Dungy/Colts vs McDermott/Bills

[Doc Brown]

2 minutes ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

 

True. Which is likely why unless the bottom totally falls out, McDermott will likely be fired at the conclusion of the 2024 season at the earliest. If he is fired at all. 

Agreed.  The only scenario I see him being fired this coming season is a 5-12 record or worse with a healthy Allen.  He grew up a Steelers fan and probably wants to follow their head coaching model.

[newcam2012]

1 minute ago, Doc Brown said:

Agreed.  The only scenario I see him being fired this coming season is a 5-12 record or worse with a healthy Allen.  He grew up a Steelers fan and probably wants to follow their head coaching model.

I just can't see how the Bills go 5-12 with a healthy Allen. No way!

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Please correct me if I am remembering incorrectly.  But I am fairly sure during that SuperBowl playoff run Manning overruled Dungy on a 4th down call when they were behind I believe to the Patriots at home. Manning kept the offense on the field and converted the first down when it appeared Dungy was going to punt it away.

Thus the narrative that Manning won despite Dungy.

But as others have said even during that SB run Manning had some really bad games with costly INTs.

[Dr.Sack]

The question is how good will McDermott be in dialing up defensive game plans similar to Belichick in the 2000s? McDermott was brought in as a defensive guru. McDermott needs to find answers and design defenses to stop the Bengals, Chiefs and anyone else in the most critical moments of the regular season and playoffs.
 

McDermott often cites as one of his ideologies “growth mindset”.
 

How much has McDermott’s football IQ improved since taking over in 2017? Is it safe to assume the defense should perform better than Frazier’s defenses?
 

Outside of defensive game plans and gameday command. Can McDermott improve his communication skills and get Diggs back and fully invested? 

Edited June 27, 2023 by Dr.Sack

[Thurman#1]

8 hours ago, oldmanfan said:

Here’s another similarity.  Dungy  had to face a HOF coach in Belichick and a HOF QB in Brady every year.  McD has to face the same in Reid and Mahomes.  Even with great QBs (Manning, Allen) it’s just not that easy to beat a combo like those.

 

 

Nice point.

[Thurman#1]

4 hours ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

 

It appears McDermott is in a critical year. Even on borrowed time. Coaches don't win their first super bowl after year 5 when they have a Bonafide franchise QB. Allen and McDermott just completed year 5 together. Dungy hit the jack pot in year 5. McDermott did not. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nah, bad comparison. For several reasons. 

 

First, Dungy's Colts didn't start with a rebuild, they reloaded and were immediately a damn good team. McDermott and Beane rebuilt. They were not Super Bowl competitive for the first three years. Which is what happens with rebuilds nearly always. 

 

Second, if McDermott were in a critical year they simply wouldn't have given him the new contract. You're confusing your opinion with Pegula's. His is the important one, and he very clearly disagrees with you.

 

Third, Allen was not elite or close till the last three years. Not five.

 

Fourth, Andy Reid had a bonafide franchise QB in Philly. McNabb was not elite, no Josh Allen. But a franchise guy? Without question. Reid won his first SB way way way after year five.

 

 

[Einstein]

8 hours ago, Chicken Boo said:

 

Without Dungy's defense, Manning doesn't win a Lombardi in Indy.

 

The Dungy defense that gave up 30+ points in the Championship game and Manning had to relentlessly score? 

[Chicken Boo]

Just now, Einstein said:

 

The Dungy defense that gave up 30+ points in the Championship game and Manning had to relentlessly score? 

 

The Dungey defense that held the Patriots to 13 points in the 2nd half, yes.  

[teef]

i can already see the set up.  if this team goes to a super bowl, it will be all because of allen, and mcd will just be along for the ride.  if the bills win a super bowl, there will be more criticism that this staff isn't good enough because they only won one.  this is nice.

[Ethan in Cleveland]

8 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

The Dungy defense that gave up 30+ points in the Championship game and Manning had to relentlessly score? 

Actually is was only 27 points given up by the defense.  The Pats scored on a pick 6. 

[Bobby Hooks]

1 minute ago, teef said:

i can already see the set up.  if this team goes to a super bowl, it will be all because of allen, and mcd will just be along for the ride.  if the bills win a super bowl, there will be more criticism that this staff isn't good enough because they only won one.  this is nice.

If they win the Super Bowl, put me in the who gives #€£%! category. 
 

Actually, you can put me in that category now if you’re putting a list together. 

 

Are you putting a list together? 

[Gregg]

5 minutes ago, teef said:

i can already see the set up.  if this team goes to a super bowl, it will be all because of allen, and mcd will just be along for the ride.  if the bills win a super bowl, there will be more criticism that this staff isn't good enough because they only won one.  this is nice.

 

If McDermott can win one Super Bowl for the Bills, he will be considered the greatest coach in Buffalo (not just Bills) history. 

Edited June 27, 2023 by Gregg

[teef]

Just now, Bobby Hooks said:

If they win the Super Bowl, put me in the who gives #€£%! category. 
 

Actually, you can put me in that category now if you’re putting a list together. 

 

Are you putting a list together? 

there's a list.  an exclusive list.  get behind the velvet rope buddy.

Just now, Gregg said:

 

If McDermott can win one Super Bowl for the Bills, he will considered the greatest coach in Buffalo (not just Bills) history. 

i completely argee...for about 98% of people.  there are others who are far to invested on proving him to be less than, (and they may be right) and will absolutely not admit who good of a coach he actually was.

[uticaclub]

Dungy finally won a Super Bowl because the defense played lights out on the run, we missed the Super Bowl because our defense couldn't hold a lead with 13 seconds. Also, don’t think that Colts teams beats a team with a better QB than Rex Grossman.

[Gregg]

1 minute ago, teef said:

there's a list.  an exclusive list.  get behind the velvet rope buddy.

i completely argee...for about 98% of people.  there are others who are far to invested on proving him to be less than, (and they may be right) and will absolutely not admit who good of a coach he actually was.

 

I hope the Bills can win multiple championships of course but just give me one. I want to experience a Bills Super Bowl championship just once. 

[teef]

1 minute ago, Gregg said:

 

I hope the Bills can win multiple championships of course but just give me one. I want to experience a Bills Super Bowl championship just once. 

i'm not greedy.  i'd be thrilled to see one.  

[Dablitzkrieg]

Can you imagine wanting to fire the winningest coach in Bills history because of a fake narrative that he is not offensive minded?

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

4 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

 

 

Fourth, Andy Reid had a bonafide franchise QB in Philly. McNabb was not elite, no Josh Allen. But a franchise guy? Without question. Reid won his first SB way way way after year five.

 

 

I guess I didn’t clarify. With the same team. Doesn’t do the bills any good if McDermott wins in year 10 with some other team.

 

all your other points I agree with. But there’s still the caveat that for a myriad of different reasons, NFL head coaches simply haven’t won Super Bowls betond year five with the same team, same quarterback.

 

I have to credit @Chaos for giving us the data on this in one of his threads earlier in the off-season.

 

we all know there are a number of reasons why McDermott should likely stick around for years 6, 7 and even 8 with Allen regardless of any Super Bowl victory or not.

 

he’ll either go down as the one coach to break the historical trend that goes back to like the early 70s. Or he’ll go down as “exhibit A” in as to why the trend continues.

 

 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

1 hour ago, Chicken Boo said:

 

The Dungey defense that held the Patriots to 13 points in the 2nd half, yes.  

that’s not good though. That’s like average. 

[Bobby Hooks]

1 hour ago, teef said:

i'm not greedy.  i'd be thrilled to see one.  

I’m super greedy, but I’ll still just take one. 
 

During the drought I kind’ve resigned myself to the fact that I’d never see a championship in my life time. Then Josh Allen came into our lives and completely ruined that for me. 
 

13 seconds hurt in a way that I didn’t think was possible as an adult. I can only imagine how a championship would feel. The again, the door is wide open for more wide rights, and 13 seconds’, so… idk, I’m equal parts hopeful and anxious. 
 

I guess It’s better than feeling nothing about it.