Stadium Construction Discussion (No PSL/Seat selection posts)

[Stroke 17]

Starting to hit home that as a 50 year STH when my time comes to choose I will have to consider that I will be 71 for the home opener in 2026.

 

My PSL fee will be for a shorter time than those of you in your 30's or 40's or even your 50's. Doesn't seem fair I get the same price as younger.

 

I know the resale option and the passing on to my kids but those options may not be viable. So for my 50 years of fandom and probably $20,000 The Bills will be able to resell my PSL when I get too old make the 300 mile round trip or just die.

 

Perhaps if the Bills finally win a SB before that happens maybe it will all have been worth it.

 

GO BILLS! 

[SoonerBillsFan]

14 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

I'm just calling it like I see it

 

It's billionaires who want more money at the end of the day...

 

But if you're playing hardball... And this is what it takes to keep the bills in Buffalo

 

I would rather do that than not have them

And that's the problem. Fans want the team in town so badly, but now many of the true die hard fans just can't afford it.

 

It's the problem that Terry saw Ralph use for decades,and that is fans are willing to do anything just to have a team.

[SoonerBillsFan]

13 hours ago, QCity said:

 

The PSLs are going to depreciate. If, in 10 years, Josh retires and the team goes back to the Doug Marrone / EJ Manuel 6-11 days they will sink like an absolute brick. You can't have half your STHs underwater and possibly defaulting on their loans. They want their money now.

 

I don't know who needs to hear this, but if you have to take out a 20-year loan to afford club tickets, you can't afford club tickets.

 

And that is what the NFL wants. They want the riff raff as someone said, gone from stadiums.  To hell with how long they have been die hard fans.

 

And it's Terry Pegula, not other owners, the state or county,that gets PSL money. 

[PromoTheRobot]

39 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

And that is what the NFL wants. They want the riff raff as someone said, gone from stadiums.  To hell with how long they have been die hard fans.

 

And it's Terry Pegula, not other owners, the state or county,that gets PSL money. 

 

Correct. Fan PSLs are part off the Bills "contribution" towards building the stadium. 

[SoCal Deek]

47 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

And that is what the NFL wants. They want the riff raff as someone said, gone from stadiums.  To hell with how long they have been die hard fans.

 

And it's Terry Pegula, not other owners, the state or county,that gets PSL money. 

I think the NFL wants what every business wants. They want their customers to pay more money for the products and/or services they provide. That doesn’t make them evil. It makes them…normal. 

[Mango]

On 3/20/2024 at 8:36 PM, Mr Info said:

This is something that surprised me. The Bills had the seventh highest average resale ticket price. Bills average resale tix were more expensive than the Giants, Packers, and Steelers.
https://touchdownwire.usatoday.com/lists/nfl-ticket-prices-every-team/

 

The last few years the Bills have had a bunch of weeks where they have the most expensive cheap seats in the league. As in other teams club, box, premium seats are more expensive, but the rockpile, last row of the furthest end of the 300 is more expensive than every other cheapest option in any other stadium. 

[PBF81]

17 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I think the NFL wants what every business wants. They want their customers to pay more money for the products and/or services they provide. That doesn’t make them evil. It makes them…normal. 

 

There's a little more than a fine line there.

 

To start, we're talking about billionaires, people that have all that they or their extended families could ever need in a lifetime.  Let's not forget that while the negotiation process was going on, the Pegs bought a pricey yacht.  That amidst cries from Kim that they had a lifestyle to maintain as somewhat of a slap in the face of many fans.  Let's put that in a different yet not nearly as egregious context.  

 

Suppose a small business owner wanted a state/county $100k grant to expand their business and claimed that they needed the money for it because, as the Pegs stated, they didn't have it.  Then while negotiating for that grant they went out and bought a brand new car claiming that they had a lifestyle to maintain?  How would that look to the people from whom that grant was coming?  

 

All that while they bilked the state and county taxpayers for $850M more, many of which are not Even Bills fans.  

 

The NFL is evil greedy.  The individual owners want more than what every business wants, they want the public,  beyond game attendees, to pay for their business expenses.  

 

 

[Mango]

20 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

To be fair AT&t stadium only has four concerts booked through the end of the year right now

 

A few rodeos a few boxing matches and a bunch of soccer matches

 

Soccer has zero appeal in Buffalo basically.. neither does the rodeo

 

So they have four concerts and a few boxing 

 

That's not mega cool huge events happening all the time to be fair... Like nobody cares about a rodeo in Buffalo

 

And every single stadium study showed it does nothing for the local economy big picture 

 

To be clear if you have a PSL at AT&T you have access to dozens and dozens of events.There were 13 concerts at AT&T last year, including 3 Taylor Swift shows (No Mega Huge Events?). Plus Supercross, Monster Trucks, Rodeo's, WWE, big time college football, and soccer games. In concerts alone you get a star every month or so. They are also getting 9 World Cup Games in 2026. Maybe the biggest sporting event on the globe. Also not a Mega Cool Huge Event?

Which is the point @MikePJ76 is making. For $20k you get 8-11 NFL football games. And that is it. That is the list of events. Buffalo having the market or not having the market for those events really does not matter in this conversation. In fact I would say it is an argument against PSL's. 

 

https://www.concertarchives.org/venues/at-t-stadium--5

Edited March 22 by Mango

[SoCal Deek]

7 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

There's a little more than a fine line there.

 

To start, we're talking about billionaires, people that have all that they or their extended families could ever need in a lifetime.  Let's not forget that while the negotiation process was going on, the Pegs bought a pricey yacht.  That amidst cries from Kim that they had a lifestyle to maintain as somewhat of a slap in the face of many fans.  Let's put that in a different yet not nearly as egregious context.  

 

Suppose a small business owner wanted a state/county $100k grant to expand their business and claimed that they needed the money for it because, as the Pegs stated, they didn't have it.  Then while negotiating for that grant they went out and bought a brand new car claiming that they had a lifestyle to maintain?  How would that look to the people from whom that grant was coming?  

 

All that while they bilked the state and county taxpayers for $850M more, many of which are not Even Bills fans.  

 

The NFL is evil greedy.  The individual owners want more than what every business wants, they want the public,  beyond game attendees, to pay for their business expenses.  

 

 

Are you under the impression that most large companies you purchase goods and services from are NOT owned by multi-millionaires if not billionaires? They are! 

[PBF81]

1 minute ago, SoCal Deek said:

Are you under the impression that most large companies you purchase goods and services from are NOT owned by multi-millionaires if not billionaires? They are! 

 

To start, that has zero to do with the point.  

 

Otherwise I'm not sure that this is the place to discuss how corporate America is structured such that 95% (or so) of the corporations are owned by other corporations, all ultimately controlled via that network of corporate control, and ultimately controlled by a very few families in the world.  

 

It's a red-pill thing that most are clueless on.  

 

 

[Mango]

15 hours ago, QCity said:

 

The PSLs are going to depreciate. If, in 10 years, Josh retires and the team goes back to the Doug Marrone / EJ Manuel 6-11 days they will sink like an absolute brick. You can't have half your STHs underwater and possibly defaulting on their loans. They want their money now.

 

I don't know who needs to hear this, but if you have to take out a 20-year loan to afford club tickets, you can't afford club tickets.

 

 

I am fairly confident the BIlls will tank post Allen if Pegula moves on from Bean. The Sabres are a disaster of an organization. Another poster who works in pro sports mentioned that even though the Bills are winning, they are known for being poorly or mediocrely run in pro sports business circles. If the Bills move on from Bean after Allen retires I think the franchise is screwed. 

 

Look at the Sabres, their high water mark under Pegula (13 years) is last years 91 pt team that missed the playoffs. We might be begging for 7-9 at some point. 

 

[Mango]

16 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

I'm just calling it like I see it

 

It's billionaires who want more money at the end of the day...

 

But if you're playing hardball... And this is what it takes to keep the bills in Buffalo

 

I would rather do that than not have them

 

This isn't fair to anybody other than the owners. Fans should continue to complain about unfair practices and bad management without being beat over the head with "Well if you don't like it, maybe I will just move the team". 

This seems to be a practice Terry has been pretty good at. it is a conversation in a lot of Sabres circles and was floated during stadium negotiations (Austin). If the teams response to anything critical is "well if you don't agree, maybe I will just move the team" then go ahead and move the team you (Terry) POS. What an abusive relationship to be in. "If you don't let me treat you poorly, I won't treat you like anything at all". 

EDIT: This isn't Ralph's cash to cap or Toronto series to balance the books. This a pure profit line for one of the hottest tickets in the NFL in a city that can barely afford it. 

Edited March 22 by Mango

[Buffalo716]

2 hours ago, Mango said:

 

This isn't fair to anybody other than the owners. Fans should continue to complain about unfair practices and bad management without being beat over the head with "Well if you don't like it, maybe I will just move the team". 

This seems to be a practice Terry has been pretty good at. it is a conversation in a lot of Sabres circles and was floated during stadium negotiations (Austin). If the teams response to anything critical is "well if you don't agree, maybe I will just move the team" then go ahead and move the team you (Terry) POS. What an abusive relationship to be in. "If you don't let me treat you poorly, I won't treat you like anything at all". 

EDIT: This isn't Ralph's cash to cap or Toronto series to balance the books. This a pure profit line for one of the hottest tickets in the NFL in a city that can barely afford it. 

Yeah but you also forget that life is not fair

 

I learned that when I was a child... Buffalo and the state of New York either plays ball

 

Or we would have lost the Buffalo Bills

 

As somebody whose family has had season tickets since day one I know where I stand... I want the Buffalo Bills in Buffalo

 

Even if billionaires are playing greedy games... But they became billionaires because they are greedy at the end of the day

 

Do you get upset when a bee stings you? No it's a bee

 

I don't get upset when a greedy billionaire shows who he really is... I've expected this all along

[Mango]

42 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Yeah but you also forget that life is not fair

 

I learned that when I was a child... Buffalo and the state of New York either plays ball

 

Or we would have lost the Buffalo Bills

 

As somebody whose family has had season tickets since day one I know where I stand... I want the Buffalo Bills in Buffalo

 

Even if billionaires are playing greedy games... But they became billionaires because they are greedy at the end of the day

 

Do you get upset when a bee stings you? No it's a bee

 

I don't get upset when a greedy billionaire shows who he really is... I've expected this all along

Actually when I get stung by a bee I yell “ow, fork!” then swat it. If they make their home on my kids swing set I remove it.  
 

“You die a hero or live long enough to be the villain” is likely more apt. I am fairly confident that Pegula is an Allen retirement and being tasked with hiring from being run out of town. The Sabres are begging for the Golisano years and if Pegula moves on from Bean we will be longing for the cash to cap era. 
 

Even a broken clock is right twice a day. 

[mrags]

1 minute ago, Mango said:

Actually when I get stung by a bee I yell “ow, fork!” then swat it. If they make their home on my kids swing set I remove it.  
 

“You die a hero or live long enough to be the villain” is likely more apt. I am fairly confident that Pegula is an Allen retirement and being tasked with hiring from being run out of town. The Sabres are begging for the Golisano years and if Pegula moves on from Bean we will be longing for the cash to cap era. 
 

Even a broken clock is right twice a day. 

Yeah I agree that Pegula is pretty much a huge POS also. Let’s be honest, his wife is the only reason why he owns the Bills and Sabres. He doesn’t care about the town or nearby areas. All he cares about is making money. At least now that his trophy wife is no longer able to run things for him. 

[PromoTheRobot]

8 minutes ago, Mango said:

Actually when I get stung by a bee I yell “ow, fork!” then swat it. If they make their home on my kids swing set I remove it.  
 

“You die a hero or live long enough to be the villain” is likely more apt. I am fairly confident that Pegula is an Allen retirement and being tasked with hiring from being run out of town. The Sabres are begging for the Golisano years and if Pegula moves on from Bean we will be longing for the cash to cap era. 
 

Even a broken clock is right twice a day. 

 

4 minutes ago, mrags said:

Yeah I agree that Pegula is pretty much a huge POS also. Let’s be honest, his wife is the only reason why he owns the Bills and Sabres. He doesn’t care about the town or nearby areas. All he cares about is making money. At least now that his trophy wife is no longer able to run things for him. 

 

You don't want to hear it but Terry is the only reason we aren't watching the Toronto Bon Jovi Bills now. I also don't think either of you watch the Sabres much, other than the scoreboard and standings. It just takes longer to develop a team in hockey. The Sabres are slowly getting there now that they have a goalie and defense.

[K-9]

6 minutes ago, mrags said:

Yeah I agree that Pegula is pretty much a huge POS also. Let’s be honest, his wife is the only reason why he owns the Bills and Sabres. He doesn’t care about the town or nearby areas. All he cares about is making money. At least now that his trophy wife is no longer able to run things for him. 

I don’t know if that’s true about Pegula. He was a die hard Bills and Sabres fan long before his success in the oil business and he had season tickets when he lived in Olean. 

[mrags]

1 minute ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

 

You don't want to hear it but Terry is the only reason we aren't watching the Toronto Bon Jovi Bills now. I also don't think either of you watch the Sabres much, other than the scoreboard and standings. It just takes longer to develop a team in hockey. The Sabres are slowly getting there now that they have a goalie and defense.

I hate hockey and I hate the Sabres even more. I’m completely satisfied every time they get within a few games of the playoffs and rip the hearts of all the sad sacks that watch them. 
 

and I don’t care that Pegula saved the Bills from Toronto. Truth is, they belong there. We have no business having a pro football team in this city. And the stupid PSL numbers seem to be proving that. I’ve been telling everyone for a while now. The fans that attend these games moving forward in the new stadium will not be what true bills fans want or think. 

1 minute ago, K-9 said:

I don’t know if that’s true about Pegula. He was a die hard Bills and Sabres fan long before his success in the oil business and he had season tickets when he lived in Olean. 

Most people never even heard of Pegula before he was a name attatched to buying either team. 

[Buffalo716]

17 minutes ago, Mango said:

Actually when I get stung by a bee I yell “ow, fork!” then swat it. If they make their home on my kids swing set I remove it.  
 

“You die a hero or live long enough to be the villain” is likely more apt. I am fairly confident that Pegula is an Allen retirement and being tasked with hiring from being run out of town. The Sabres are begging for the Golisano years and if Pegula moves on from Bean we will be longing for the cash to cap era. 
 

Even a broken clock is right twice a day. 

Ofc he isn't a hero lol

 

He doesn't give two s**** about us or Buffalo at the end of the day

[K-9]

3 minutes ago, mrags said:

Most people never even heard of Pegula before he was a name attatched to buying either team. 

That stands to reason but that doesn’t mean he didn’t have an affection for Buffalo, the Bills, Sabres, and WNY before buying either team. He just doesn’t fit the profile of someone who doesn’t care about this community.