Hopkins released by Arizona (7/16: signed by Titans)

[GoBills808]

7 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

One can argue the drops are on him. All the other misses are not--Allen  shares in that obviously.

 

 

How many 4th down targets did he get?  What the average?

The majority of the drops are mostly Davis's fault. Jet's game stands out in particular

 

Miscommunications play big into the reason passer rating when targeting Davis is so low. Throws at Davis turned into INTs at a much higher rate than other receivers

[Warriorspikes51]

1 hour ago, hondo in seattle said:

Benjamin Albright is reporting that the Bills are open to trading away Diggs.  I'm not sure I believe him but if true, it's one more reason to get DHop.

 

“I talked to some people in Buffalo on the condition of anonymity and they said that, ‘Publicly, we’re not moving him. Privately, we would consider it under the right circumstances.’”

 

Albright hasn't been accurate on Bills info for a while. He didn't have Von Miller coming here

26 minutes ago, Paul Costa said:

Would be idiotic from a cap perspective. Diggs knows this . Part of the reason he’s being a dick. 

 

Diggs showed up for work, had conversation with Sean and whoever else and was then excused from practice for the day

How do we know exactly what Diggs is being?   A true judgement can't be made as we were not privy to offseason conversations and what led to him being excused from practice because Sean said they needed "space" 

[mjt328]

1 hour ago, SectionC3 said:

The longer this lingers the more I begin to wonder whether we may not be out on this after all.  

 

Maybe.  Hopkins clearly wants to be on a contender with a top QB.  He said so himself, even before the Cardinals released him.

 

The Bills pursued a trade for Hopkins before the draft, and checked into signing him after his release.  Brandon Beane admitted it publicly.  There were also rumors about teams like the Chiefs, Cowboys, Ravens and others being interested.  But nothing ever materialized.

 

The fact that Hopkins sat for a few weeks and then started visiting teams like the Texans, Titans and Patriots tells me that offers from those higher teams weren't close to what he was looking for.  But since he hasn't signed with any of those teams and things have suddenly gone quiet... it makes you wonder if their contract offers didn't quite blow him away either.

 

He may be torn between the money and going for a ring, and having trouble deciding which way to go.

 

[Mr. WEO]

59 minutes ago, BananaB said:

He got 1. So he was 12 of 27 on third down. Not much of difference but still proves he’s very unreliable 

 

Six of his targets went to defenders, some of which looked like miscommunications. We rarely see Allen and Diggs have these miscues but we do with Davis and Allen. 🤔

where does he rank on 3rd down %? 
 

For reference, Allen’s worse completion (to all receivers) down is 3rd @ 56%.   

1 hour ago, GoBills808 said:

The majority of the drops are mostly Davis's fault. Jet's game stands out in particular

 

Miscommunications play big into the reason passer rating when targeting Davis is so low. Throws at Davis turned into INTs at a much higher rate than other receivers

Yes as I said, mostly Davis’s fault.  
 

the INTs sure maybe miscommunication, or just bad throws.  Those were an issue last year as well. Maybe it was the elbow injury.  

[BananaB]

32 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

where does he rank on 3rd down %? 
 

For reference, Allen’s worse completion (to all receivers) down is 3rd @ 56%.   

Yes as I said, mostly Davis’s fault.  
 

the INTs sure maybe miscommunication, or just bad throws.  Those were an issue last year as well. Maybe it was the elbow injury.  

Look it up if your so curious

[Airseven]

Chatter on AZ radio is that in addition to his contract demands, Hopkins is adamant about practicing less during the week (he apparently doesn’t practice Wednesdays?) which is turning off potential suitors.

[taglientep]

1 minute ago, Airseven said:

Chatter on AZ radio is that in addition to his contract demands, Hopkins is adamant about practicing less during the week (he apparently doesn’t practice Wednesdays?) which is turning off potential suitors.

The less practice fits w the way the bills handle vets 

[Goin Breakdown]

Can he just sign someplace already!  I hate reading about it and at the same

time....I always read about it. It's such a bad habit I've formed since, what, May?

[taglientep]

Just now, Goin Breakdown said:

Can he just sign someplace already!  I hate reading about it and at the same

time....I always read about it. It's such a bad habit I've formed since, what, May?

I hope it’s buffalo 

[Goin Breakdown]

Just now, taglientep said:

I hope it’s buffalo 

Would be cool, but it won't happen unless he chooses to play cheep

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, BananaB said:

Look it up if your so curious

 

You tossed this stat out there, saying that 12/27 on 3rd down was "terrible".  Compared to what?  

 

I'm not "curious" --I'm asking you to back that up.  That's all.  Show me how you concluded it's "terrible".  I can be persuaded...

[BananaB]

17 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

You tossed this stat out there, saying that 12/27 on 3rd down was "terrible".  Compared to what?  

 

I'm not "curious" --I'm asking you to back that up.  That's all.  Show me how you concluded it's "terrible".  I can be persuaded...

Look them up, prove me wrong. I’m not wasting my time searching for stats to prove to you 44% ain’t good. 

[BADOLBILZ]

4 hours ago, SWATeam said:

I'm saying that simply weighing bulk production with catch rate doesn't tell the story.  Gabe's average depth of target was 5th in the league at 15.3 yards per target.  And Gabe had more CATCHES than anyone above him on that list even had targets.  Compare that to JuJu's average depth of target being 7.3 yards- good for 117th in the league.

 

There is obviously going to be a much higher catch percentage on the types of passes JuJu was targeted with vs. Davis.

 

Maybe there is credence to the idea that Gabe just isn't good enough to run a diverse tree.  But I think the problem more lies with the Bills offensive philosophy.  This "bombs away" backyard football approach is high variance.  I'd like to see a more consistent approach with quick hitting plays that run on-time.  I'm tired of the highlight reel hurdles and amazing scramble drill plays.  Everything just always looks so difficult. 

 

The biggest head scratcher last year was the obvious emphasis at signing multiple pass catching backs only to never use them.  We went after McKissic, signed Duke Johnson, drafted Cook, traded for HInes.  It was bizarre.  I don't know if this is an OC problem or Josh problem but I'd guess a bit of both.  Josh seems allergic to taking what's there at times and I don't think Dorsey had the chops to reign him in.

 

 

 

You've missed the point.  He is what he is.   Davis could never-ever catch 77% of his passes running short routes......it would only LESSEN his impact because he will be OPEN less and he struggles in all contested catch situations.   The second best option has to be much better than Gabe has proven that he can be.    It's so clear........that it really isn't even about Davis.   He is a bad-handed HR specialist being asked to do more than he can.    You aren't saying anything talking about his depth of target.   His targets need to be deep because those are the routes he can get open on.    Gabe's 15 YDOT(depth of target) is a lot different than when Diggs had a 15 YDOT in 2019........because Diggs could actually execute the other routes.   Gabe can't. 

 

 And don't even start in about RB's.   You can scratch your head all you want.........that has nothing to do with their failure to beat the best teams in the playoffs.  Individual RB's don't move the needle in the playoffs and teams that rely heavily on them struggle to get similar results against defense's playing with playoff level intensity.    See the Saints getting upset in the playoffs over and over in good part due to their offensive reliance on Alvin Kamara. 

[Mr. WEO]

15 minutes ago, BananaB said:

Look them up, prove me wrong. I’m not wasting my time searching for stats to prove to you 44% ain’t good. 

Lol yeah that’s what I thought…

[34-78-83]

6 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Yep,  I love Gabe Davis as a clear 3rd option.   Like a 60 targets guy.   He's like having a power hitter batting 4th.   The idea is to load the bases with the top options and then, when there is nowhere to put him,  the pitcher has to throw him strikes which raises his batting average 100+ points.    That's Gabe........he needs the attention of the defense focused elsewhere so he can get favorable matchups..........and he has the deep ball skills to take advantage of those situations.   

 

I think people get confused about his playoff performances and think that indicates that there is something else there that he just isn't showing in the regular season.   I don't think that's the case.   He is what he is.........inconsistent but a HR threat.   

Well put.

[Dunkirk Donski]

1 hour ago, taglientep said:

I hope it’s buffalo 

Source?

mike Schopp hates uninformed opinions!

[34-78-83]

43 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

You've missed the point.  He is what he is.   Davis could never-ever catch 77% of his passes running short routes......it would only LESSEN his impact because he will be OPEN less and he struggles in all contested catch situations.   The second best option has to be much better than Gabe has proven that he can be.    It's so clear........that it really isn't even about Davis.   He is a bad-handed HR specialist being asked to do more than he can.    You aren't saying anything talking about his depth of target.   His targets need to be deep because those are the routes he can get open on.    Gabe's 15 YDOT(depth of target) is a lot different than when Diggs had a 15 YDOT in 2019........because Diggs could actually execute the other routes.   Gabe can't. 

 

 And don't even start in about RB's.   You can scratch your head all you want.........that has nothing to do with their failure to beat the best teams in the playoffs.  Individual RB's don't move the needle in the playoffs and teams that rely heavily on them struggle to get similar results against defense's playing with playoff level intensity.    See the Saints getting upset in the playoffs over and over in good part due to their offensive reliance on Alvin Kamara. 

I'd agree here overall, but I do see Swat's point about depth of target in the Bills scheme as a part of the statistical struggle had by Gabe, and I do also believe that Gabe is still fully able to affect his own outcome in overcoming the drops, and CAN become a solid #2. Just not there as of yet, and not a sure thing.

[taglientep]

3 hours ago, Unsavory Peterman said:

Source?

mike Schopp hates uninformed opinions!

My source for hope?   

[Andrew Son]

13 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 And don't even start in about RB's.   You can scratch your head all you want.........that has nothing to do with their failure to beat the best teams in the playoffs.  Individual RB's don't move the needle in the playoffs and teams that rely heavily on them struggle to get similar results against defense's playing with playoff level intensity.    See the Saints getting upset in the playoffs over and over in good part due to their offensive reliance on Alvin Kamara. 

LOL, there is a wide chasm between relying heavily on the RB and taking the occasional checkdown when it's there.  Jerick McKinnon had 71 targets, that seemed to work out ok...

[Gregg]