Slippery Rubber Mats Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 5 minutes ago, HappyDays said: Well done
JGMcD2 Posted June 6, 2023 Author Posted June 6, 2023 11 minutes ago, NewEra said: And Beane continues to mortgage the future in order to win a SB this year. we were 20M over the cap to start the season and added Floyd, McGovern, Poyer, Rapp, Edwards, Shell, Poona, Shaq, Phillips, Harty, Sherfield, Harris, Murray and Sam Martin. Plus the draft class. “Mortgaging the future” is quite the over exaggeration. They’ll continue to balance things. Trading away multiple high draft picks for an underperforming DE or 40 year old QB is mortgaging your future. Manipulating the salary cap is not. 2
NewEra Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 (edited) 6 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said: “Mortgaging the future” is quite the over exaggeration. They’ll continue to balance things. Trading away multiple high draft picks for an underperforming DE or 40 year old QB is mortgaging your future. Manipulating the salary cap is not. Disagree. Kicking cap down the road is exactly that. Yes, it’s part of being a contender, but how much you want to kick down the road is up to the GM. He didn’t have to extend Ed and free up cap room to sign floyd. He could’ve kept the cap hit the same and had more $ to work with in the future. The move allowed him improve our chances in 2023 at the expense of future cap. He had already restructured Josh and Von this offseason. Every restructure is mortgaging the future. That doesn’t mean we can’t be contenders in the future. It just means we’ll have less cap to work with. I suppose we just have different views of what mortgaging the future entails Edited June 6, 2023 by NewEra 1
Solomon Grundy Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, JohnBonhamRocks said: Any chance once Miller is back in the lineup that Floyd becomes essentially our other starting LB? I love the potential versatility he and Rapp bring to the defense. 3 players from SB winning defense!! Edited June 6, 2023 by Solomon Grundy 1
John from Riverside Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 I think this is the last free agent will see 1
Fan in Chicago Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 9 minutes ago, NewEra said: Disagree. Kicking cap down the road is exactly that. Yes, it’s part of being a contender, but how much you want to kick down the road is up to the GM. He didn’t have to extend Ed and free up cap room to sign floyd. He could’ve kept the cap hit the same and had more $ to work with in the future. The move allowed him improve our chances in 2023 at the expense of future cap. He had already restructured Josh and Von this offseason. Every restructure is mortgaging the future. That doesn’t mean we can’t be contenders in the future. It just means we’ll have less cap to work with. I suppose we just have different views of what mortgaging the future entails Mortgaging the future has a negative connotation and also ignores the fact there is always a future - this year and next. "Kicking the can down the road" has a similar, negative implication. I prefer thinking of it as "managing the cap" which includes knowing when to hold it and when to blow it. When a team is as close to winning it all as the Bills are, we should be in the latter mode. With the Floyd numbers presented earlier in this thread, it looks like there is little money for signing Hopkins. 1
machine gun kelly Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 I see the Oliver extension and Floyd acquisition as linked so it paints a much more positive decision to make each of these choices. The question then becomes who’s the 4th in the rotation? We have Basham, Epenesa, and Shaq. At most we’ll keep 9 so someone is out of luck. There are multiple ways to look at this as Shaq was the best tackler and a very effective edge setting DE against the run. Epenesa is ok at bend and Basham, I just don’t know, but Basham and AJE, have years left on cheap rookie contracts. Those are considerations. As far as the interior we now have 5 interior guys with Ford (I love this acquisition from Seattle), Settle, Daquan, J. Phillips, and Ed. They won’t keep 5 interior and 9 exterior guys. It’s going to be historically speaking of either 9 or 5. So we’ll lose some guys. TC will bet that out. My Wag is Basham placed on PS and then will probably be scooped up by a weaker team.
SCBills Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 15 minutes ago, NewEra said: And Beane continues to mortgage the future in order to win a SB this year. we were 20M over the cap to start the season and added Floyd, McGovern, Poyer, Rapp, Edwards, Shell, Poona, Shaq, Phillips, Harty, Sherfield, Harris, Murray and Sam Martin. Plus the draft class. The only contender who isn't "mortgaging the future" as of now is KC. Things get tight for them in the next two years with deals for Chris Jones and an aging Travis Kelce on the horizon, but they hit it out of the park in trading Tyreek Hill for a boatload of picks and then drafting really well as of late. Everyone else is in a similar position to us.. Bengals have a ton of players due big money coming up soon. Dolphins have traded away a ton of picks and handed out massive contracts to guys as they try to maximize the rookie contract of Tua. Jets have Rodgers on the books, as it stands, for over 100M next year. Of course they'll restructure that, but they aren't exactly being conservative in their approach. Chargers have aging players around a QB they are going to have to pay soon. Just not sure why some are so worried about what we're doing. Beane hasn't gone "all in". He's gotten as close as you can without doing that, but it's pretty clear that he's holding onto draft picks and views this current window (Diggs, Von, Hyde, Poyer, Tre) as one worth going for it short term. I suspect, especially if we win a Super Bowl, there will be a minor cap reset in a few years as those players all move on, but nothing too wild given we still have draft picks and an exploding future cap. 4 2
NewEra Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 9 minutes ago, SCBills said: The only contender who isn't "mortgaging the future" as of now is KC. Things get tight for them in the next two years with deals for Chris Jones and an aging Travis Kelce on the horizon, but they hit it out of the park in trading Tyreek Hill for a boatload of picks and then drafting really well as of late. Everyone else is in a similar position to us.. Bengals have a ton of players due big money coming up soon. Dolphins have traded away a ton of picks and handed out massive contracts to guys as they try to maximize the rookie contract of Tua. Jets have Rodgers on the books, as it stands, for over 100M next year. Of course they'll restructure that, but they aren't exactly being conservative in their approach. Chargers have aging players around a QB they are going to have to pay soon. Just not sure why some are so worried about what we're doing. Beane hasn't gone "all in". He's gotten as close as you can without doing that, but it's pretty clear that he's holding onto draft picks and views this current window (Diggs, Von, Hyde, Poyer, Tre) as one worth going for it short term. I suspect, especially if we win a Super Bowl, there will be a minor cap reset in a few years as those players all move on, but nothing too wild given we still have draft picks and an exploding future cap. Agree 💯 I think there’s a big difference between going all in and mortgaging the future. We aren’t all in, but there’s a solid chance that the overall talent level on this team > the talent level of future bills teams. I think for us to remain this stacked, Beane is going to have to hit on a higher % of draft picks and get significant contributions from low cost free agents. that said, even with slightly lesser talent, it’s still possible to win a Super Bowl (possibly multiple) in the future. 3
John from Riverside Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 (edited) 1 minute ago, NewEra said: Agree 💯 I think there’s a big difference between going all in and mortgaging the future. We aren’t all in, but there’s a solid chance that the overall talent level on this team > the talent level of future bills teams. I think for us to remain this stacked, Beane is going to have to hit on a higher % of draft picks and get significant contributions from low cost free agents. that said, even with slightly lesser talent, it’s still possible to win a Super Bowl (possibly multiple) in the future. I still go back to what Brandon said whenever he got here building a team that wins now, and in the future Edited June 6, 2023 by John from Riverside 1
NewEra Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 14 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: I still go back to what Brandon said whenever he got here building a team that wins now, and in the future I agree. I think that’s why we don’t have Hopkins. He’s restructured and kicked more money down the line than I thought he would have this offseason. I’m glad he did. I really love this roster a lot more than last years
RyanC883 Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 20 minutes ago, NewEra said: I agree. I think that’s why we don’t have Hopkins. He’s restructured and kicked more money down the line than I thought he would have this offseason. I’m glad he did. I really love this roster a lot more than last years Roster is much better than last years. I just worry about a Diggs injury, but if that happened perhaps we still have enough out there in our RB and backup WRs. 1
newcam2012 Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 1 hour ago, NewEra said: And Beane continues to mortgage the future in order to win a SB this year. we were 20M over the cap to start the season and added Floyd, McGovern, Poyer, Rapp, Edwards, Shell, Poona, Shaq, Phillips, Harty, Sherfield, Harris, Murray and Sam Martin. Plus the draft class. I can't be upset at a GM who is trying to win a Super Bowl.
hondo in seattle Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 1 hour ago, NewEra said: And Beane continues to mortgage the future in order to win a SB this year. we were 20M over the cap to start the season and added Floyd, McGovern, Poyer, Rapp, Edwards, Shell, Poona, Shaq, Phillips, Harty, Sherfield, Harris, Murray and Sam Martin. Plus the draft class. I get the win-now school, but I think it's a real concern that we're mortgaging the future. If going all-in this year means we won't be competitive in the future, I'm worried. I'd rather buy 10 lottery tickets than just 1. And with Josh, we could legitimately contend for the next 10 years if we save ourselves some cap space to do so. 1
BRH Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 (edited) 16 minutes ago, RyanC883 said: Roster is much better than last years. I just worry about a Diggs injury, but if that happened perhaps we still have enough out there in our RB and backup WRs. And I wouldn't close the door on Hopkins just yet. He wants an OBJ-type deal, but most of the teams with the cap space to give it to him aren't necessarily teams that want to blow most of it on a WR who's on the wrong side of 30, has been injured of late, and was suspended recently for PEDs. Given that he is currently without a contract, unless one of those cap-flush teams ends up signing him, his price is going to start coming down.... way down... perhaps to the point where he'll take a lot less for a one-year prove-it deal and hope to leverage it into his final big payday. If he does that, he'll want to play on a team with a lot of exposure and a QB who can make him look good. And then we're right back in the game (as is KC). That's what BBB means when he says he's monitoring the situation. I don't think the odds of it happening are great, but I don't think they're nonexistent either. Edited June 6, 2023 by BRH 1 1
Sestak4ever Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 13 minutes ago, RyanC883 said: Roster is much better than last years. I just worry about a Diggs injury, but if that happened perhaps we still have enough out there in our RB and backup WRs. Our roster last year was awesome. If not for all the injuries and other unfortunate incidents I believe we would have been the team to beat. If this roster is better and remains healthy, watch out! Go Bills!! 2
SCBills Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 (edited) 18 minutes ago, RyanC883 said: Roster is much better than last years. I just worry about a Diggs injury, but if that happened perhaps we still have enough out there in our RB and backup WRs. Certainly a worry, and I hope the improved OL, run game, TE duo and WR depth could get us by if Diggs had to miss some games, BUT we're not Cinci or Miami who have a plethora of high level WR's. Chase missed time for the Bengals last year, no problem.. However, what if Kelce ever gets injured? Chiefs WR room full of WR2's functions at a high level when playing off Kelce, but he never gets hurt.. so what would that look like if he does? Edited June 6, 2023 by SCBills 1 1
NewEra Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 49 minutes ago, newcam2012 said: I can't be upset at a GM who is trying to win a Super Bowl. Who’s upset? I love it 1
NewEra Posted June 6, 2023 Posted June 6, 2023 42 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said: I get the win-now school, but I think it's a real concern that we're mortgaging the future. If going all-in this year means we won't be competitive in the future, I'm worried. I'd rather buy 10 lottery tickets than just 1. And with Josh, we could legitimately contend for the next 10 years if we save ourselves some cap space to do so. Sure, there’s concern. Sometimes you have to take risks. Sometimes you don’t. Tough to predict the luck portion of winning a Super Bowl. I think we’ve mortgaged a solid amount of future cap space to increase our chances to win this year (and last)……In Josh’s prime. I don’t think we’ve gone even close to all in. I think we’re doing what many contenders do. I think you’re underestimating how many lottery tickets we can buy. We think we can have 7 GREAT chances doing what we’re doing rather than 9 good chances. Do you think we’re all in this year?
Recommended Posts