Ross Tucker ranks NFL Coach’s, places McDermott at #22.

[Royale with Cheese]

5 hours ago, newcam2012 said:

What really irks me is the selection of Dorsey. Why? 

 

The Bills were in win it all mode last year. Big time hype and overwhelming favorites to win the Super Bowl. 

 

With that said, you don't put your chips into a rookie unproven OC. I don't care if he got Allen's blessing. I don't care if Dorsey had some familiarity with the offense. The Bills needed to upgrade the OC position. Not roll the dice with an unproven raw QB coach. 

 

Dorsey was the wrong guy for the job. He was unable to restrain a wild Allen, his offense lacked an identity, he abandoned the run game often, he lacked ingenuity, lacked using all his weapons, etc...

 

His offense got taken to the woodshed by DC Lou A. It was clear Dorsey had no answers. I'd argue last year Dosey hurt the Bills chances to advance further. Not the optimal choice by the Bills brass who clearly were favorites to win it all.

 

Can Dorsey improve? Of course that's possible. Same can be said that his elementary play calling continues. 

 

This year should tell us a lot about Dorsey and McD. That's a good thing because it's time to Shi$ or get off the pot.

 

We fans are salavating for a Super Bowl appearence and win. Just ask Allen and Diggs how they feel...

 

Yep.  I remember thinking last year, we can't score any points.  I think last year, we ended up I believe in the bottom 10 in points per game scoring.

Can you verify?

[C.Biscuit97]

23 hours ago, NewEra said:

You think it’s fair that Brandon Staley, Arthur Smith, McConnell and Mcdaniel should be ranked ahead of him?  There are more on the list that we can question….. but those 4 guys have no right at the moment 

 

 

So McDermott’s ranking is really stupid and far too low.  He is a very good coach and players have to love playing for him. His temperament is perfect for all the tough things we have had to deal with this year and in the past.

 

But based on your post, for this team this year: would I rather McDermott and Dorsey or would I rather have that nerd in Miami and Fangio? Personally, and it’s not even shade towards McDermott but that total package, I think I take that trade every day of the week. It would be scary to think that nerd boy could do with Allen and Fangio is considered one of the best DCs in football. If Tua stays healthy, they are an absolute problem. 

1 hour ago, TC in St. Louis said:

I disagree.  We're spoiled by success.  The 13 second game was a crazy failure, starting with the kickoff.  The Cinci game was a matter of our team just being out of gas and exhausted.  The defensive failures in the playoffs, following top rankings all season long....that's the problem.  McDermott has addressed this by taking over, and this will be the year when that all changes.

Look at soccer and the nba. They fire coaches who win championships after 3 years. It’s a wild profession. This list is stupid because it’s a projection. What McDermott has done as a Bills coach so far is at worst top 10. However, with this current roster, could there be a better coach, namely an offensive one who might be better? Possibly. But you are right. It’s because we have been spoiled and expectations are crazy. Look at Frazier: fired after consistently putting together top 10 defenses. It’s a wild business. 

[GunnerBill]

22 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

Ok, so you think that Beane was focusing on drafting 1st round defensive backs and DTs, and MLBs?

 

Let's blame Beane for giving away the best player in the NFL and drafting a corner instead. No wait.......Beane was not on the team yet.  Never mind.  

 

The 2017 draft was McDermott. No argument on that.

 

But the drafts since then are Brandon Beane's. And there has actually been a noticeable trend in Beane's drafting - athletic freak RAS guys that wasn't there in the 2017 class where Tre, Dion and Zay were older and weren't speed / size guys. 

[C.Biscuit97]

4 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The 2017 draft was McDermott. No argument on that.

 

But the drafts since then are Brandon Beane's. And there has actually been a noticeable trend in Beane's drafting - athletic freak RAS guys that wasn't there in the 2017 class where Tre, Dion and Zay were older and weren't speed / size guys. 

AJ doesn’t fit that mold though. Dude was maxed out in college. 
 

honestly, thank god, he hit on Allen. Because it’s been kinda meh since. But when you hit on a top 3 qb, you are good for awhile. Like the Colts have probably directed better than us but are stuck in qb purgatory.

[newcam2012]

1 hour ago, McBean said:

I love it.

 

What I’ve been saying for years now.

 

McClap very average coach hidden behind a superstar QB.

 

Daboll should’ve never been allowed to leave building. Will haunt franchise for years if we don’t win one with Allen.

 

Expectation this year is AFC title game minimum or McDermott needs fired immediately afterwards.

 

We don’t have another year to waste with a defensive minded mediocre HC trying to lead this team to the promise land. 
 

We have to go from good to great. McDermott helped the rebuild, but he isn’t going to get us over the top.

 

I’ll continue to repeat it until he’s fired.

I think we are in the minority here. 

 

I agree with your post. 

 

 

[Chandler#81]

3 hours ago, newcam2012 said:

Just like LeBron wanted Westbrook. How did that work out? 

 

Players should stick to playing and let managers make personnel decisions. 

 

Beginning and end of conversation. 

[your question was Why is Dorsey the OC] Try to remember what you type. I realize it’s a significant challenge for you..

🤷‍♂️

[newcam2012]

8 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Yeah he probably will. He'll probably win alot of regular season games only to struggle in the playoffs.  4 years is a trend, not an anomaly. And honestly I'm giving Josh much more credit for these wins than any brilliant game day strategies by McD.  13 seconds kind of validates that. It's just so damn hard to criticize him because of pulling this organization out of the drought.  And all his success with the team culture.  He's just not going to ever outscheme coaches in high leverage games.  Levy had the same problem. 

I kept shaking my head in agreement as I read your post. 

 

Couldn't agree more. 

[C.Biscuit97]

2 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

I think we are in the minority here. 

 

I agree with your post. 

 

 

Do I think McDermott is some elite strategist? No. But I think some people are overlooking is when a team has high expectations, it’s keep guys in check and not letting egos get out of control. In that regards, I think SM is great at that. The way he deals with Diggs when he is crying on the sidelines is so underrated. Like weirdo Phil Jackson wasn’t the best X’s and O’s guy but he kept Shaq, Kobe, Jordan, and Pippen in check. That’s a huge thing when you are dealing with pro athletes. McDermott is top 5 imo at that. 

[newcam2012]

42 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Yep.  I remember thinking last year, we can't score any points.  I think last year, we ended up I believe in the bottom 10 in points per game scoring.

Can you verify?

No.

[Chandler#81]

12 hours ago, Fan in Chicago said:

Ross Tucker just proved himself to be an idiot. 

You, on the other hand, are better than that. You know its not a fair ranking. 

Certainly the ranking of newbies is stupid. The ‘fair assessment I’m talking about is the issues we’ve all witnessed Sean has regarding conservatism, clock mgmt and coaching in big games.

[NewEra]

11 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

So McDermott’s ranking is really stupid and far too low.  He is a very good coach and players have to love playing for him. His temperament is perfect for all the tough things we have had to deal with this year and in the past.

 

But based on your post, for this team this year: would I rather McDermott and Dorsey or would I rather have that nerd in Miami and Fangio? Personally, and it’s not even shade towards McDermott but that total package, I think I take that trade every day of the week. It would be scary to think that nerd boy could do with Allen and Fangio is considered one of the best DCs in football. If Tua stays healthy, they are an absolute problem. 

Look at soccer and the nba. They fire coaches who win championships after 3 years. It’s a wild profession. This list is stupid because it’s a projection. What McDermott has done as a Bills coach so far is at worst top 10. However, with this current roster, could there be a better coach, namely an offensive one who might be better? Possibly. But you are right. It’s because we have been spoiled and expectations are crazy. Look at Frazier: fired after consistently putting together top 10 defenses. It’s a wild business. 

I think I had already said upthread that I’d rather have Mcdaniels and Fangio.  But preferring mcdaniels and Fangio isn’t an endorsement for mcdaniels being a better head coach than mcdermott.  It’s Fangio is a world class DC while Dorsey is still unproven. It’s a coordinator comparison as much as it is a preference of having an offensive HC 

 

this thread is about head coaches. Not HC/ coordinator combos   Mcdermott needs to be ahead of Mcdaniels at this point.  That narrative may change after the season. But the article isn’t written after the season

 

 

7 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

I think we are in the minority here. 

 

I agree with your post. 

 

 

If you agree that McD is is a very average coach hidden by a superstar QB, how can he take a tank team, with a bad OC, no QB or playmakers on O to the playoffs?  
 

If he’s so average how can that 2017 team have a better record than Mcdaniels had last year with a loaded roster?  Mcdermott coached a scab team to the playoffs 

[C.Biscuit97]

4 minutes ago, NewEra said:

I think I had already said upthread that I’d rather have Mcdaniels and Fangio.  But preferring mcdaniels and Fangio isn’t an endorsement for mcdaniels being a better head coach than mcdermott.  It’s Fangio is a world class DC while Dorsey is still unproven. It’s a coordinator comparison as much as it is a preference of having an offensive HC 

 

this thread is about head coaches. Not HC/ coordinator combos   Mcdermott needs to be ahead of Mcdaniels at this point.  That narrative may change after the season. But the article isn’t written after the season

 

 

That’s fair. After both of their first seasons, I would put McDaniels ahead of SM though. But I think both are top type coaches. 

[newcam2012]

2 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Do I think McDermott is some elite strategist? No. But I think some people are overlooking is when a team has high expectations, it’s keep guys in check and not letting egos get out of control. In that regards, I think SM is great at that. The way he deals with Diggs when he is crying on the sidelines is so underrated. Like weirdo Phil Jackson wasn’t the best X’s and O’s guy but he kept Shaq, Kobe, Jordan, and Pippen in check. That’s a huge thing when you are dealing with pro athletes. McDermott is top 5 imo at that. 

I firmly believe McD will lose Diggs if the Bills fail to meet expectations. 

 

I don't think anyone questions McD's ability to build a nice culture and attitude in the locker room. However, this only gets you so far. 

 

I'd ask you to look at both sides of the lines. In the trenches sort of speak. Where is the nastiness, toughness, chippy play, and bad was attitude? I haven't seen it in the McD era. Have you? 

 

Clapping only gets you so far. 

14 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

[your question was Why is Dorsey the OC] Try to remember what you type. I realize it’s a significant challenge for you..

🤷‍♂️

The question was rhetorical. Look up the definition if you don't understand it. 

 

My point was it was a mistake to hire an inexperienced Dorsey especially when the Bills were making a legitimate run for the Lombardi. 

 

Feel free to disagree.

[Mr. WEO]

23 hours ago, NewEra said:

He made the playoffs with Tyrod Taylor @ QB in a season in which everyone thought we were tanking.   Shady and Clay were our  most targeted receivers.  Zay, Deonte Thonpson, KB, Andre Holmes.  That team had a better record than Mike Mcdaniels who had a loaded roster and a better QB. 

Mike Tolbert.

 

 

 

That was 6 years ago--maybe Tucker had him ranked top 10 way back then?

 

How long does McD eat free off of "ended the drought"?

 

If this was the NBA, he would have been fired the day after they got punked by Cincy.

[Chandler#81]

3 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

 

Oh please.  Dorsey was being groomed to replace Daboll since he became QB's coach in 2019.  He had ties back to the Panthers with McBeane since 2013.  Their were teams after Dorsey for the OC position in 2021 but Dorsey received a promotion in title because the Bills brass knew they wouldn't have Daboll much longer.  It wasn't Josh stumping for him that got him the job.

 

In terms of his performance.  The cold hard stats say that we finished second in points and yards per game and yards per game (better than the 2021 offense under Daboll).  That was despite losing Beasley and Sanders who were better in their roles in 2021 than McKenzie and Davis were in 2022.  Not bad for a first time coordinator despite the bad game in the divisional round of the playoffs.  Let's see what Dorsey can do in his second year with an upgraded o-line and a better TE2 before we cry about his hiring.

Oh please. He was a ‘gofer’ for Dabol and the (double quote) QBs coach. I have no confidence he’ll be able to scheme Kincaid effectively as he never played with a good Tight End, never created plays for one so he’s fully devoid of what  can be done with a talent like this. Our Offense was so crappy and unimaginable by the 2nd half of the season, it became ‘Just let Josh be Josh’. I’d throw my laptop too!

[newcam2012]

12 minutes ago, NewEra said:

I think I had already said upthread that I’d rather have Mcdaniels and Fangio.  But preferring mcdaniels and Fangio isn’t an endorsement for mcdaniels being a better head coach than mcdermott.  It’s Fangio is a world class DC while Dorsey is still unproven. It’s a coordinator comparison as much as it is a preference of having an offensive HC 

 

this thread is about head coaches. Not HC/ coordinator combos   Mcdermott needs to be ahead of Mcdaniels at this point.  That narrative may change after the season. But the article isn’t written after the season

 

 

If you agree that McD is is a very average coach hidden by a superstar QB, how can he take a tank team, with a bad OC, no QB or playmakers on O to the playoffs?  
 

If he’s so average how can that 2017 team have a better record than Mcdaniels had last year with a loaded roster?  Mcdermott coached a scab team to the playoffs 

I think he's a great team builder. Very good at making steps in the right direction for a mediocre team.

 

Come playoff time against the big boys his flaws are clearly exposed and evident. Think Marty S as can example. 

[Royale with Cheese]

27 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

No.

 

Where were we actually ranked?

[NewEra]

21 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

That’s fair. After both of their first seasons, I would put McDaniels ahead of SM though. But I think both are top type coaches. 

After their first seasons you’d put mcdaniels over mcdermott?  For real?

 

mcdermott had a better record than mcdaniels and had less than 1/2 the talent on the roster.  The talent level of those two teams is not even comparable.  
 

 

[Dopey]

22 hours ago, uticaclub said:

Daboll deserves to be higher than McD, the others you can debate.

 

It's not that we are too good for a playoff caliber coach, it's that we want a Super Bowl.  Do they Bucs win if they don't fire Dungy?

So far, Daboll has done exactly what McDermott did in his 1st season as a HC. Went 9-7 to surprise the NFL with a playoff appearance. So far, he's 1-1 in the playoffs where McD is 4-5, but 4-3 in the past 3 seasons. I don't agree that he is a terrible playoff coach. I do agree with those who say with McD taking over play calling for the D, the clock as started. He has 2 years to do bring a title, or he's gone. No way does he deserve to be ahead of McD, IMO.

[NewEra]

15 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

I think he's a great team builder. Very good at making steps in the right direction for a mediocre team.

 

Come playoff time against the big boys his flaws are clearly exposed and evident. Think Marty S as can example. 

 

Good comparison.  I agree.  
 

I think it goes to my point that many have said in this thread. Mcdermott is being judged on not winning a Super Bowl with an elite QB.  He’s had an elite QB for 3 seasons.  

 

In one of those seasons (last season) our team was decimated with injuries.  We didn’t have a championship caliber roster on the field when we got smacked by Cinci.   I remember watching Mahomes get destroyed in the SB after losing Eric Fisher vs us and their entire OL was backups.  Injuries matter. They mattered last season and I don’t put that on McD.  

 

The blame clearly falls on him for the first 2 other two seasons.  And in both of those seasons, he lost to the best QB/coach combo in the league.  Does that mean he’s not a very good coach?  
 

🤷🏻‍♂️ I think it’s unfair to judge him on not winning with an elite QB (in 3 whole seasons) when his only real opportunities, he’s been beaten by the best QB and by the injury bug.