RD 1, Pick 25: TE Dalton Kincaid, Utah

[CincyBillsFan]

8 minutes ago, balln said:

Perfect example is the dolphins playoff game. They were up 17. (Largely bc of big plays- so yes to a degree you’re right). 
 

And then they were taking deep

shot after deep

shot . Bad plays. Bad routes. Bad throws. And it totally let Mia into the game and I’m sorry that freaking game was too close for comfort. 
 

countless videos of wide open guys in short to intermediate . Allen just wouldn’t go there

Sorry but this is a one sided take on what happened in that 2nd quarter.  Surprised you didn't add the following:

 

*  Knox dropped a TD pass that would have made it 21 - 0.

*  Shakir drops a 55 yard completion late in the 2nd half this if completed likely would have let the Bills run out the clock and score a TD to go up 24 - 9 at half.

*  The Bills gave up a 57 yard punt return to put the Dolphins in scoring position.

*  A ball bounced off Beasley's hands for an INT that leads to Miami points.

 

A better description of what happened was that Miami got back into the game because of a series of fluke plays.

 

 

 

 

 

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

1 hour ago, Chaos said:

People say this, but why?  Bills moved the chains better than anyother team in football last year. 

 

 While this statement is not true, it's closer to reality than most takes. The Bills averaged 22.8 first downs per game only trailing the Chiefs(23.8) and the Eagles(23.1).

 

 I don't get it, where were all these takes after the 2021 season? That was statistically the worst offense of the last 3 years and Josh's worst season during that span. I get maybe because of the 2 playoff games, but that was only 2 of the 19 games we played. Aside from the game in Foxboro his last 6 games or so were pretty bad in 2021, including his worst game of his career against Atlanta(17 QB Rating).

 

 In 2022 they averaged as many ppg  as 2021 and out the last 3 seasons, last year's offense had the most yards per game and the highest 3rd down percentage. And that's against the 2020 offense which was pretty damn good. It's also the only season in Josh's career that the offense converted over 50% of their 3rd downs.

 

Need to cut down on redzone turnovers and short fgs(13 attempts alone from the 30-39 yard range). In terms of moving the ball, we were a top 2 or 3 team last year and I think we'll be, at worst, the 2nd best offense this year with all the added talent on that side of the ball. 

 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

2 hours ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

 

 While this statement is not true, it's closer to reality than most takes. The Bills averaged 22.8 first downs per game only trailing the Chiefs(23.8) and the Eagles(23.1).

 

 I don't get it, where were all these takes after the 2021 season? That was statistically the worst offense of the last 3 years and Josh's worst season during that span. I get maybe because of the 2 playoff games, but that was only 2 of the 19 games we played. Aside from the game in Foxboro his last 6 games or so were pretty bad in 2021, including his worst game of his career against Atlanta(17 QB Rating).

 

 In 2022 they averaged as many ppg  as 2021 and out the last 3 seasons, last year's offense had the most yards per game and the highest 3rd down percentage. And that's against the 2020 offense which was pretty damn good. It's also the only season in Josh's career that the offense converted over 50% of their 3rd downs.

 

Need to cut down on redzone turnovers and short fgs(13 attempts alone from the 30-39 yard range). In terms of moving the ball, we were a top 2 or 3 team last year and I think we'll be, at worst, the 2nd best offense this year with all the added talent on that side of the ball. 

 

People hated Daboll in 2021. I said Allen’s worst game of his career was in 2021 vs Atlanta. Daboll was saved by Allen getting red hot in the playoffs.
 

How about this stat from 2022 for everyone? After week 11 they were 23rd in redzone TD scoring. By the end of the season they finished 9th. 
 

The overall offense in 2022 was better than 2021. They just didn’t get going vs Cincinnati. And it seems all the deep shots were due to Allen’s injury. There was less discomfort throwing deep.
 

 

Edited May 4, 2023 by Buffalo_Stampede

[AuntieEm]

4 hours ago, Chaos said:

Again, the Bills were the best team in football at moving the chains.  Why must we move them a different way than we do now? 

 

Because as Josh said in that one interview he is getting older and he's gonna be a qb first football player second. I take this to mean he is gonna look to take the best plays based on what's happening in any given game.  Think he knows he has to choose his moments rather than always trying to gain extra yards when they aren't needed.  Playing smarter to lessen the risks.  It also makes his play style less predictable.  Lull the opponent into having to defend against all his weapons that no one is left to spy Allen  that's when he'll get his easy yards with less risk.  

Edited May 4, 2023 by AuntieEm

[John from Riverside]

If we want to enjoy Josh for years to come, some thing Hass to change on the offense

 

It can’t be Josh saves the day every play whenever people can’t get open that’s not going to work and eventually it gets shut down

 

We need to put players around Josh that any quarterback, including our back up quarterback would be able to work with and still win games then you have Josh come in and you’re that much bette

that’s how We get to the Super Bowl

[loveorhatembillsfan4life]

I thought this a really great read and I am pretty excited! . Dorsey really needs to get this kid on the field and see where it takes us. 

 

https://www.buffalorumblings.com/platform/amp/2023/5/1/23705699/opinion-dalton-kincaid-could-be-the-herald-of-a-new-offense-for-buffalo-bills-nfl-draft-2023-rumor

[Dr. Who]

7 minutes ago, loveorhatembillsfan4life said:

I thought this a really great read and I am pretty excited! . Dorsey really needs to get this kid on the field and see where it takes us. 

 

https://www.buffalorumblings.com/platform/amp/2023/5/1/23705699/opinion-dalton-kincaid-could-be-the-herald-of-a-new-offense-for-buffalo-bills-nfl-draft-2023-rumor

It's a good article that clearly articulates why the pouting crowd angry we traded up for a TE are wrong given Kincaid's particular skill set. They can continue to hang their sad little hats on Dorsey being an incompetent OC, I suppose, but there's no reason an intelligent OC shouldn't be able to make this happen and I surmise Dorsey year two is going to improve upon his rookie campaign.

[MrEpsYtown]

11 hours ago, balln said:

Perfect example is the dolphins playoff game. They were up 17. (Largely bc of big plays- so yes to a degree you’re right). 
 

And then they were taking deep

shot after deep

shot . Bad plays. Bad routes. Bad throws. And it totally let Mia into the game and I’m sorry that freaking game was too close for comfort. 
 

countless videos of wide open guys in short to intermediate . Allen just wouldn’t go there

 

The Dolphins were giving them the deep shot. That was the correct read most of the time, they just didn't execute. 

 

11 hours ago, CincyBillsFan said:

Sorry but this is a one sided take on what happened in that 2nd quarter.  Surprised you didn't add the following:

 

*  Knox dropped a TD pass that would have made it 21 - 0.

*  Shakir drops a 55 yard completion late in the 2nd half this if completed likely would have let the Bills run out the clock and score a TD to go up 24 - 9 at half.

*  The Bills gave up a 57 yard punt return to put the Dolphins in scoring position.

*  A ball bounced off Beasley's hands for an INT that leads to Miami points.

 

A better description of what happened was that Miami got back into the game because of a series of fluke plays.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Agreed. One or two plays completely change that game. 

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, Dr. Who said:

It's a good article that clearly articulates why the pouting crowd angry we traded up for a TE are wrong given Kincaid's particular skill set. They can continue to hang their sad little hats on Dorsey being an incompetent OC, I suppose, but there's no reason an intelligent OC shouldn't be able to make this happen and I surmise Dorsey year two is going to improve upon his rookie campaign.

 

 

If Kincaid can stay healthy he will be a excellent player and Dorsey will make good use of him, IMO.    He fell because a lot of teams around the NFL felt that his injury situation and age were too concerning.   I don't know the extent of his injuries and how it could impact him but as I stated elsewhere, the age doesn't bother me because other great TE's have started their pro career at his age and gone on to have HOF careers(Gates and Kelce, for example).

 

I like the pick and can live with the trade-up........it wasn't a premium position technically.......but combined with Josh Allen he has the potential to have the impact on the field that a premium position player can have in changing the outcome of games with his individual matchup winning potential.   

[hondo in seattle]

13 hours ago, Chaos said:

Again, the Bills were the best team in football at moving the chains.  Why must we move them a different way than we do now? 

 

Because we lost 4 games last year including a playoff game that ended our Lombardi hopes.   And there were other games that were arguably close than they 'should' have been.  

 

It's about continuous improvement in all facets of the game.  Beane said something to the effect of we weren't good at attacking the middle of the field last year and Kincaid makes us better.  That's something to be excited about.  

[The Firebaugh Kid]

15 hours ago, balln said:

Perfect example is the dolphins playoff game. They were up 17. (Largely bc of big plays- so yes to a degree you’re right). 
 

And then they were taking deep

shot after deep

shot . Bad plays. Bad routes. Bad throws. And it totally let Mia into the game and I’m sorry that freaking game was too close for comfort. 
 

countless videos of wide open guys in short to intermediate . Allen just wouldn’t go there

Watching that game, I couldn't help but think they were just screwing around out there, trying to put on a show. 

 

[PrimeTime101]

31 minutes ago, The Firebaugh Kid said:

Watching that game, I couldn't help but think they were just screwing around out there, trying to put on a show. 

 

This is an interesting take. I think when you blow out a team the way they did the year before, it has to go through their thought process that the offense can repeat.

 

But to be honest, I do not think it is reality. The deep stuff was open and not the short stuff and we just did not execute. 

[3rdand12]

10 hours ago, Dr. Who said:

It's a good article that clearly articulates why the pouting crowd angry we traded up for a TE are wrong given Kincaid's particular skill set. They can continue to hang their sad little hats on Dorsey being an incompetent OC, I suppose, but there's no reason an intelligent OC shouldn't be able to make this happen and I surmise Dorsey year two is going to improve upon his rookie campaign.

Sad little hats ?
Doubt he is incompetent so much as he has a ton of room for growth ?

I like my little hat btw. and will hang it where i please LOL

 

No way Ken doesn't improve. He has a surrounding cast that has so much Football knowledge to draw upon !
I just did not like him last year. 

[3rdand12]

5 hours ago, PrimeTime101 said:

This is an interesting take. I think when you blow out a team the way they did the year before, it has to go through their thought process that the offense can repeat.

 

But to be honest, I do not think it is reality. The deep stuff was open and not the short stuff and we just did not execute. 

Miami was asking for it, and Bills did not execute. Maybe they took them lightly. Not sure.
But in response to some. 
We had Cooks and Nyheim and even Devin. We had two TEs who can catch. We didnt use them through out the season with a playbook that opened to another chapter.

 Hence some folks hesitation that adding a TE who can make plays was the best pick. Bills needed deep speed !
 

Kincaid is a great pick. So let use ALL of the weapons and all of the field.
 

As fans we saw players open nearly each down for easy yards.

Josh or Dorsey ?? no matter

Fix that and the sky is the limit.

 Go Bills

[Nihilarian]

On 5/3/2023 at 2:10 PM, HomeTeam said:

Not sure if this was posted but Daniel Jeremiah had some high praises for Kincaid.

 

 

Indeed...He had him rated as the #9 out of his top 150 players.

[akm0404]

Can’t help but chuckle to myself about how things come full circle after years (decades) of the misery of checkdown qbs, we finally have a hero slangin’ it and some pine for him to embrace his inner Trent Edwards. 

Edited May 4, 2023 by akm0404

[Dr. Who]

1 hour ago, 3rdand12 said:

Sad little hats ?
Doubt he is incompetent so much as he has a ton of room for growth ?

I like my little hat btw. and will hang it where i please LOL

 

No way Ken doesn't improve. He has a surrounding cast that has so much Football knowledge to draw upon !
I just did not like him last year. 

I'm not certain that you are properly discerning my meaning. If you want to spend time searching this site, just in the last day or so I wrote a rather lengthy exposition of problems with Ken Dorsey's first year as OC. Essentially, I agree that he is doubtfully incompetent, but has a ton of room to grow. I think he'll get there, but I don't have certitude. The sad hats are for those who disliked paying up to be able to draft Kincaid. Since you seem to believe Kincaid was a great pick, I don't think you own one. Those who do are welcome to keep that hat. I don't think it's a good look, but tastes differ.

Edited May 4, 2023 by Dr. Who

[PrimeTime101]

1 hour ago, 3rdand12 said:

Miami was asking for it, and Bills did not execute. Maybe they took them lightly. Not sure.
But in response to some. 
We had Cooks and Nyheim and even Devin. We had two TEs who can catch. We didnt use them through out the season with a playbook that opened to another chapter.

 Hence some folks hesitation that adding a TE who can make plays was the best pick. Bills needed deep speed !
 

Kincaid is a great pick. So let use ALL of the weapons and all of the field.
 

As fans we saw players open nearly each down for easy yards.

Josh or Dorsey ?? no matter

Fix that and the sky is the limit.

 Go Bills

I think there are parts missing. lets list.

"we had two TEs who ca catch" Knox and who? Cause Knox was the only one that could catch.

I think you are missing the part that how often Knox was dropping balls. 

I think you are missing the part where Knox was not getting good separation a good chunk of the time

I think you are missing the part where Our OC came out of a system in Carolina and watched how well top catching TEs do.

I think you are missing the part of how bad our line was last year as well.

And

I think its silly to misunderstand how good this player is in Kincaid... Many feel Kincaid would be the top te in the last 8 drafts.

 

Its crazy to think Dorsey will not play a Kincaid properly.. Just because of what happened last year, you can not assume Dorsey will ignore Kincaid.

 

2 TE's that can catch? Like Knox/Kincaid?

 

And the bolded is crazier talk yet... Nearly Each Down Fans Saw Players Open? come on man... Stop with that crazy narrative lol

[Ralonzo]

11 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

If Kincaid can stay healthy he will be a excellent player and Dorsey will make good use of him, IMO.    He fell because a lot of teams around the NFL felt that his injury situation and age were too concerning.   I don't know the extent of his injuries and how it could impact him but as I stated elsewhere, the age doesn't bother me because other great TE's have started their pro career at his age and gone on to have HOF careers(Gates and Kelce, for example).

 

I like the pick and can live with the trade-up........it wasn't a premium position technically.......but combined with Josh Allen he has the potential to have the impact on the field that a premium position player can have in changing the outcome of games with his individual matchup winning potential.   

 

 

[SydneyBillsFan]

 

Skippy just won't let it go 😁