NFL Owners Expected to approve today the sale of the Washington Commanders

[BuffaloBillyG]

I have a feeling this thread will be filled with well thought out views, civil conversation and and uplifting conversation with others that both help educate and unite football fans. What could go wrong?

[PromoTheRobot]

48 minutes ago, Gregg said:

Native American Guardians Association on Twitter: "🚨BREAKING: Native American Guardian’s Association Founder & President Eunice Davidson Sent a Demand Letter Today to Washington "Commanders" Ownership & Key Leadership Formally Requesting The Team Revitalize it's Relationship With The American Indian Community & Rightfully Change… https://t.co/cpau4hVq6H" / X

 

It says "Native Americans" in the name. It must be legit.

 

Curiously, this organization's stated mission is: EDUCATE NOT IRRADICATE (sic) NATIVE AMERICAN NAMES AND IMAGES UNED (sic) IN SPORTS ALONG WITH EDUCATING ABOUT NATIVE AMERICAN HISTORY. 

 

They were formed in 2017.

 

https://www.charitynavigator.org/ein/821240491

Edited August 8, 2023 by PromoTheRobot

[Brand J]

37 minutes ago, DaggersEOD said:

Like I’ve consistently said from the beginning on this topic. Deleting these proud societies that’ve earned the respect of their adversaries from our collective consciousness does not help them.

 

non-NA’s trying to impress other non-NA’s about how good they are, patting each other on the back, mindless of the destruction they leave in their wake.

No, but deleting names many in that group deem derogatory is not for you to speak on. Even if you are Native American, you can’t tell others in that community how to feel about being called a “Redskin.”

45 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

I think this is one of those situations where most of them are okay with it but the ones who aren't are more louder and vocal.  

As will always be the case when one feels offended. “The squeaky wheel gets the oil.”

[DaggersEOD]

6 minutes ago, JayBaller10 said:

No, but deleting names many in that group deem derogatory is not for you to speak on. Even if you are Native American, you can’t tell others in that community how to feel about being called a “Redskin.”

As will always be the case when one feels offended. “The squeaky wheel gets the oil.”

You can try to justify whitewashing NA’s out of existence all you want, doesn’t make it right. 
 

Looks like we have a new squeaky wheel now don’t we.

 

Will you support this whee like the last or are you afraid of what other non-NA’s would think of you?

Edited August 8, 2023 by DaggersEOD

[Brand J]

3 minutes ago, DaggersEOD said:

You can try to justify whitewashing NA’s out of existence all you want, doesn’t make it right. 

I’m not justifying eliminating NA’s from our collective memory. I’m justifying (and standing by) the want to eliminate names that many feel are derogatory to their culture. Can you not see the difference?

[Doc]

37 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

You can't see the difference between "REDSKIN" and "BLACKHAWK?"

 

The issue isn't ANY reference to native Americans....the issue is with derogatory equivalents of the "N" word with regard to native Americans.

 

Anyhoo, if the native Americans can group together and make peace with the new ownership, that would be great.

 

I personally don't think anyone at the football team ever meant to insult native Americans.

 

 

[DaggersEOD]

1 minute ago, JayBaller10 said:

I’m not justifying eliminating NA’s from our collective memory. I’m justifying (and standing by) the want to eliminate names that many feel are derogatory to their culture. Can you not see the difference?

I can see how you see the difference and I don’t think you’re a bad person . I want to make sure that’s clear brother. 
 

My question is, who are you to decide if it’s offensive enough to eliminate all NA’s completely from the team? If that specific word was the issue than why not change it to a less supposedly offensive Indian name?
 

But the thing is, there is no “non-offensive” NA name, as challenges to the Braves, Seminoles and Blackhawk can attest.
 

It’s because they are NA that they are attacked and that’s the problem. 

[Brand J]

1 minute ago, DaggersEOD said:

I can see how you see the difference and I don’t think you’re a bad person . I want to make sure that’s clear brother. 
 

My question is, who are you to decide if it’s offensive enough to eliminate all NA’s completely from the team? If that specific word was the issue than why not change it to a less supposedly offensive Indian name?
 

But the thing is, there is no “non-offensive” NA name, as challenges to the Braves, Seminoles and Blackhawk can attest.
 

It’s because they are NA that they are attacked and that’s the problem. 

I’m not NA, so naturally I’m not offended by the word. I can’t decide anything, I’m simply standing by those who do find it offensive and want it removed. I agree with their position and I’m not speaking from a “woke” standpoint.

 

Consider… the “N” word is glorified today and used in rap lyrics, T-shirts, movies, etc. The caveat there is that it’s only (supposed to be) used by Black people. What if a non Black team owner in the future wanted his franchise to be called the “N*ggas”? And his argument was that it ended in an “a” and not an “er” and that it’s cool and used all over anyway? Maybe some Black folks would be fine and humored by it, while the loudest would scream from the hills to take it down. “Redskin” to my knowledge was only used by white settlers in a derogatory way to describe an Indian. In that sense, it’s not a word worthy of being a team name. If NAs were not offended by it? Sure, revive it! But we know that’s not the case. Find something of value NAs have created or are solely responsible for and use that as a team name. There are other ways to keep their legacy going in a non-attacking fashion…

[DaggersEOD]

1 hour ago, JayBaller10 said:

I’m not NA, so naturally I’m not offended by the word. I can’t decide anything, I’m simply standing by those who do find it offensive and want it removed. I agree with their position and I’m not speaking from a “woke” standpoint.

 

Consider… the “N” word is glorified today and used in rap lyrics, T-shirts, movies, etc. The caveat there is that it’s only (supposed to be) used by Black people. What if a non Black team owner in the future wanted his franchise to be called the “N*ggas”? And his argument was that it ended in an “a” and not an “er” and that it’s cool and used all over anyway? Maybe some Black folks would be fine and humored by it, while the loudest would scream from the hills to take it down. “Redskin” to my knowledge was only used by white settlers in a derogatory way to describe an Indian. In that sense, it’s not a word worthy of being a team name. If NAs were not offended by it? Sure, revive it! But we know that’s not the case. Find something of value NAs have created or are solely responsible for and use that as a team name. There are other ways to keep their legacy going in a non-attacking fashion…

It’s not like the N word because it’s a different word in a different set of circumstances. Not everything is “just like the n-word”. 
 

This movement is deleting a people from our culture and history. So this isn’t framed by how its similar in circumstances it is to the N word, but by its shared culture with Braves, Blackhawks and Seminoles. 
 

You see a bad word being purged, I see a culture being purged. If they re-named their team after the predominant NA culture of the area, I’d be right there next to you. 
 

But that’s the thing. There isn’t a single reference to NA culture that isn’t considered “offensive” by some. So while this particular name is likely the most offensive of the bunch, it’s also just another assault on NA’s by a gang of litigious white knights. 

[Brand J]

26 minutes ago, DaggersEOD said:

It’s not like the N word because it’s a different word in a different set of circumstances. Not everything is “just like the n-word”. 
 

This movement is deleting a people from our culture and history. So this isn’t framed by how its similar in circumstances it is to the N word, but by its shared culture with Braves, Blackhawks and Seminoles. 
 

You see a bad word being purged, I see a culture being purged. If they re-named their team after the predominant NA culture of the area, I’d be right there next to you. 
 

But that’s the thing. There isn’t a single reference to NA culture that isn’t considered “offensive” by some. So while this particular name is likely the most offensive of the bunch, it’s also just another assault on NA’s by a gang of litigious white knights. 

Therein lies the difference between you and I. I never paid attention to “Redskins” as a bad word until I heard the groups of Native Americans say it was such. And once I heard their pleas, I respected their position. 
 

Think about it this way, if you were the Washington owner and members of that group told you to your face, “we’re offended by this word the white man created. It’s derogatory to our people and we would like it removed” would you then tell those people “removing the name is akin to erasing your culture, so I will not”? These people are not consumed by the belief that it’d purge their culture, because guess what…? The name is not representative of their culture! It’s not an endearing name that was created by them. That’s where you’re getting this argument wrong. 
 

Listen, I’d totally understand if the name was “Washington Tomahawks” and a group of people came out speaking against it, but this isn’t the case. “Redskins” was a derogatory word created by white settlers and just because some NAs are fine with how it’s used today, doesn’t mean the entire race has to be. 

[DaggersEOD]

1 hour ago, JayBaller10 said:

Therein lies the difference between you and I. I never paid attention to “Redskins” as a bad word until I heard the groups of Native Americans say it was such. And once I heard their pleas, I respected their position. 
 

Think about it this way, if you were the Washington owner and members of that group told you to your face, “we’re offended by this word the white man created. It’s derogatory to our people and we would like it removed” would you then tell those people “removing the name is akin to erasing your culture, so I will not”? These people are not consumed by the belief that it’d purge their culture, because guess what…? The name is not representative of their culture! It’s not an endearing name that was created by them. That’s where you’re getting this argument wrong. 
 

Listen, I’d totally understand if the name was “Washington Tomahawks” and a group of people came out speaking against it, but this isn’t the case. “Redskins” was a derogatory word created by white settlers and just because some NAs are fine with how it’s used today, doesn’t mean the entire race has to be. 

Hey man I can 100% understand your position and why you hold it. I feel like I understand you POV and respect it. It absolutely has merit. 
 

We just value things differently 🤷‍♂️ 

 

We’d be on the same side (and I’m 100% positive there wouldn’t have been an issue such as this one) if they had at least stuck with an Indian theme in the final name. 
 

Nothing NA about Commanders. I think that’s why they sued. They’d rather a derogatory reference than being erased. Some didn't mind (your reference). Some did (OP link). 
 

Maybe this lawsuit will allow a “compromise” where they both settle on a more appropriate name that acknowledges the NA community.
 

Good PR and “Commanders” doesn’t really blow me away as a great team name. 

[Brand J]

8 minutes ago, DaggersEOD said:

Hey man I can 100% understand your position and why you hold it. I feel like I understand you POV and respect it. It absolutely has merit. 
 

We just value things differently 🤷‍♂️ 

 

We’d be on the same side (and I’m 100% positive there wouldn’t have been an issue such as this one) if they had at least stuck with an Indian theme in the final name. 
 

Nothing NA about Commanders. I think that’s why they sued. They’d rather a derogatory reference than being erased. Some didn't mind (your reference). Some did (OP link). 
 

Maybe this lawsuit will allow a “compromise” where they both settle on a more appropriate name that acknowledges the NA community.
 

Good PR and “Commanders” doesn’t really blow me away as a great team name. 

My high school mascot was a Plainsman. Washington Plainsmen doesn’t quite have a ring to it like Washington Redskins, or Washington Tomahawks (both of which sound more aggressive), but there are alternatives they could’ve explored which would’ve kept NAs at the forefront rather than eliminating any reference to them altogether (including one with a negative connotation). Personally I was hoping for Red Tails, as that would’ve been a tribute to the Tuskegee Airman, but that would’ve also eliminated the NA group. Let’s see where Magic Johnson and his folks take this…

[DaggersEOD]

Just now, JayBaller10 said:

My high school mascot was a Plainsman. Washington Plainsmen doesn’t quite have a ring to it like Washington Redskins, or Washington Tomahawks (both of which sound more aggressive), but there are alternatives they could’ve explored which would’ve kept NAs at the forefront rather than eliminating any reference to them altogether (including one with a negative connotation). Personally I was hoping for Red Tails, as that would’ve been a tribute to the Tuskegee Airman, but that would’ve also eliminated the NA group. Let’s see where Magic Johnson and his folks take this…

Oh yeah that is a badass name!

 

Not tracking the happenings on the NBA side, but that would be a cool name no matter the sport.