Buffalo News increasing the cost of their subscription to $28.99 per month

[RyanC883]

On 7/8/2023 at 2:00 PM, Limeaid said:

 

CPI also changes items accounting for inflation so the point is CPI is useless for judging inflation and it is a straw man argument.

And I have no idea on who Einstein is.  Certainly no Einstein on this board.

 

except the CPI is the most commonly used measure of inflation  

[Ned Flanders]

5 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

In the interest of shifting the subject away from truly bizarre and cringe-y boasting about intelligence and back to the main subject of the thread (newspapers), I found this interesting: https://www.nytimes.com/2023/07/10/business/media/the-new-york-times-sports-department.html. The Athletic will be the NYT's actual sports section going forward now that the ages-old NYT sports section has been eliminated. 

Saw last week that the LA Times is pretty much ditching sports, not printing box scores and other news and sporadically mixing in some  sports stories.  This and the NYT decision is another in the now long line of decisions that will ultimately lead to the death of newspapers in this country.  It's indeed sad, as I subscribe to the daily printed edition of the Washington Post and am left wondering how long that paper will last.

[Saxum]

1 minute ago, RyanC883 said:

 

except the CPI is the most commonly used measure of inflation  

 

And common theory was the Earth was flat.   I worked for agency when a politically appointed lead changed formula for upcoming election reasons.  I will not go into who or which election which would result in a political battle on this board. 

[Royale with Cheese]

24 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

What part of Florida? Your companies former CEO and I may be neighbors. I have a vacation home near the water in St Pete.

 

As far as humble goes, sure, there are all types. But that is the rare exception. I speak at conferences, have consulted, and am now the Presidoent of a company. The vast majority of executives are dreadfully arrogant. Far worse than I.

 

 

You're so predictable lol.

 

And you couldn't afford a home where he lives.  They average about $10 million on that strip.  You don't own a $10 million dollar beach home by the water.

[Saxum]

12 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

In the interest of shifting the subject away from truly bizarre and cringe-y boasting about intelligence and back to the main subject of the thread (newspapers), I found this interesting: https://www.nytimes.com/2023/07/10/business/media/the-new-york-times-sports-department.html. The Athletic will be the NYT's actual sports section going forward now that the ages-old NYT sports section has been eliminated. 

 

I thought that this would happen when The Athletic and wonder how NYT editorial decisions will affect it.  

Funny thing is The Athletic are both trying to get money from me sending emails.

[RyanC883]

14 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

 

And common theory was the Earth was flat.   I worked for agency when a politically appointed lead changed formula for upcoming election reasons.  I will not go into who or which election which would result in a political battle on this board. 

 

what's your preferred alternative to the CPI for inflation measuring?  

[What a Tuel]

3 hours ago, Einstein said:

 

You seem to have conveniently forgotten how this discussion started. You said:

 

”Oh come on man. You really think it costs more to print a paper than in 1990? Give me a break.” - What a Tuel

 

To which I responded, of course it costs more! Inflation has pushed prices higher. Ink costs more, paper costs more, vehicles cost more, salaries cost more.

 

Once you eventually realized that it does in fact cost more now, you switched to an efficiency argument. The entire basis of this entire argument is that it costs more now to print the paper than it did in 1990.

 

Your computing advances argument is the same as your employee argument. The advance of computer power has simply reduced salaries, which I already showed you *still* doesn’t outpace inflation. 

 

There is no other way around it - it costs more to print and deliver the paper now than it did in 1990.

 

.

 

You just can't admit that you are wrong and it is hilarious. 

 

The context of the argument started with this post by me:

 

On 7/8/2023 at 10:29 AM, What a Tuel said:

It doesn't account for advances in production capability, and productivity that decreases cost though.

 

So yeah the inflated price is right but at the same time, how have their costs of production faired? They certainly didn't skyrocket, and would be amazed to find out they stayed the same.

 

You just quoted an out of context derivation of the argument as preceding the original statement. So no, once again wrong.

 

Again you are so big on evidence, and you made the claim that the cost of producing a newspaper went up from 1990 in 2023. So go for it. Prove to me that the cost of producing a newspaper without quoting random commodities like printer ink which im not even sure is the same ink used in newspapers.

 

And once again take note of the bolded, underlined, italicized statement in my original argument in which I agree accounting for inflation is correct, but now prove that the total costs of production OUTPACED inflation. That alone would prove that the cost of production went up.

Edited July 10, 2023 by What a Tuel

[teef]

51 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

What part of Florida? Your companies former CEO and I may be neighbors. I have a vacation home near the water in St Pete.

 

As far as humble goes, sure, there are all types. But that is the rare exception. I speak at conferences, have consulted, and am now the Presidoent of a company. The vast majority of executives are dreadfully arrogant. Far worse than I.

 

you don't run anything.

[Royale with Cheese]

8 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

I've shown my tax return. I've proven my mettle. I not only can afford that home, I'm under contract on ANOTHER ($3.2M) home in Cape Coral, on the water, in addition to my St Pete home. But it is funny watching your brain twist itself in knots, being unable to come to terms with the fact that someone you dislike so very much has the things that you wish you had.

 

.

 

I definitely wake up every morning wishing I was this insecure and how to prove (BS) superiority on the internet.  It's what every man dreams.

 

Edited July 10, 2023 by Royale with Cheese

[teef]

7 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

I've shown my tax return. I've proven my mettle. I not only can afford that home, I'm under contract on ANOTHER ($3.2M) home in Cape Coral, on the water, in addition to my St Pete home. But it is funny watching your brain twist itself in knots, being unable to come to terms with the fact that someone you dislike so very much has the things that you wish you had.

 

.

meh.  didn't you show your home in another thread?  it was nothing special.  just a typical suburban home, which fine, but you're nothing but talk here.

[Saxum]

Just now, RyanC883 said:

 

what's your preferred alternative to the CPI for inflation measuring?  

 

Last scholarly article I read which was not produced by a political appointee was A "Reconciliation between the Consumer Price Index and the Personal Consumption Expenditures Price Index" (https://www.bea.gov/system/files/papers/P2007-4.pdf.  I remember when ice cream manufactures changed the amount of ice cream going into cartons by changing shape (1/2 gallon to 3 quarts) but in tables I reviewed year to year this was not accounted for resulting in large price jump in ice cream due to cost of cream (ice milk products also went up and while producers blamed cost of cream for rise it did not explain cost per oz rise in ice milk products which ice milk cartons also changing size).  There are many such changes made such as substituting cheaper ingredients to reduce cost rises because it will affect consumer spending.

 

I find the Personal Consumption Expenditures (PCE) to be more accurate but both have same issue - changes made for political reasons not economic measurement accuracy.

[Einstein]

1 hour ago, What a Tuel said:

Again you are so big on evidence, and you made the claim that the cost of producing a newspaper went up from 1990 in 2023. So go for it. Prove to me that the cost of producing a newspaper without quoting random commodities

 

YOU said this. Not someone else. YOU.

 

"You really think it costs more to print a paper than in 1990? Give me a break.” - What a Tuel

 

That's not a derivative. It's what you wrote. It was your argument (until you realized you are wrong, of course).

 

And it was not out of context. Just a few posts after that, you doubled down on your statement and said: "you go about your business thinking it costs more money to print paper than 1990" - What a Tuel

 

Yes, it costs more to print a paper now than it did in 1990. 

 

 

------------------

 

Soaring newsprint prices worsen local journalism crisis

 

Newsprint prices rose more than 30% over the last two years. A major factor is mills closing or converting production to packaging materials used by e-commerce companies such as Amazon.

 

That’s leading to soaring costs for remaining newspapers that are generally hanging on by a thread.

Combined with high fuel prices and delivery labor shortages, this will lead to further cutbacks in distribution, the size of newspapers and potentially newsroom employment.

 

“Mills have been shutting down pretty much everywhere — it’s really a global situation that has been a bit worsened by the pandemic,” said Francois Chastanet, director of graphic papers at Numera Analytics, a Montreal research firm affiliated with the Pulp and Paper Products Council trade group. link

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Newspapers keep eliminating print days

 

...supply-chain issues are driving supply costs through the roof. In an earnings call last month, the publisher and president of the Dallas Morning News, which still prints daily, said the company’s newsprint costs had soared to about $720 a metric ton...

 

In most cases, media companies are simply reacting to rising costs and a decline of print readers, said industry analyst Doug Arthur. In Gannett’s case, eliminating Saturday newspapers “likely removes the least profitable, smallest ad paper of the week.”

 

Amalie Nash, Gannett’s senior vice president of local news, said there are “particular pressures” on print publications, including significant print costs, inflation and a shortage of drivers that has left 1 in 10 delivery routes unstaffed. link

 

-------------------

 

 

Why paper has become a huge headache for publishers

 

Before 2022, Jardin and the BPIF say, raw paper costs were what drove price increases for printers (newspapers). Those pressures persist: but now they’re joined by the same heaving energy prices to which every other industry and individual is subject.

 

Some 68% of newspaper companies surveyed by BPIF in July put rising energy costs as a top business concern, and 65% the rising price of paper. Numerous printers are operating at full capacity to meet demand, but that capacity itself is constrained by a shortage of labour and supply chain issues.

 

Every stage of the paper-production process - hauling felled trees, crushing them into splinters or zipping the resulting paper through room-sized printing machines - uses a lot of energy. link

 

--------------------

 

All the news that’s eye-wateringly expensive to print

 

Worries about the cost and supply of newsprint are not a new challenge for publishers. In 2018, as I reported for CJR at the time, the  administration levied a range of tariffs on newsprint arriving from Canada...

 

the Sydney Morning Herald reported on fears that independent papers in Australia could be forced out of business by impending steep price hikes at a key newsprint mill in that country—hikes, the Herald reported, driven by “electricity prices, the high cost of freight shipping, and reduced newsprint demand rather than an attempt to generate large profits.” 

 

Claudia Smukler, the production director of Mother Jones, wrote recently that procuring enough of the graphic paper needed to print that magazine—while always “a complex story of sourcing, sustainability, and logistics”—has been more challenging than ever in the past eighteen months, with supply constricted, prices soaring, and print deadlines nearly missed. 

 

--------------------

 

 

Paper crisis could put news titles out of business

 

Paper is expensive because of the amount of energy needed to produce it. Publishing companies are competing against packaging and toilet paper companies for limited fibre resources globally, which are driving up costs. Failure of Norske Skog to secure the price increases will result in the closure of the Tasmanian mill, which would cause major problems for the local publishing industry.

 

The company told publishers last year it planned to increase the price of newsprint by about 30 per cent and the cost of glossy paper – used for real-estate pullouts and suburban titles – by between 35 and 45 per cent. The decision was related to electricity prices, high cost of freight shipping and reduced newsprint demand rather than an attempt to generate large profits.

 

Quote

prove that the total costs of production OUTPACED inflation.

 

You're just moving the goal posts again.

 

You never said anything about outpacing inflation.

 

You simply said it cost more to produce the newspaper in 1990. Which isnt true. And I said multiple times, "Due to inflation" costs have gone up. You kept arguing.

 

You're wrong.

 

.

Edited July 10, 2023 by Einstein

[Slippery Rubber Mats]

48 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

I've shown my tax return. I've proven my mettle. I not only can afford that home, I'm under contract on ANOTHER ($3.2M) home in Cape Coral, on the water, in addition to my St Pete home. But it is funny watching your brain twist itself in knots, being unable to come to terms with the fact that someone you dislike so very much has the things that you wish you had.

 

.

 

my guy what are you doing in here

[Einstein]

41 minutes ago, teef said:

meh.  didn't you show your home in another thread?  it was nothing special.  just a typical suburban home, which fine, but you're nothing but talk here.

 

No I never showed my home, that was someone else. But in general, Florida vacation homes you don't get a lot for what you pay. $3M will get you the equivalent of a $700k Orchard Park home.

[Nextmanup]

1 minute ago, Tom Donahoe, GM said:

 

my guy what are you doing in here

It's bizarre how much that guy feels a need to constantly prove/justify himself to a bunch of strangers over the internet.  How has life deteriorated to this level?

 

You talk about a man with ENORMOUS self confidence problems.  I fear his dad told him every day growing up that he would amount to nothing. 

 

Einstein, have a re-think as to what you're doing.  And if you aren't doing it already, see a therapist.

 

 

[Saxum]

3 minutes ago, Tom Donahoe, GM said:

 

my guy what are you doing in here

 

Advertising his fake document service?

[Jauronimo]

"I speak at conferences" is the new "attending high level meetings" and "I drive a BMW".

[BillsFanSD]

I've grown very accustomed to my in-season Monday-morning routine of plowing through every Bills-related article in BN instead of doing my job, but admittedly this is getting to be an irrational waste of money considering how much free content is out there and the fact that I already pay for The Athletic.  I'm still sort of psychologically locked in but this is probably my last year as a subscriber.  

[Bill from NYC]

On 7/8/2023 at 12:59 PM, Limeaid said:

 

CPI has always underestimated inflation because government bases raises, per diem, etc on it.

 

The above is 100% true.

[TheCockSportif]

6 minutes ago, BillsFanSD said:

I've grown very accustomed to my in-season Monday-morning routine of plowing through every Bills-related article in BN instead of doing my job, but admittedly this is getting to be an irrational waste of money considering how much free content is out there and the fact that I already pay for The Athletic.  I'm still sort of psychologically locked in but this is probably my last year as a subscriber.  

Same here, pretty much, well except that it's not me who's been subscribing, but my dad, and I think that I've almost talked him into stopping his subscription.

 

The paper version of the BN -- not that I've ever mistaken the BN for the NYT in the 45 years that I've been reading it, and not that I ever wanted BN to be the NYT -- is woeful.  The Sunday edition, something that I used to look forward to, is *rolls eyes*.

 

Very interesting thread here otherwise.  Been a long offseason for the lot of us, or so it would seem.

 

Edited July 10, 2023 by TheCockSportif