No excuses for Ken Dorsey this year

[DJB]

11 hours ago, JoPoy88 said:

Jesus. There are no “schemes” in preseason. If you are bumping this stale thread to bang your drum at least understand what’s going on.

There most definitely are offensive schemes even in pre season lol

Edited August 21, 2023 by DJB

[Don Otreply]

37 minutes ago, DJB said:

There make definitely are offensive schemes even in pre season lol

“There make definitely are” 

 

now that’s some advanced sentence structure right there…, 

[GunnerBill]

4 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

“There make definitely are” 

 

now that’s some advanced sentence structure right there…, 

 

I sometimes morning drink too. 

[Lost]

9 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

“There make definitely are” 

 

now that’s some advanced sentence structure right there…, 

 

[Mister Defense]

10 hours ago, DJB said:

Dorsey I think schemes decently well to our strengths but what he severely lacks is the ability to hide or scheme around our weaknesses. 
 

Both tackles are terrible and we need to get the ball out much quicker. More slants, etc otherwise Allen is going to get killed.

 

I love the deep ball and Allen making plays but we know that is not sustainable for entire season. 
 

Unless Dorsey changes I’ll continue to beat the drum he needs to be fired 

 

While I would not be concerned if he was fired now, I may wait a few games into the season to see how actual games play out.

 

That offense looked unprepared at almost every level, and the buck stops with the coach. Period.

 

 

[Mister Defense]

10 hours ago, CincyBillsFan said:

Do people think that Dorsey game planed for Pittsburgh other then to tell Allen not to run and bail if he feels pressure?  The LAST thing Dorsey wanted to do yesterday was to tip the Jets off to anything he was going to do in week 1.  Why don't we wait and see how the first 4 games go before deciding where Dorsey stands.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well, I agree with waiting to see how the regular season games go, at least a few games.

 

But this embarrassing  performance wasn't about game planning, per se, or not tipping off the Jets to what was coming, as that is the case with every team in almost every pre-season game.

 

This game showed an offense that was incompetent in almost every phase of the game, with an incredible number of penalties, many of them pre-snap penalties. The offense looked lost.

 

To me, this was as bad as a good Bills team has ever looked this close to the season opener. 

 

Unacceptable for a team loaded with talent. 

 

Undisciplined, unprepared.  And the offensive coordinator is held accountable when that is the case.

 

It seems that in last year's fast start that Daboll's coaching was still entrenched enough to keep them going at a high level, but as the season progressed we saw that diminish and Ken Dorsey's coaching take over.  This year, it is Dorsey's show, and so far not so good.

 

 

 

Edited August 21, 2023 by Mister Defense

[Bangarang]

27 minutes ago, Mister Defense said:

 

 

Well, I agree with waiting to see how the regular season games go, at least a few games.

 

But this embarrassing  performance wasn't about game planning, per se, or not tipping off the Jets to what was coming, as that is the case with every team in almost every pre-season game.

 

This game showed an offense that was incompetent in almost every phase of the game, with an incredible number of penalties, many of them pre-snap penalties. The offense looked lost.

 

To me, this was as bad as a good Bills team has ever looked this close to the season opener. 

 

Unacceptable for a team loaded with talent. 

 

Undisciplined, unprepared.  And the offensive coordinator is held accountable when that is the case.

 

It seems that in last year's fast start that Daboll's coaching was still entrenched enough to keep them going at a high level, but as the season progressed we saw that diminish and Ken Dorsey's coaching take over.  This year, it is Dorsey's show, and so far not so good.

 

 

 

So basically what you’re saying is Dorsey gets no credit when things are going well but all the blame when they aren’t? At least you have a reasonable perspective. 

Edited August 21, 2023 by Bangarang

[Goin Breakdown]

3 hours ago, DJB said:

There make definitely are offensive schemes even in pre season lol

Most*. I'm pretty sure it was a typo

[DJB]

50 minutes ago, Goin Breakdown said:

Most*. I'm pretty sure it was a typo

Autocorrect strikes again! Lol

[PBF81]

1 hour ago, Mister Defense said:

 

While I would not be concerned if he was fired now, I may wait a few games into the season to see how actual games play out.

 

That offense looked unprepared at almost every level, and the buck stops with the coach. Period.

 

 

 

Realistically they can't fire anyone until after the season.  Let's see how it plays out.  I'm not ready to throw Dorsey to the curb unless the play-calling is problematic, one preseason game with the first unit playing fairly "vanilla" as it's called, isn't the best barometer.   Also, it seemed as if Pittsburgh thought it was the Super Bowl.  

 

If we get our a$$e$ kicked by the Jets because of zero innovation or creativity in play-calling, let the discussion begin.  

 

Some of this is on Allen too, he's the anti-Brady in that way.  There are far too many plays where entirely ignores checkdown options on screens or on short outs where his guys are wide f'n open, he sees them, but continues to look downfield for the bigger play.  That's on him.  It's a fair guess that that's one of the things that he's focused on correcting this season.   Josh is a very bright guy!  

 

Where Dorsey's fate may hinge, is in games where our RBs are chewing up yardage like college athletes at a buffet, and we abandon the run and start throwing with less than optimal results.  Stuff like that, which would be indicative that he's got a lot to learn, and given his experience he should have a lot to learn in that way, particularly as a historically accomplished college QB.  

 

 

[Fleezoid]

I was hopefully for Dorsey early on, but now my concern factor is elevating. His play designs and the offense looking very unprepared are the 2 things that stick out to me.

 

There was one particular play in the 1st series where Allen hands off to Cook to his left. He had to take 2 to 3 steps to get the ball to him. What the heck is that? Allen was in the shotgun, but it didn't look like a draw. Why are you taking an extra second or 2 to hand the ball off. It just gives the defense that much more time to get penetration. 

 

The regular seasons games are the real barometer, but the doubts are creeping in.

Edited August 21, 2023 by Fleezoid

[Warriorspikes51]

As good as Allen is, if your QB is under attack because the OT's are turn styles..... only so much the OC can do 

[Billever76]

On 4/28/2023 at 1:42 PM, Logic said:

Like many here, I like Dalton Kincaid the player quite a bit.

The only hesitance I have in drafting him is that I was constantly yelling at my screen last year because Dorsey wasn't effectively scheming the athletic, mismatch tight end we ALREADY have on our roster and pay big money to. I'm dubious that a guy who couldn't find a way to effectively use one tight end will suddenly know how to effectively use two. For a first round tight end who figures to be second on the depth chart to be a worthwhile use of draft capital, he needs to actually be utilized with effectiveness and frequency.

Moreover, I was and am concerned about what I perceive to be Dorsey's failure to use the offensive weapons on the Bills roster in the way that best suits their traits. We drafted James Cook and traded for Nyheim Hines largely because both are receiving threats and mismatches against linebackers -- then completely failed to deploy them in that fashion. Gabe Davis did a lot of damage his first two years from the slot, matching up against small nickel corners, safeties, and linebackers. Dorsey rarely used him as such last year. As already mentioned, Dawson Knox is an athletic mismatch in the passing game in his own right, Dorsey failed to use him as much more than a last resort outlet receiver. Now add Kincaid to the pile of guys that require a specific type of usage to be most effective.

Going into 2023, with a formidable duo of tight ends, two speedy receiving backs, a top five WR, a big-bodied WR with excellent career touchdown production, and even new, speedy additions in Harty and Sherfield -- not to mention whoever the Bills add throughout the rest of draft weekend -- there will no longer be any excuses or training wheels for Ken Dorsey, in my opinion. "Not enough weapons" will no longer be a viable excuse.

If Dorsey can't scheme up a consistently effective offense that consistently makes use of guys like Cook, Knox, and Kincaid, he should be shown the door at the end of the year, in my opinion. There will be no shortage of brilliant offensive minds champing at the bit to work with Josh Allen and co if Dorsey can't cut it. 

When does the HC excuses run out?..I mean McDermott put Dorsey in the position he is in?

[Logic]

3 minutes ago, Billever76 said:

When does the HC excuses run out?..I mean McDermott put Dorsey in the position he is in?

When he stops having 11+ win seasons and making the playoffs every single year?

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, Logic said:

When he stops having 11+ win seasons and making the playoffs every single year?

This is me wondering if half these people were fans during the drought

 

[Goin Breakdown]

49 minutes ago, DJB said:

Autocorrect strikes again! Lol

Auto incorrect

[Mr. WEO]

 

[Chaos]

46 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

This is me wondering if half these people were fans during the drought

 

if you think McDemott is getting the best possible success out of Josh Allen’s career he is above criticism. If. If you think McDermott is falling short , feel free to criticize.   Broncos gave nine years to Reeves with Elway. never got there. Mike shanahan got there in two years with Elway. 
 

Not really sure why the benchmark is being better than one of worst ever streak of coaching in NFL history.  

[HOUSE]

Ken Dorsey will be the head coach in Cleveland next year where he will receive at least 3 more chances.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

19 minutes ago, Chaos said:

if you think McDemott is getting the best possible success out of Josh Allen’s career he is above criticism. If. If you think McDermott is falling short , feel free to criticize.   Broncos gave nine years to Reeves with Elway. never got there. Mike shanahan got there in two years with Elway. 
 

Not really sure why the benchmark is being better than one of worst ever streak of coaching in NFL history.  

 

it's not just that, guy.

 

it's the fact that he's the winningest coach in Bills history.

 

Better win % than Marv Levy, who had a LOT more talent on that team.