Bills Roster Discussion

[hondo in seattle]

1 hour ago, BlazinBill said:

I really don't t like our WR room at all- was really hoping after not getting Hopkins we did something - I guess there's still time.

I don't see the Bills suddenly having 175 targets between 2 TE's bit hey Go Bills - 

I have no issues eating crow 

 

After watching him last year, I'm not happy with Davis as our #2 either.  As a Bills fan, though, I hope I'm wrong and his apologists are right and his ankle was hurt and his catch percentage was negatively impacted by the longer routes he ran, and all that junk. 

 

But overall, I'm happy with our pass catchers.  I think Harty is a better version of McKenzie and Sherfield is a solid addition.  Kincaid will be a valuable addition as well and as Beane said, gives us an option we didn't have last year.  And we have two RBs - Cook and Hines - who can be good out of the backfield if Dorsey decides to use them that way.  

 

I wonder if Beane did enough for the OL but Dorsey has enough weapons to score points.  

[SCBills]

If Kincaid can become Kelce-lite as a rookie, then Davis is fine as WR2, but I just haven't seen a skillset from him that resembles that of a high-end WR2 in a pass-heavy offense.  

 

Limited route tree and doesn't look fluid enough to run certain routes you'd expect a WR2 to be able to run.  

 

If Kincaid becomes our default WR2, then Gabe Davis is a weapon at WR3, given his big play ability.  

 

Here's to hoping a healthy Gabe can be more than a deep threat who excels at off-schedule plays and provides the occasional come-back route. That's a nice, high-end WR3 skill set, but we need more from a WR2.

 

 

Edited May 3, 2023 by SCBills

[Straight Hucklebuck]

On 5/3/2023 at 11:44 AM, SCBills said:

If Kincaid can become Kelce-lite as a rookie, then Davis is fine as WR2, but I just haven't seen a skillset from him that resembles that of a high-end WR2 in a pass-heavy offense.  

 

Limited route tree and doesn't look fluid enough to run certain routes you'd expect a WR2 to be able to run.  

 

If Kincaid becomes our default WR2, then Gabe Davis is a weapon at WR3, given his big play ability.  

 

Here's to hoping a healthy Gabe can be more than a deep threat who excels at off-schedule plays and provides the occasional come-back route. That's a nice, high-end WR3 skill set, but we need more from a WR2.

 

 

Can Shakir play and win on the outside, or is he slot only?

 

Can he eat into Gabe’s snap count.

 

His role / path to the field is kind of a murky to me. 
 

Because Harty is right behind him and the Bills say he can play inside or outside.

 

All of this to say do the Bills have enough outside depth to not have Gabe at 95%+ snap count?

[hondo in seattle]

12 hours ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Can Shakir play and win on the outside, or is he slot only?

 

Can he eat into Gabe’s snap count.

 

His role / path to the field is kind of a murky to me. 
 

Because Harty is right behind him and the Bills say he can play inside or outside.

 

All of this to say do the Bills have enough outside depth to not have Gabe at 95%+ snap count?

 

I think both Harty and Sherfield will eat into Gabe's snap count.  I'm expecting/hoping for better target distribution this year.  

[ganesh]

On 5/3/2023 at 9:14 PM, SCBills said:

If Kincaid can become Kelce-lite as a rookie, then Davis is fine as WR2, but I just haven't seen a skillset from him that resembles that of a high-end WR2 in a pass-heavy offense.  

 

Limited route tree and doesn't look fluid enough to run certain routes you'd expect a WR2 to be able to run.  

 

If Kincaid becomes our default WR2, then Gabe Davis is a weapon at WR3, given his big play ability.  

 

Here's to hoping a healthy Gabe can be more than a deep threat who excels at off-schedule plays and provides the occasional come-back route. That's a nice, high-end WR3 skill set, but we need more from a WR2.

 

 

Gabe will command a $10-12M annual salary next year and we wil already be against the cap.  He is as good as gone next year.  

[Shemp]

Nobody's talking about Beasley. Is he finished as a Bill and/or an NFL player?

[John from Riverside]

On 5/3/2023 at 6:31 AM, BlazinBill said:

I really don't t like our WR room at all- was really hoping after not getting Hopkins we did something - I guess there's still time.

I don't see the Bills suddenly having 175 targets between 2 TE's bit hey Go Bills - 

I have no issues eating crow 

There is a true number one receiver on this team with diggs well over 1000 yards every year

 

The wide receiver that we’re all trying to replace was at 800 yards

 

Dalton Kincaid was considered the best pure pass catcher out of this draft and then included wide receivers

 

Shakur showed promise towards the end of last season

 

 

Trent Sherfield was good enough to be the third receiver on a talented Miami Dolphins squad

 

The rest of these guys are lottery tickets with high upside

[TOboy]

8 hours ago, Shemp said:

Nobody's talking about Beasley. Is he finished as a Bill and/or an NFL player?

It’s very possible. He retired last year, currently remains unsigned, and the team seems to have filled his role. 

[John from Riverside]

Have any of the main veteran defensive ends, signed with other teams yet?
 

Just keeping an eye on whether or not we’re going to get a Melvin Ingram, or a Justin Houston type

[BillsFanForever19]

On 5/9/2023 at 11:49 AM, Shemp said:

Nobody's talking about Beasley. Is he finished as a Bill and/or an NFL player?

 

Beasley's done here. Kincaid is a TE in name only and is actually a Big Slot. Deonte Harty will be playing Outside and Inside. Khalil Shakir is going to have the training wheels taken off and will be getting more Slot work. The slot is covered and crowded. 

 

Beasley was a Hail Mary in the slot late last season after Jamison Crowder went down, Isaiah McKenzie was underperforming, and McDermott wanted to bring Shakir along slowly in his Rookie year. 

 

He performed okay. But he wasn't his old self. That's why we addressed the position with Kincaid and Harty. There's no place for Beasley, unless he wants to be a Practice Squad guy. Our 53 WR core is set in stone already.

[Eastport bills]

On 4/29/2023 at 11:24 AM, KDIGGZ said:

I wouldn't put Kincaid over Knox. It sounds like Knox is the every down TE and Kincaid takes Morris' spot.

 

Also Bernard starting at MLB I don't see happening. I'd say Dodson is the starter at this moment, which is a scary thought.

 

Harris over Cook as the every down back.

 

I think Quessenberry will be starting at RT at some point this year if not now.

 

I see glaring needs at WR and MLB. I hope they are not done adding people.

If Quessenbury is starting at tackle because Brown has been injured or hasn’t performed, this team will be needing an upgrade in season.Torrence and McGovern will be immediate upgrades so I see improvement at the RB position and pass protection  with Brown being one year further into his development. Harris will provide a dimension of short yardage, between the tackles physicality in the running game we desperately need along with Murray.Cook and Hines are perfect complimentary backs for explosive runs. This receiving corp will be hard to deal with if Dorsey doesn’t light a match to this team by not competently incorporating a conventional running attack along with  making Kincaid a red zone and slot option, while keeping Diggs and Davis engaged. His play calling is probably the biggest? facing this team. The defense will be a work in progress until Miller comes back to form and the MLB position gets sorted, but the additions of Williams and Ford should be real positives. Look for the secondary to be much improved with Hyde and Rapp. If White and Elam can be better than last year, we might be formidable by week 6 or 7. All things considered this team will be a juggernaut on offense and if we can generate any pas rush, we could be a real SB contender. With Sean calling the defense, that’s might be the biggest upgrade.

[BillsFanForever19]

On 5/3/2023 at 9:31 AM, BlazinBill said:

I really don't t like our WR room at all- was really hoping after not getting Hopkins we did something - I guess there's still time.

I don't see the Bills suddenly having 175 targets between 2 TE's bit hey Go Bills - 

I have no issues eating crow 

 

Again, you're looking at Kincaid wrong. He's a TE in name only. He's actually a Slot WR, much like Kelce is in KC.

 

Kincaid and Harty will take the pressure off of Davis that existed last season. Shakir getting the training wheels taken off as well. If Davis is struggling, Harty will cut into his reps. And I expect Diggs, Kincaid, and Davis to be on the field most downs. Kincaid can easily be the #2 option to Josh and at the very least will require more coverage, taking coverage away from Davis.

 

Kincaid and Harty represent the insurance to Davis' underperformance last season. We were never going to Draft a Receiving weapon in the 1st Round as we had AND make another massive investment in another weapon - with Diggs and Davis here and with having signed Harty and Sherfield.

 

Long story short, with the additions of Kincaid, Harty, Sherfield, and Shorter (with Shakir given more reps) - the Receiving core as a whole is in MUCH better shape than it was last season. 

Edited May 11, 2023 by BillsFanForever19

[PrimeTime101]

On 5/7/2023 at 10:11 AM, ganesh said:

Gabe will command a $10-12M annual salary next year and we wil already be against the cap.  He is as good as gone next year.  

Spotrac is not the end of all means. Spotrac has Davis at WR Rank: 29. That means he can be another teams #1 in the nfl. I am sorry but that ranking is way to high so I did some research on pff and top 100 WR's? 

 

Gabes off is not even on the top 50. 

36th in targets, 52nd in receptions, 30th in yards (thanks JA) 12th in TDl. again (thanks JA) 

his last 5 games he averaged 60.56 yet Spotrac has him graded on the low end of the WR list at 29... makes ZERO sense. Spotrac has gabe at around 12 mil but lets play at your 10 mil 5 year deal at 50 mil? that would put him around 19th best paid WR in the league...

 

Just stupid. I personally put Davis at around 8-9m a year. Especially if he repeats last year. 

[GunnerBill]

10 hours ago, PrimeTime101 said:

Spotrac is not the end of all means. Spotrac has Davis at WR Rank: 29. That means he can be another teams #1 in the nfl. I am sorry but that ranking is way to high so I did some research on pff and top 100 WR's? 

 

Gabes off is not even on the top 50. 

36th in targets, 52nd in receptions, 30th in yards (thanks JA) 12th in TDl. again (thanks JA) 

his last 5 games he averaged 60.56 yet Spotrac has him graded on the low end of the WR list at 29... makes ZERO sense. Spotrac has gabe at around 12 mil but lets play at your 10 mil 5 year deal at 50 mil? that would put him around 19th best paid WR in the league...

 

Just stupid. I personally put Davis at around 8-9m a year. Especially if he repeats last year. 

 

Worth saying there will still be some #1 receivers on rookie deals. Chase obviously, but Olave and Wilson possibly too so it isn't quite as easy as 29th best paid so that means he is a #1. I have said before the best comp for Gabe Davis is Michael Gallup, in that he is a lower end #2 receiver who doesn't run a full route tree, is not a big separator and is mainly used on lower percentage down the field type routes. They have both had issues at time with drops. Gallup got $11.5m AAV. I think if Gabe has a year like last year - 800 plus yards and 7 touchdowns - that is where he will end up. 

[PrimeTime101]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Worth saying there will still be some #1 receivers on rookie deals. Chase obviously, but Olave and Wilson possibly too so it isn't quite as easy as 29th best paid so that means he is a #1. I have said before the best comp for Gabe Davis is Michael Gallup, in that he is a lower end #2 receiver who doesn't run a full route tree, is not a big separator and is mainly used on lower percentage down the field type routes. They have both had issues at time with drops. Gallup got $11.5m AAV. I think if Gabe has a year like last year - 800 plus yards and 7 touchdowns - that is where he will end up. 

these numbers lol... that will be a hard contract to swallow. 

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, PrimeTime101 said:

these numbers lol... that will be a hard contract to swallow. 

 

I don't think the Bills will pay him to be clear.

[PrimeTime101]

13 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I don't think the Bills will pay him to be clear.

No, I do not think he is worth that, put him on a team lets say... The Chargers. A team that just maybe makes a top 10 team. (trying not to be bias)  Gabe does NOT get close to these yards.. so no.. we should not resign him unless it is a team friendly deal. First big new contract.. he going to want the money

[newcam2012]

17 hours ago, Eastport bills said:

If Quessenbury is starting at tackle because Brown has been injured or hasn’t performed, this team will be needing an upgrade in season.Torrence and McGovern will be immediate upgrades so I see improvement at the RB position and pass protection  with Brown being one year further into his development. Harris will provide a dimension of short yardage, between the tackles physicality in the running game we desperately need along with Murray.Cook and Hines are perfect complimentary backs for explosive runs. This receiving corp will be hard to deal with if Dorsey doesn’t light a match to this team by not competently incorporating a conventional running attack along with  making Kincaid a red zone and slot option, while keeping Diggs and Davis engaged. His play calling is probably the biggest? facing this team. The defense will be a work in progress until Miller comes back to form and the MLB position gets sorted, but the additions of Williams and Ford should be real positives. Look for the secondary to be much improved with Hyde and Rapp. If White and Elam can be better than last year, we might be formidable by week 6 or 7. All things considered this team will be a juggernaut on offense and if we can generate any pas rush, we could be a real SB contender. With Sean calling the defense, that’s might be the biggest upgrade.

That's best case scenario. There are a lot of ifs, question marks, and unknowns to any season. We will have to see how it plays out. 

 

I think it's pretty safe to say the Bills are Super Bowl contenders. They have to be in the AFC discussion. 

[GunnerBill]

35 minutes ago, PrimeTime101 said:

No, I do not think he is worth that, put him on a team lets say... The Chargers. A team that just maybe makes a top 10 team. (trying not to be bias)  Gabe does NOT get close to these yards.. so no.. we should not resign him unless it is a team friendly deal. First big new contract.. he going to want the money

 

The Chargers are an actual option. Mike Williams is $33m on the cap next year, $12m dead if they get out. They aint paying him $33m. Likely Keenan Allen's last year too. Gabe is a level below Williams but they are similar players and the difference isn't huge. Tom Telesco loves bigger receivers. 

[NewEra]

8 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Worth saying there will still be some #1 receivers on rookie deals. Chase obviously, but Olave and Wilson possibly too so it isn't quite as easy as 29th best paid so that means he is a #1. I have said before the best comp for Gabe Davis is Michael Gallup, in that he is a lower end #2 receiver who doesn't run a full route tree, is not a big separator and is mainly used on lower percentage down the field type routes. They have both had issues at time with drops. Gallup got $11.5m AAV. I think if Gabe has a year like last year - 800 plus yards and 7 touchdowns - that is where he will end up. 

To me, paying Gabe 12M a year is an overpay I want nothing to do with. Just like Tremaine getting 18M in Chicago.  Nice players that I wish we could keep…. But not at that price

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The Chargers are an actual option. Mike Williams is $33m on the cap next year, $12m dead if they get out. They aint paying him $33m. Likely Keenan Allen's last year too. Gabe is a level below Williams but they are similar players and the difference isn't huge. Tom Telesco loves bigger receivers. 

Oh man- if they sign gabe they better draft another WR in the first next year.  Quinton and Gabe as wr1 and 2 = poor Herbert.  Can’t believe they didn’t take Kincaid (but so very appreciative).  I’m not a Mike Williams fan by any means, but that would be a downgrade imo.  Allen is getting up there but he can get open and catch.  Not quite sure Quinton and gabe can do either 😂