2023 Buffalo Bills from a Patriots fan perspective

[newcam2012]

2 hours ago, Success said:

 

It wasn't a "created narrative."  It was obvious in both the Miami and Cincy playoff games.  Everyone who watched the Bills dominate most of the season was like, "who is this team?"

 

It was no big mystery. They looked emotionally drained, because they were.  A popular teammate dying on the field, 2 blizzards w/ a relocation, a rash of injuries - to call all of that an excuse is to deny that football players are actually human beings, also.

 

After the Miami game no one was talking about how the Bills players were emotionally spent. That's non sense! The team played their hearts out and won a very very close game vs an up start competitive Dolphin team who had nothing to lose. 

 

After the game, there was no mention of the negative effects of the season's events. In fact, those events were used to display how tough and resilient the team was. It was an opposite narrative. 

 

Then the Cinci game changed the narrative. People are always likely to believe what fits their narrative. 

Edited June 10, 2023 by newcam2012

[Bobby Hooks]

14 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

They looked pretty focused and motivated the week before when they played Miami. 

 

There was little or no talk about the negative Hamlin effect. In fact, there was plenty of motivating talk. Win one for Damar!

 

People talking about how Damar showing up at the game be great, awesome, and motivating. All that positivity disappeared after the Bills got throttled. The Hamlin negative effect became the narrative. 

 

Those are the facts!

They barely beat a team with a third string qb. You call that focused and motivated? 

[PBF81]

16 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

He has won 4 playoff games but he's lost 5. That's a 44% playoff win rate. Not good. 

 

After the Wild-Card Round he's 1-3.  

 

Here are our WC results: 

 

2022:  Win over 7th seed Skylar Thompson's Fins, barely 

2021:  Win over the 6th seed Patriots 

2020:  Win over the 7th seed Colts with 39-year old Rivers at QB 

2019:  Loss to the 4th seed Texans with the same record and that had the 14th ranked scoring O and 19th ranked scoring D.  

2017:  Loss to the 3rd seed Jaguars with Bortles at QB and without a notable WR or TE on their roster.  

 

Not one of those three wins was impressive.  We also nearly lost to the Colts, at home, and allowed 75 more total yards, 5 more TDs, and nearly 9 more minutes in Time-of-Possession than the Colts led by an aged-out QB and also without a notable WR on the team.  Hilton was washed up by then.  

 

 

[newcam2012]

3 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

The team was emotionally spent
 

They still might’ve lost anyway

Were they emotional spent? 

 

Or were they outcoached, out game planned, and an inferior team? 

 

The Bills were playing a home playoff game. It was arguably the biggest playoff game in years. The players were well aware Hamlin was going to be alive and well. It's reasonable to conclude Hamlin gave his team inspirational words. 

 

I can't recall one person on this board calling for a Bills loss due to the season's tough journey. I can't recall one person, media member, or Bills player indicating the season's journey has taken its toll. 

 

I saw a motivated Diggs, Allen, Singletary, etc...I saw a clapping McD with fire in his eyes. I saw Hamlin make a motivating appearence. I saw a rabid optimistic fans base with Hamlin signs everywhere. I heard a familiar sound of fans cheering for their team. 

 

I saw a team get throttled, outclassed, outcoached, and frankly had zero answers for whatever Cinci did. I didn't see an unmotivated Bills team. I saw a lost coaching staff, a coaching staff that couldn't make adjustments, a coaching staff that had a terrible game plan. I saw a Bills pass rush that could not beat Cinci's 2nd and 3rd stringers. I saw Allen running for his life. I saw Lou A outscheme Fraizer with blitzes. I saw A doubled Diggs. Surprise surprise. A WR core that was bad. I don't attribute any of the above to the team's unfortunate season's journey. 

 

 

Edited June 11, 2023 by newcam2012

[newcam2012]

19 minutes ago, Bobby Hooks said:

They barely beat a team with a third string qb. You call that focused and motivated? 

Exactly my point. The team's injuries were taking its toll and they were outcoached by miles. 

 

I never saw the lack of motivation or being unfocused as an excuse. Never saw the narrative that the season's obstacles caused the players to be unfocused and unmotivated. Frankly, I didn't see that at all after the Miami game. 

13 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

After the Wild-Card Round he's 1-3.  

 

Here are our WC results: 

 

2022:  Win over 7th seed Skylar Thompson's Fins, barely 

2021:  Win over the 6th seed Patriots 

2020:  Win over the 7th seed Colts with 39-year old Rivers at QB 

2019:  Loss to the 4th seed Texans with the same record and that had the 14th ranked scoring O and 19th ranked scoring D.  

2017:  Loss to the 3rd seed Jaguars with Bortles at QB and without a notable WR or TE on their roster.  

 

Not one of those three wins was impressive.  We also nearly lost to the Colts, at home, and allowed 75 more total yards, 5 more TDs, and nearly 9 more minutes in Time-of-Possession than the Colts led by an aged-out QB and also without a notable WR on the team.  Hilton was washed up by then.  

 

 

Great breakdown to further illustrate that McD has been less than stellar in the playoffs. 

Edited June 10, 2023 by newcam2012

[billsfan89]

4 hours ago, PBF81 said:

 

While quite possibly true, if we stall again early in the playoffs, it's high time to take a good hard look at coaching then.  

 

Many think that it's the coaching, not the talent, that's holding us back.  Enough with the excuses at that point.  

 

A lot of fans are tired of living off of the outdated "he got us back to the playoffs" mantra.  

 

 

It’s all going to come down to the circumstances of the season but another playoff failure wouldn’t be enough for me to can the coaches but it would put them on the hot seat for 2024. You can be a great coach and not the right coach to take a team over the top

[machine gun kelly]

10 hours ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

I don't need to make a whole video. Below is the 2023 New England Patriots From a Bills fan perspective:

Never gets old.  I can’t wait for another 7-10 to 8-9 season for “Chess vs. Checkers” BB and all the bowing at the alter for Belicheat.  This will year 4 of mediocrity.  I SOOOOOOO want Belicheat to not retire.  Please stay another 3-4 years and keep having losing records and then Kraft forcibly retires and gives him some figure head consultant role so the narrative was it was Brady, not Belicheat.

 

That is reaping what you sow, sowing what I reap!

 

 

Classic Liar Liar clip.  If any of you youngins haven’t watched this movie, it’s a classic.  Jim Carey at his finest.

 

Oh and one other thing Belicheat…

 

 

STOP BREAKING THE RULES ICEHOLE!!!

Edited June 10, 2023 by machine gun kelly

[Doc Brown]

1 hour ago, newcam2012 said:

He has won 4 playoff games but he's lost 5. That's a 44% playoff win rate. Not good. 

 

You can blame Fraizer but McD must equally or even more so get the blame. He is the head coach who he trusted Fraizer after multiple defensive playoffs performances.

 

He absolutely gave the KC game away in 13 seconds. Then they fired the special teams coach. 

 

The team was horrific on every level and facet of the game vs Cinci. What game plan? What adjustments? Etc.. The coach had to take blame for this! 

 

Let's not paint McD as this some sort of Godlike figure. Not saying You are but some here feel like he's untouchable or flawless. 

 

There is plenty to be critical about with regards to McD. I'm starting to believe he's a great team builder and regular season coach. Come playoff time it's a different story. The record backs this up. 

I agree and I’m glad McDermott is removing the “Frazier” excuse from getting outcoached when against elite offenses in the playoffs. It was a necessary move.  That style of defense is great against average qb’s but the elite one’s will pick it apart in today’s NFL.  The defensive offseason moves they made tell me they’ve become well aware of that.

 

I pointed out Marvin Lewis because he couldn’t win even a Wild Card game where they were favored multiple times and even he was given a decade or something like that until he was axed after going 0-7 in the playoffs.  McDermott at least isn’t a complete choker in the playoffs like he was.  There’s something to be said for consistently putting up double digit wins, winning your division, and punching your lottery ticket each year.  I just wouldn’t throw that away too quickly.  I do have faith he’ll figure it out pretty soon here.

[newcam2012]

57 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

I agree and I’m glad McDermott is removing the “Frazier” excuse from getting outcoached when against elite offenses in the playoffs. It was a necessary move.  That style of defense is great against average qb’s but the elite one’s will pick it apart in today’s NFL.  The defensive offseason moves they made tell me they’ve become well aware of that.

 

I pointed out Marvin Lewis because he couldn’t win even a Wild Card game where they were favored multiple times and even he was given a decade or something like that until he was axed after going 0-7 in the playoffs.  McDermott at least isn’t a complete choker in the playoffs like he was.  There’s something to be said for consistently putting up double digit wins, winning your division, and punching your lottery ticket each year.  I just wouldn’t throw that away too quickly.  I do have faith he’ll figure it out pretty soon here.

That's fair. Soon we will see how good he really is. He has nowhere to hide now. That's a good thing. 

[ganesh]

5 hours ago, benderbender said:

If we had lost every game since Hamlin's injury, then I'd agree. The delayed reaction mental exhaustion excuse was only good enough for Saffold and only convenient when he didn't feel like blocking. May he rest in retirement. 

And we scraped through the other games...the team was talent wise better than those teams they beat...In the playoffs,  they barely beat the Dolphins at home with a 3rd string QB...and then ran into a more talented team with a chip on the shoulder and they executed. 

[NewEra]

4 hours ago, newcam2012 said:

They looked pretty focused and motivated the week before when they played Miami. 

 

There was little or no talk about the negative Hamlin effect. In fact, there was plenty of motivating talk. Win one for Damar!

 

People talking about how Damar showing up at the game be great, awesome, and motivating. All that positivity disappeared after the Bills got throttled. The Hamlin negative effect became the narrative. 

 

Those are the facts!

And my original statement is still true. It’s a fact that you have no clue if the Damar Hamlin injury negatively effected the team.  Zero clue.  Zippo, zilch.  Nada.
 

If I had the time and desire, I could put together of list of quotes from bills players and coaches stating that the ordeal took a big toll on them.

 

the following game- the pats had more yards and 1st downs.  Thank god for Hines’ returns for TDs. 3 turnovers.  We didn’t play well. 
 

the next game we barely beat Sage Rosenfells in a playoff game.  We didn’t play well.  
 

the next game we played the worst game we’ve played in years.  
 

but yeah- you know that the Hamlin moment didn’t have a negative effect on the team.  
 

Do you man,  

 

 

 

 

 

 

[PBF81]

4 hours ago, newcam2012 said:

Great breakdown to further illustrate that McD has been less than stellar in the playoffs. 

 

Thanks

 

For the Indy game that should have read 5 more 1st-Downs, not TDs.  

 

This season will reveal much.  At some point we have to quit blaming the talent and circumstances and start pointing to coaching.  If people claim that it's not the coaching, then fine, let's have that discussion about the talent, i.e. the GM.  

 

And if we win the SB or at least go to the AFC CG and don't embarrass ourselves in a loss, then great, fantastic.  But if not, it'll be high time to start asking the tough questions.  

 

 

4 hours ago, billsfan89 said:

It’s all going to come down to the circumstances of the season but another playoff failure wouldn’t be enough for me to can the coaches but it would put them on the hot seat for 2024. You can be a great coach and not the right coach to take a team over the top

 

If we get outclassed in the coaching department, I don't see how anyone can claim that it's not the coaching.  

 

Either way, I doubt they'd be fired after this coming season even if we take 2nd in the division and lose the WC game.  Both McD and Beane are signed thru '25, three more seasons.  I agree that if this season finds us underachieving then, that they won't be fired.  But the heat will be on, even from Bills fans.  The national media is already talking.  

 

 

[PBF81]

4 hours ago, machine gun kelly said:

Never gets old.  I can’t wait for another 7-10 to 8-9 season for “Chess vs. Checkers” BB and all the bowing at the alter for Belicheat.  This will year 4 of mediocrity.  I SOOOOOOO want Belicheat to not retire.  Please stay another 3-4 years and keep having losing records and then Kraft forcibly retires and gives him some figure head consultant role so the narrative was it was Brady, not Belicheat.

 

That is reaping what you sow, sowing what I reap!

 

 

Classic Liar Liar clip.  If any of you youngins haven’t watched this movie, it’s a classic.  Jim Carey at his fi

 

 

Oh and one other thing Belicheat…

 

 

STOP BREAKING THE RULES ICEHOLE!!!

 

LMAO, that is a fantastic movie! 

 

Speaking of iceholes, no doubt you've seen this one too.  

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GVCgTFw2Qk

 

... and ... 

 

 

 

 

[machine gun kelly]

5 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

LMAO, that is a fantastic movie! 

 

Speaking of iceholes, no doubt you've seen this one too.  

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GVCgTFw2Qk

 

... and ... 

 

 

 

 

You bet, you fargin bastage.  I love Johnny Dangerously.  You know I’m just joking as was trying to get a chuckle out of you.  I purposefully left that message as that was a cult movie from the early 80’s like “Strange Brew” with the McKenzie Brothers.

[PBF81]

4 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

I agree and I’m glad McDermott is removing the “Frazier” excuse from getting outcoached when against elite offenses in the playoffs. It was a necessary move.  That style of defense is great against average qb’s but the elite one’s will pick it apart in today’s NFL.  The defensive offseason moves they made tell me they’ve become well aware of that.

 

I pointed out Marvin Lewis because he couldn’t win even a Wild Card game where they were favored multiple times and even he was given a decade or something like that until he was axed after going 0-7 in the playoffs.  McDermott at least isn’t a complete choker in the playoffs like he was.  There’s something to be said for consistently putting up double digit wins, winning your division, and punching your lottery ticket each year.  I just wouldn’t throw that away too quickly.  I do have faith he’ll figure it out pretty soon here.

 

For some context, and in fairness of analysis here, Lewis also didn't have Allen as his QB and less was expected.  He had Dalton and Palmer.  

 

How would McD be doing with Dalton or Palmer instead of Allen?  

I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have won a playoff game either.  

 

 

9 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

You bet, you fargin bastage.  I love Johnny Dangerously.  You know I’m just joking as was trying to get a chuckle out of you.  I purposefully left that message as that was a cult movie from the early 80’s like “Strange Brew” with the McKenzie Brothers.

 

Then of course Blazing Saddles, the iconic movie that would send people today into orbit.  

 

 

[JohninMinn.]

10 hours ago, Success said:

Big props to this guy.  I have gotten so tired of the mantra all over the internet - the Bills will take a step back, their window is closing, they're going to regress.

 

I've seen those comments SO many times. And they're lazy.  Every time I see a comment like that, I'm like, "are you paying attention?"

 

On paper, this is the best, most balanced & complete team of the JA era.  We've upgraded in so many areas - not least of which is finally setting up what could be an excellent run game. But we're also more physical, and just better overall.  

The window opened a little more now that Edmunds is gone. He was terrible and a danger to our players with his late arrivals.

[Doc Brown]

Just now, PBF81 said:

 

For some context, and in fairness of analysis here, Lewis also didn't have Allen as his QB and less was expected.  He had Dalton and Palmer.  

 

How would McD be doing with Dalton or Palmer instead of Allen?  

I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have won a playoff game either.  

 

 

True and I have no idea because the offense would be constructed differently.  McDermott did make the playoffs with Tyrod Taylor though which is about the equivalent of qualifying for the Daytona 500 with a Prius. 

[Paul Costa]

6 hours ago, newcam2012 said:

After the Miami game no one was talking about how the Bills players were emotionally spent. That's non sense! The team played their hearts out and won a very very close game vs an up start competitive Dolphin team who had nothing to lose. 

 

After the game, there was no mention of the negative effects of the season's events. In fact, those events were used to display how tough and resilient the team was. It was an opposite narrative. 

 

Then the Cinci game changed the narrative. People are always likely to believe what fits their narrative. 

I agree people are always likely to believe what fits in their narrative. I believed they were done after Damar died on the field and was brought back to life. They were done that night. That’s what I believe. They played a bad Patriot team at home and needed two kickoff TD’s to beat them. They barely beat a Dolphins team at home without a starting QB barely. Then they never showed up at home VS Cincinnati. I watched every play last season . The season changed after Damar Hamlin died and was brought back to life. They tried but played 180 minutes of below average football to end the season. I saw the difference. It was very obvious. 

[newcam2012]

1 hour ago, Paul Costa said:

I agree people are always likely to believe what fits in their narrative. I believed they were done after Damar died on the field and was brought back to life. They were done that night. That’s what I believe. They played a bad Patriot team at home and needed two kickoff TD’s to beat them. They barely beat a Dolphins team at home without a starting QB barely. Then they never showed up at home VS Cincinnati. I watched every play last season . The season changed after Damar Hamlin died and was brought back to life. They tried but played 180 minutes of below average football to end the season. I saw the difference. It was very obvious. 

Perhaps you are correct. We will really never know.

 

Before that Monday Cinci game the Bills were on a big winning streak. If you closely look at those games you could reasonable conclude that the Bills weren't playing at their best. Several ugly wins for sure. That should be factored in as a piece to the puzzle. 

2 hours ago, PBF81 said:

 

Thanks

 

For the Indy game that should have read 5 more 1st-Downs, not TDs.  

 

This season will reveal much.  At some point we have to quit blaming the talent and circumstances and start pointing to coaching.  If people claim that it's not the coaching, then fine, let's have that discussion about the talent, i.e. the GM.  

 

And if we win the SB or at least go to the AFC CG and don't embarrass ourselves in a loss, then great, fantastic.  But if not, it'll be high time to start asking the tough questions.  

 

 

 

If we get outclassed in the coaching department, I don't see how anyone can claim that it's not the coaching.  

 

Either way, I doubt they'd be fired after this coming season even if we take 2nd in the division and lose the WC game.  Both McD and Beane are signed thru '25, three more seasons.  I agree that if this season finds us underachieving then, that they won't be fired.  But the heat will be on, even from Bills fans.  The national media is already talking.  

 

 

I'm already talking too. I get a lot of heat for it too. 

 

Just hard to watch McD, Fraizer, and Dorsey get outclassed come playoff time. At least Fraizer is gone. 

Edited June 11, 2023 by newcam2012

[newcam2012]

3 hours ago, NewEra said:

And my original statement is still true. It’s a fact that you have no clue if the Damar Hamlin injury negatively effected the team.  Zero clue.  Zippo, zilch.  Nada.
 

If I had the time and desire, I could put together of list of quotes from bills players and coaches stating that the ordeal took a big toll on them.

 

the following game- the pats had more yards and 1st downs.  Thank god for Hines’ returns for TDs. 3 turnovers.  We didn’t play well. 
 

the next game we barely beat Sage Rosenfells in a playoff game.  We didn’t play well.  
 

the next game we played the worst game we’ve played in years.  
 

but yeah- you know that the Hamlin moment didn’t have a negative effect on the team.  
 

Do you man,  

 

 

 

 

 

 

No I don't know that. I never said once that Halim didn't effect the team. 

 

I'm saying the narrative came out after the fact. I'm saying we have no idea how much of a negative impact it had. Was it mild, medium, or very significant? You don't know either. However, so many here assume it was devastating and the major reason why the Bills lost. 

 

I truly believe that there was a negative effect when Hamlin's life was in on the line. When his health was in question. Of course that played a negative role. 

 

However, circumstances changed dramatocally; thank God! Hamlin was released from the hospital. Word was coming out he was likely to be fine. Whispers that he might even play football. I'd agrue Hamlin was a rallying point not a distraction.

 

That is no small circumstance to omit. The team and the players and fans were elated and relieved. Halim love and his miracle story was embraced by everyone. Signs everywhere! Win for Damar was a common theme. It's destiny was another common theme. Correct? It was time to play football!

 

The Bills got outcoached by Miami. Had Tia played the game like my would have been lost. Imho, it would have had little to do with Hamlin. More about the Bills lack of talent, coaching and injuries. Ditto for the Cinci game too. 

 

Folks let's stop with the Damar narrative...The Von narrative was likely more significant.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 11, 2023 by newcam2012