JA - “I’m trying to transition to being the guy that wins from the pocket”

[Dopey]

14 hours ago, Big Turk said:

Why are they messing with the most unstoppable player in the NFL?

Cam Newton.  

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

On 7/6/2023 at 4:43 PM, Augie said:

 

It’s a Hot Pocket, straight out of the oven……. and he’s gonna burn the roof of his mouth! Has anyone ever landed on IR for that? 

Kevin Kolb probably 

[Big Turk]

2 hours ago, Dopey said:

Cam Newton.  

 

Not really a valid comparison. People try to make it but it really isn't. Newton got sacked and hit far more in the pocket and refs almost let it be open season on him and wouldn't throw roughing the passer flags.

 

It's a very poor comparison, IMO.

[Don Otreply]

13 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Not really a valid comparison. People try to make it but it really isn't. Newton got sacked and hit far more in the pocket and refs almost let it be open season on him and wouldn't throw roughing the passer flags.

 

It's a very poor comparison, IMO.

It’s a conceptual comparison, on top of that they want more chances at the prize, it’s big picture thinking, 

[90sBills]

On 7/6/2023 at 12:50 PM, BillsFan619 said:

Go JA! Go Bills!

I hope Allen would do this next offseason. It seems like such an advantage for any offense.

 

https://www.si.com/.amp/nfl/2023/07/07/patrick-mahomes-offseason-training-quarterback-throwing-program

[C.Biscuit97]

52 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Not really a valid comparison. People try to make it but it really isn't. Newton got sacked and hit far more in the pocket and refs almost let it be open season on him and wouldn't throw roughing the passer flags.

 

It's a very poor comparison, IMO.

Eh, I get your point but Allen tries to run over guys. I think people forgot how good Cam was. Set rookie passing records and won a MVP with Ted Ginn as his number 1 wr and then injuries killed him. 
 

it’s really hard because Allen’s running and trying to win every play make him special. But those hits will catch up. 

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

On 7/7/2023 at 6:28 AM, Big Turk said:

 

Don't forget the game is in NYC on 9/11

This is not good for Buffalo

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, 90sBills said:

I hope Allen would do this next offseason. It seems like such an advantage for any offense.

 

https://www.si.com/.amp/nfl/2023/07/07/patrick-mahomes-offseason-training-quarterback-throwing-program

 

 

Agree.........if year two of the 2021-2022 JA17 offseason method doesn't yield a Super Bowl win this season.......then we should hope Allen would instead adopt the habits of the QB's who have won 4 of the last 5 SB's instead.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Please don’t call him Ja… that guy can’t stay out of trouble 

[Shaw66]

14 hours ago, HerdMentality said:

Ya. No.

 

You're not worth XXXXmillion $$ to be a pocket passer. Use the skills that separate you. You're a winner. Don't retreat because of blah blah blah criticism. Weak sauce for you and bad for a team that is paying you to be the thin edge of the wedge.

Those skills you're talking about, running skills, don't win Super Bowls.  See Newton, Lamar, Vick. Being the smartest passer in the pocket does.  See Brady, Montana, Mahomes.  

 

Josh needs to be an alite decision maker. When he's elite like Brady, Montana, and Mahomes, he will be better than any of them because of his arm and legs.  

[muppy]

I am on board with Josh Allen playing as long as possible wearing a Bills uniform. He has the physical attributes and mental smarts to win an AFC championship.  And even the Super Bowl with an effective OL,  dominant Defense,  adequate coaching and great special teams play.  And a bit of luck as far as health and officiating not pooping the bed in key situations and games. Piece of cake. /sarcasm

 

His longevity depends on some factors he cannot control. It is a very violent sport. If he becoming a pocket passer translates to he being available to play more I'd vote for that.  If he becoming a pocket passer will result in wins Everyone would vote for that too 

 

At this juncture of his career and the roster that has been assembled I believe this team has its best chance to achieve his destiny here in WNY. 

 

Noone would be happier than #17 if the Bills became a dominant  running team. Whatever works. Whatever achieves wins. Just Win Baby. Punto.

 

Go Bills!~!~!!!

[Big Turk]

6 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Eh, I get your point but Allen tries to run over guys. I think people forgot how good Cam was. Set rookie passing records and won a MVP with Ted Ginn as his number 1 wr and then injuries killed him. 
 

it’s really hard because Allen’s running and trying to win every play make him special. But those hits will catch up. 

 

Allen delivers the blow usually on smaller players moving forward with full vision and is able to line them up as he is running toward them.

 

Far different from getting hit standing there where you may only have a half second to try and protect yourself or even be blindsided.

[Mikie2times]

It's funny, what seemingly gives him no limitations (his mobility) is the very thing that actually limits his ceiling. No matter how you slice it, the very best are the best in the pocket. The elites in that area are the legends. Nobody else. Brady, Montana at the highest of the rung. Burrow being of that style, just not pedigree at this time. Mahomes is probably the most different, but even with him, he wants to be mobile in the pocket vs flat run. I have always thought when it comes to a QB running it actually hurts development. It's something they go to when other things aren't working. We have seen that with Josh. But then a time comes where you can no longer use it. Teams take it away or its late in a game. Running is not something a wise QB builds a large foundation around. I think Josh actually can mature into a more true pocket guy. For his development, even more than his health, I hope we see him do that.    

[78thealltimegreat]

6 hours ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

This is not good for Buffalo

Any game played in New York around 9-11 was going to be difficult. But after the first quarter it’s all just football 

[Beck Water]

22 hours ago, Big Turk said:

 

Not really a valid comparison. People try to make it but it really isn't. Newton got sacked and hit far more in the pocket and refs almost let it be open season on him and wouldn't throw roughing the passer flags.

 

It's a very poor comparison, IMO.

 

So your argument is that comparison to Newton is invalid because of the whims of the refs?

 

I'd like to find a source for stats on QB hits behind the LOS - don't have one.

But in his 10 years in Carolina, Newton was sacked an average of 30 times per year. 

In 5 years, Allen has been sacked 150 times (30 times per year)

Allen has rushed 546 times (109 times per year), meaning he's taken that many hits.

In his 10 years in Carolina, Newton rushed 981 times (98 times per year).

 

Those data would seem to indicate similar amounts of physical punishment.

 

Pretty sure Allen doesn't draw a flag every single time he's hit after he throws, either - and when he runs, he's very physical.  He stiff arms guys, runs over them, jumps over them.

[Gugny]

23 hours ago, Big Turk said:

 

Not really a valid comparison. People try to make it but it really isn't. Newton got sacked and hit far more in the pocket and refs almost let it be open season on him and wouldn't throw roughing the passer flags.

 

It's a very poor comparison, IMO.

 

46 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

So your argument is that comparison to Newton is invalid because of the whims of the refs?

 

I'd like to find a source for stats on QB hits behind the LOS - don't have one.

But in his 10 years in Carolina, Newton was sacked an average of 30 times per year. 

In 5 years, Allen has been sacked 150 times (30 times per year)

Allen has rushed 546 times (109 times per year), meaning he's taken that many hits.

In his 10 years in Carolina, Newton rushed 981 times (98 times per year).

 

Those data would seem to indicate similar amounts of physical punishment.

 

Pretty sure Allen doesn't draw a flag every single time he's hit after he throws, either - and when he runs, he's very physical.  He stiff arms guys, runs over them, jumps over them.

I think, overall, it’s a fair comparison. 
 

But I do agree with Turk re: the refs. 
 

I don’t have specific dates/games, but I do remember A LOT of egregious late hits and brutal hits (RTP) on Newton for which no flags were thrown. 
 

I don’t think Allen has experienced anything close to that. 

[Don Otreply]

The point of Josh’s statement is not that he won’t run the ball anymore, what he is aspiring to achieve is to grow his “craft” as a QB, such as; seeing the field better, taking what defenses give him, keeping the opposing offense off the field, etc etc.  Josh has said Tom Brady was a QB he looked up to when he was younger and Josh, like everyone else knows damn well Brady wasn’t out running anyone, yet he won repeatedly not running the ball. The writing is on the wall and Josh appears to have read it, at least that is my hope.., 

[Bronxbomber21]

On 7/6/2023 at 4:26 PM, boyst said:

9 of their 11 starters returning is big. I'm hoping the NFL stops this ***** with Gardner being allowed to mame offenders.

75 yard td pass from Allen to Diggs on the 1st play of the season. DIGGS catches Sauce on a nasty double move that pops Gardner achilles and sidelines him for the whole season 

[Big Turk]

1 hour ago, Beck Water said:

 

So your argument is that comparison to Newton is invalid because of the whims of the refs?

 

I'd like to find a source for stats on QB hits behind the LOS - don't have one.

But in his 10 years in Carolina, Newton was sacked an average of 30 times per year. 

In 5 years, Allen has been sacked 150 times (30 times per year)

Allen has rushed 546 times (109 times per year), meaning he's taken that many hits.

In his 10 years in Carolina, Newton rushed 981 times (98 times per year).

 

Those data would seem to indicate similar amounts of physical punishment.

 

Pretty sure Allen doesn't draw a flag every single time he's hit after he throws, either - and when he runs, he's very physical.  He stiff arms guys, runs over them, jumps over them.

 

Not all players are the same when it comes to injury proneness. Making assumptions that because X player got hurt doing something that Y player will also be hurt doing the same thing doesn't really make any sense.

 

Do we do that for any other positions? No.

[K-9]

Being a pocket passer so he can be “safer” is the last reason I’d want Allan to become one because it is from being hit in the pocket that most QB injuries occur, including the one that ruined Newton’s career, ironically. 
 

The best reason for Allen to stay in the pocket is simply because it’s from there that most of the field is available for him to attack.