had tons of barbies.  we went to our friends house who has 4 girls under 7 years old, and there were barbies everywhere.

that's the first i've heard. i spoke to more people about it - i guess there are some out there.

[teef]

24 minutes ago, boyst said:

that's the first i've heard. i spoke to more people about it - i guess there are some out there.

i certainly don't think it has the same appeal it did years ago, but they still crank that nonsense out.  it even got a bit hipster has barbie can have the van lifestyle now.

[K-9]

Quote

 

In 2019, Mattel's top-selling Barbie was Black and had a short afro.

The diversification has appeared to work. In 2021, Mattel sold 86 million dolls from the Barbie family, which equates to 164 dolls being bought every minute. 

 

https://www.businessinsider.com/photos-how-barbie-became-most-popular-doll-in-the-world-2023-5#barbies-now-come-in-35-different-skin-tones-with-94-hairstyles-there-are-gender-neutral-barbies-sign-language-barbies-and-barbies-that-use-a-wheelchair-23

[boyst]

17 hours ago, K-9 said:

https://www.businessinsider.com/photos-how-barbie-became-most-popular-doll-in-the-world-2023-5#barbies-now-come-in-35-different-skin-tones-with-94-hairstyles-there-are-gender-neutral-barbies-sign-language-barbies-and-barbies-that-use-a-wheelchair-23

wow.

 

Edit: They still don't have a diverse barbie celebrating diabetes and obesity. 🤷🏼‍♂️

Edited August 15, 2023 by boyst