RD 1, Pick 25: TE Dalton Kincaid, Utah

[Mango]

12 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Bills have drafted four TE's in the last 15 years.  Knox was the highest in the third round.  Hardly an over investment in TEs.  

 

Now RB's you get no argument from me there.  

 

I don't think we are over invested in the position in the game of football. I do think a top 5 salary and a first is a lot for a team that has not made a commitment to throwing the TE the ball since they took over the team in 2017. 

I like Kincade., and the pick. I like the idea of lining Knox, Kincade, Cook, Diggs, and Davis on a regular basis. I am cautious about what the Bills will get in return.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

10 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

It’s possible. I don’t necessarily hate the Kincaid pick and want to put that out there. I just don’t see it helping much unless we have a plan at WR2. If we can’t land Hopkins, then the Kincaid pick seems a little strange. 
We already have Shakir primed for the slot. 
 

I would have been happier with a trade down into the 2nd round. Grabbing Avila and then grabbing Hyatt with a packaged up move. 
Avila/Hyatt  >  Kincaid/ Dawand Jones 

I too would like to add Hopkins, I'm all about those boundary wideout in the modern NFL. But I must admit that the Bills did have a lot of success with Diggs and Beasley as their top two targets. And Shakir is not Beasley.

[JoPoy88]

37 minutes ago, Sierra Foothills said:

 

Daniel Jeremiah had him ranked 9th overall.

 

 

 

Disagree.

 

 

He looks sub 4.6 for sure. Also it looks like his 10 yard split would be excellent. Very good suddenness and burst but also fluid and not herky jerky.

 

 

To the bolded, I've posted this numerous times. Josh was not taking the layups that Daboll had him taking previously. I think there are many reasons for Dorsey Optimism. The personnel will be better for his schemes, we should reasonably expect fewer injuries, and another year in the helm will help. But he has to show that he has the ability to maximize Josh's talents and minimize the hero ball stuff that only hurts the team.

 

 

The funny thing is the write up addressed all the facets of the pick. In other words the writer understood most of the Bills context but made the wrong conclusion. Like many people on this board he couldn't process how Kincaid fits with Knox.

 

I think of it this way: Kincaid will probably be second on the Bills in receptions and receiving yards. He also might lead the team in TD receptions.

 

Another way of looking at is that people on this board have been trying to point out that Kelce is KCs WR1. Call him Weapon1 if that's helpful. Kincaid is Weapon2 for the Bills.

 

Or as another poster adroitly pointed out upthread, the NBA has become a league without positions... you have stretch 3s and stretch 4s and "wing players." You have "shoot first point guards."  In football they're getting away from DE vs LB and grouping them as "Edge" players.

 

Same thing with Kincaid. To understand the fit you have to be more flexible in your thinking.

 

 

To the suggested 40 time - I had very little confidence in the 4.7-4.9 range I posted. That was just a best guess averaging out unofficial times I poked around and found online. So I absolutely don’t doubt you that he may be significantly faster. He certainly looks fast on tape. 👍👍

[Milanos Milano]

4 minutes ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

IMB is on a jihad. I don't think there is talking sense into him on this.

 

But for real between Gesicki and Ertz comparisons (not to mention some "poor man's Kelce) ones I've been hearing, if we get 75% in his rookie year that makes him the second best pass catcher on this roster

Again I don’t dislike Kincaid. He will likely produce in our system. My only concern is WR2, has been since day 1. I don’t understand how a slot “TE” is much better than a slot WR that already showed promise in Shakir. It only makes sense if we land Hopkins. 
The reason why I say that, is because with Diggs and Hopkins commanding a ton, nobody is going to be able to guard a big slot guy with Diggs and

Hopkins on the field. 

[PrimeTime101]

4 minutes ago, JoPoy88 said:

To the suggested 40 time - I had very little confidence in the 4.7-4.9 range I posted. That was just a best guess averaging out unofficial times I poked around and found online. So I absolutely don’t doubt you that he may be significantly faster. He certainly looks fast on tape. 👍👍

40 time is more relevant to WR's. getting that low time is so so important. For a TE Hybrid what is important is quickness in rout running, great hands and can get open. THAT's what we got   great post 

[MrEpsYtown]

I posted in the live thread but it is too good so I am throwing it in here. If you want a glimpse on what this offensive strategy could potentially do for us, read it in its entirety. It is excellent. I love football. 

 

https://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2020/9/1/21403795/eagles-film-room-benefits-12-personnel-zach-ertz-dallas-goedert-tight-ends-contract-philadelphia-nfl

[Ethan in Cleveland]

4 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

I don't think we are over invested in the position in the game of football. I do think a top 5 salary and a first is a lot for a team that has not made a commitment to throwing the TE the ball since they took over the team in 2017. 

I like Kincade., and the pick. I like the idea of lining Knox, Kincade, Cook, Diggs, and Davis on a regular basis. I am cautious about what the Bills will get in return.

That's a very fair taken something that will need to be watched closely. The OJ Howard signing last year seemed to indicate a willingness to move in that direction but it didn't work out.

One would think facing Kelce and Gronk and seeing Greg Olsen up close that McDermott would have figured it out by now. But as you probably know I'm a McDermott skeptic. 

At the end of the day it is another weapon on offense which is what most on the board wanted. Should allow them to be fairly diverse in scheme, personnel, and formation. Now its up to Allen and Dorsey to figure it out.

Give me an OT in round 2 and I'm happy

 

[Not at the table Karlos]

12 hours ago, BullBuchanan said:

You can't say BPA when you traded up for the guy.

Wtf? If he’s available and the best, wouldn’t that make him the best available? 

[Nihilarian]

NFL analyst Daniel Jeremiah had Dalton Kincade #9 out of his top 150 players in this year's draft.  Chris Simms had him as a top-15 pick and thought he would be a top-10 pick. 

 

Imagine a 250lb Cole Beasley in the slot that won't go down after the initial contact. Plus, his catch percentage is off the charts..as in he catches everything! 

 

 

[NewEra]

11 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Ask Beane, he said if Kincaid wasn’t there he would have traded down. Who would he have traded down with? 

I heard the PC.  I don’t think he would’ve traded down with anyone because I don’t think they would’ve had a partner.  Talk is cheap.  It’s post pick draft speak.  
 

He wanted a playmaker in round one and was going to make sure he got one.  The way the draft fell, with no pass catcher taken in the top 19, allowed him to sit back, watch and wait. He knew there would be someone for him as long as he moved up a couple picks.  
 

 

[BullBuchanan]

2 minutes ago, Not at the table Karlos said:

Wtf? If he’s available and the best, wouldn’t that make him the best available? 

Then the word has no meaning. Just trade up for whatever position you want and you can call it drafting for BPA.

[balln]

5 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Again I don’t dislike Kincaid. He will likely produce in our system. My only concern is WR2, has been since day 1. I don’t understand how a slot “TE” is much better than a slot WR that already showed promise in Shakir. It only makes sense if we land Hopkins. 
The reason why I say that, is because with Diggs and Hopkins commanding a ton, nobody is going to be able to guard a big slot guy with Diggs and

Hopkins on the field. 

I just point you to kelce and chiefs. They had hill at wr1 and really no “wr2” that you mention. This year they basically had a committee at average / one above average wr. Kelce is wr 1/2.

 

maybe just maybe. Kincaid will be kelce

 

its a great pick . Picking at 25 . You got best player at his position and a top 10 overall prospect.  Has elite hands and feel traits as a slot pass catcher. 

[HereComesTheReignAgain]

42 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

I will cut Beane a lot of slack if there is more to this plan. Kincaid makes a million times more sense if we end up landing Hopkins. 
 

Diggs

Hopkins

Kincaid 

 

 

That grouping would make so much more sense rather than a

 

Diggs 

Davis 

Kincaid 

I'm sure Beane will be very relieved to know that one of the most annoying instigators on TBD is willing to cut him some slack under your conditions!  Now he can sleep again.

[BuffaloBob]

21 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

Huh, I was commenting on the poster who said all Dawson Knox does is block. That was my correction, that Dawson Knox is not primarily a blocker in this offense. 

What would you like me to get a grip on? 

My apologies!  I think I was responding to the same post to which you were responding but somehow hit respond on you.  I may have been a bit brain dead after reading all of the "we don't know how or don't even use our other tight ends" posts and just didn't think to first go up to the post from the previous poster.  Thanks for being so considerate with your response to me!  😊 More than I deserved. 🤡

Edited April 28, 2023 by BuffaloBob

[RenoNVBillsfan]

You want to know anything about Kincaid, simply watch film of him destroy USC secondary (and most of the Pac 12) on their way to winning the Pac 12 Championship last season.  He was a 1-man wrecking crew and un-coverable, even though the whole stadium knew he was getting the ball.  I don't want to even say he's in the same breath as Kelce but he has an entirely different skill set that Knox.  Prediction:  Day 1 starter.  

[Solomon Grundy]

I'm liking the pick. Wish the Bills would've taken the TE with a back injury some years ago😎

[Milanos Milano]

1 minute ago, NewEra said:

I heard the PC.  I don’t think he would’ve traded down with anyone because I don’t think they would’ve had a partner.  Talk is cheap.  It’s post pick draft speak.  
 

He wanted a playmaker in round one and was going to make sure he got one.  The way the draft fell, with no pass catcher taken in the top 19, allowed him to sit back, watch and wait. He knew there would be someone for him as long as he moved up a couple picks.  
 

 

I still feel like this move doesn’t move the needle unless it’s paired with a Hopkins trade. 
A big bodied slot guy only makes sense if you have 2 very good WRs who are clogging up the field. Personnel wise, you can’t guard Kincaid with a LB, he will destroy you. 
That’s why Kincaid would be an A+ pick if Beane has more to this plan. 

[PrimeTime101]

1 minute ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Again I don’t dislike Kincaid. He will likely produce in our system. My only concern is WR2, has been since day 1. I don’t understand how a slot “TE” is much better than a slot WR that already showed promise in Shakir. It only makes sense if we land Hopkins. 
The reason why I say that, is because with Diggs and Hopkins commanding a ton, nobody is going to be able to guard a big slot guy with Diggs and

Hopkins on the field. 

Iron The problem is, your credibility is lost on this topic. your first post was a pic of a TE that you have compared to the next Gronk. You changed your story 2 times on this topic. The point of having a great receiver TE and a normal TE like Knox on the field is so you can go with Davis because Kincaid will make others around him better...   you need to have a better outlook on things man.... cup half full not empty

[RenoNVBillsfan]

Why are there gripes about the Bills not taking an available WR in the 1st round?  Give Beane some credit, folks.  He added 2 WR's via FA that are better than any prospect he could have found at #27 and already experienced in the NFL.  If he didn't feel there was a significant upgrade on what he acquired by FA then I support that reasoning.  He also made some upgrades at the OL in FA, which again may have been better grades that what he saw available in the 1st round.

 

Where I think the Bills need to seriously consider is the best Center / OG prospect avaialable in Round 2 and to acquire dept at the DT position.  Pretty bleak at this point with depth at these positions.  

Edited April 28, 2023 by RenoNVBillsfan

[Milanos Milano]

8 minutes ago, PrimeTime101 said:

Iron The problem is, your credibility is lost on this topic. your first post was a pic of a TE that you have compared to the next Gronk. You changed your story 2 times on this topic. The point of having a great receiver TE and a normal TE like Knox on the field is so you can go with Davis because Kincaid will make others around him better...   you need to have a better outlook on things man.... cup half full not empty

The problem is Davis is not good. Teams will just put a good corner on Kincaid because Davis never commands a double team. 
You can’t put a good corner on Kincaid if Hopkins is on our team, which is my entire point. Kincaid is a brilliant pick if Beane has something else planned. 

Edited April 28, 2023 by IronMaidenBills