D-line coach Eric Washington’s comments on Ed Oliver — hoo boy

[Logic]

In college, Oliver was very good at stopping the run and plugging gaps, but had only decent pass rush production. In the pros, he's been basically the same. A generally good run stopper who shows flashes of quality pass rush but is simply not someone to be feared in the pass rushing department.

The Bills figured, based on his physical skillset and his being miscast as a nose tackle in college, that they could harness his quickness and athleticism as a 3T and unlock the pass rushing facet of his game. It hasn't quite worked out that way.

When you use Beane's "draft elite physical specimens who haven't reached their potential and entrust the coaching staff to help them reach that potential" model, sometimes it works out (Josh Allen, Matt Milano), and sometimes it doesn't (Ed Oliver, Tremaine Edmunds). Sometimes you get the bear, and sometimes the bear gets you.

 

Edited June 2, 2023 by Logic

[PBF81]

30 minutes ago, strive_for_five_guy said:

Not to mention, I thought getting off the line was supposed to be his strength when he was drafted.  Doesn’t seem to have consistently translated to the NFL for him.

 

That's because when he did it in college he did most of his damage against a few siht schools and against substandard collegiate talent.  We should have scouted that more accurately.  

 

 

[John from Riverside]

All the physical skills
Dumb as his horse

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

12 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

All the physical skills
Dumb as his horse

[SectionC3]

2 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

I think the comments encapsulate why the draft is a crap shoot. All of these guys are athletically gifted coming out of college and most were that way their entire life. But when they turn professional they don’t all understand what kind of commitment is required to be good at your craft. And as pretty much any employer will tell you, the same can be said for just about every other college major as well.

Winners do stuff losers don’t want to do.  Everybody wants to be a winner.  But not everybody wants to do the work.  

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

Just now, SectionC3 said:

Winners do stuff losers don’t want to do.  Everybody wants to be a winner.  But not everybody wants to do the work.  

[dave mcbride]

2 hours ago, Simon said:

I interpret it as him saying that sometimes he's late to the line and slow off the snap.

Which he is.

Yeah, but: he's also throwing around terms like "from the neck up" and "process very quickly," "understanding," and "nuances," which are all very clearly comments on his mental approach (or lack thereof). To be fair, it might be completely true, but rarely do you see a coach call out a player in this way to a reporter. Maybe it's meant to be motivational, and I don't doubt it might work with some (not all) players when it's done in private. But to do it publicly? That's the sort of thing that may well come up in contract negotiations with other teams next year, and if I were Oliver or his agent, I'd be pretty PO'd.  

[LabattBlue]

Best case…Oliver has a monster year and the Bills win the SB. 

 

Have a great year…the Bills can’t afford to re-sign, hits FA, and maybe the Bills end up with a comp pick. 
 

Have a mediocre year…kick to the curb with a parting gift and wonder how McD and BB missed so badly on a 1st round pick, when 3 other DT’s were selected around that point, and we ended up with the dud. 

[That's No Moon]

4 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Yeah, but: he's also throwing around terms like "from the neck up" and "process very quickly," "understanding," and "nuances," which are all very clearly comments on his mental approach (or lack thereof). To be fair, it might be completely true, but rarely do you see a coach call out a player in this way to a reporter. Maybe it's meant to be motivational, and I don't doubt it might work with some (not all) players when it's done in private. But to do it publicly? That's the sort of thing that may well come up in contract negotiations with other teams next year, and if I were Oliver or his agent, I'd be pretty PO'd.  

Another D lineman they drafted and didn't really get the most out of. RAS demon, on field meh

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

3 hours ago, Your Brown Eye said:

So he's an idiot who rely's on his physical skills...great

that was pretty much my takeaway too. Not a smart player. 

[PBF81]

34 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Yeah, but: he's also throwing around terms like "from the neck up" and "process very quickly," "understanding," and "nuances," which are all very clearly comments on his mental approach (or lack thereof). To be fair, it might be completely true, but rarely do you see a coach call out a player in this way to a reporter. Maybe it's meant to be motivational, and I don't doubt it might work with some (not all) players when it's done in private. But to do it publicly? That's the sort of thing that may well come up in contract negotiations with other teams next year, and if I were Oliver or his agent, I'd be pretty PO'd.  

 

Good point, but who knows, maybe he's not seeing Oliver do these things now and for OTAs and he's firing a bow shot as a wake-up call.  

 

Keep in mind, the coaches are going to be feeling some pressure this year, if not from our fanbase then from the national media.  They obviously want to put their best foot forward.  I don't see our defense being ranked among the top-10 this year with the vacancies at LB, a mediocre DL, and a much stronger slate of offensive opponents on our schedule than we've faced on McD's entire watch.  

 

The offense may be our best ever, it also may end up being merely a good top-5 offense again.  I don't think we're going to get much help from our D during the regular season, which already struggles in the playoffs.  

 

 

[TheBrownBear]

Reading between the lines, I think he's saying we should trade him for Aaron Donald.

[BigAl2526]

Play smarter and anticipate.

[TheBrownBear]

51 minutes ago, LabattBlue said:

Best case…Oliver has a monster year and the Bills win the SB. 

 

Have a great year…the Bills can’t afford to re-sign, hits FA, and maybe the Bills end up with a comp pick. 
 

Have a mediocre year…kick to the curb with a parting gift and wonder how McD and BB missed so badly on a 1st round pick, when 3 other DT’s were selected around that point, and we ended up with the dud. 

He's not a dud.  He's been a solid player for us - like a back half of the first round type of guy.  He just hasn't lived up to his draft position as an elite game changing type of player.

[LabattBlue]

18 minutes ago, TheBrownBear said:

He's not a dud.  He's been a solid player for us - like a back half of the first round type of guy.  He just hasn't lived up to his draft position as an elite game changing type of player.

IMO…a guy who disappears more often than not = dud

[Success]

I think we're going to get the same kind of contract year leap that we got from Edmunds.

 

And he'll likely move on after that, as Edmunds did. But if he can be consistent and play to his potential, it could go a long way toward getting us to a SB with this team.

 

[Don Otreply]

3 hours ago, DapperCam said:

Sounds like the coach is calling him too dumb, which is kind of mean.

I think its more that he is calling Ed intellectually lazy concerning his game prep, jmo.

[McDeerInTheHeadlights]

2 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

All the physical skills
Dumb as his horse

 

I'm not sure he has all the physical skills either.

 

His athleticism is made less effective or impactful by his lack of size.

[Dr.Mantis_Toboggan]

When was the last time this team hit a DL pick out of the park? I guess Kyle for a DT, almost 20 years ago…

 

I mean going back to 2000 this franchise has been woefully bad at selecting DL. Looking through 23 years worth of drafts, they really only hit on three DL draft picks.

Aaron Schobel in 01

Kyle Williams in 06

Harrison Phillips 18 (serviceable, nothing to brag about not retained obv)

*Marcell Dareus 11- Asterisk bc he was legit on his rookie deal, but as soon as he got the pay day he stopped trying and flamed out, so not exactly what you hope for out of the 3rd overall pick in the draft.

 

So 23 years of drafts, and one legit edge rusher, one HOF caliber DT, one serviceable DT, one who had all the talent in the world but gave up on himself… and then two decades plus of JAGS and busts like Flowers, Denney, the human epitomization of “mid” Chris Kelsay, Maybin, McCargo, Troupe, Lawson, Ed, Epenesa, Basham, Rousseau… I get it’s a hard position to draft, but this has to be like historically bad. Not one legit edge rusher drafted in 20+ years…

[Don Otreply]

2 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

All the physical skills
Dumb as his horse

Not many other animals that will run into a burning barn…,