New stadium cost goes up from $1.4 billion to $1.54 billion.

[RiotAct]

12 minutes ago, SUNY_amherst said:

 

If they want to go to every game, they will buy tickets to 8 home games on any of the secondary marketplaces and save $5,000 (and probably get better seats in Nov & Dec anyway).

 

 

guessing tickets will go for above face value (some QUITE a bit above) for most of the Sept./Oct. home games, just as they do now at The Ralph.

 

  However, point taken that it’s still more cost effective to buy as you go rather than plunking down big bucks for a P$L, unless you can truly make the commitment to attend most or all of the games.

[cba fan]

On 4/9/2023 at 9:19 AM, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

You can mischaracterize PSLs any way you want, I guess. 1

 

 

Likewise,  The G4 loan program is funded, per the CBA, as a maximum of 1.5% of annual league revenue, so it's not something that Pegs has "paid into for decades".  It is, like player salaries, money that the owners never see in their coffers.   And as such, Pegs personally is not on the hook for such a loan.  He team can pay it back by not taking their cut of away game gate receipts.2

 

This isn't a matter of different opinions...

 

1. agreed. Many diff ways to look at it.  It is like the circular argument. 

 

2. every team loses the %cut of the visitor team money when they play on the road and then that gets funneled into the G4 program. So it is direct money of Pegs and every other owner they do not get. It is their money.

[Mr. WEO]

12 minutes ago, cba fan said:

1. agreed. Many diff ways to look at it.  It is like the circular argument. 

 

2. every team loses the %cut of the visitor team money when they play on the road and then that gets funneled into the G4 program. So it is direct money of Pegs and every other owner they do not get. It is their money.

As a fixed % of gross revenues, the players could just as easily say it’s their money.  But both sides collectively bargained it to be 1.5% towards the G4.

 

The gate money for away games goes towards a team’s repay of the G4 loan,….it’s not a pot that all teams “funnel” their visitors gate money into….

[cba fan]

2 hours ago, SUNY_amherst said:

 

Home Depot & Target aren't getting $1 billion in taxpayer subsidies for a new building though

 

 

 

yes they are, in the form of tif districts and direct land donations and tax incentives, every time they move and build a new super center. Walmart too.

[mrags]

12 minutes ago, cba fan said:

yes they are, in the form of tif districts and direct land donations and tax incentives, every time they move and build a new super center. Walmart too.

So the Bills aren’t getting that as well as the PSL money? 

[cba fan]

2 hours ago, John Gianelli said:

According to an online inflation calculator, $22,000,000 in 1972 is worth $158,336,842.11 today. So the cost increase alone for this stadium is only slightly less than what it cost to build the entire stadium in the first place, adjusted for inflation!

lol... it is startling until you realize:

 

yes stadium construction is much much different now with so much more sq feet, scoreboards, electronics, wi fi, better locker rooms, workout areas, restaurants, much more dynamic concessions, fan areas, kid areas, standing room platforms, overhangs, heated areas, domes, Mega amounts of suites, it goes on and on.

 

can't even compare the cost anymore. It is not an accurate comparison.

 

it is like comparing the old Hoosier Dome and Metro Dome to the new Domes that have over double the square footage.

 

 

2 hours ago, nucci said:

true but I'm not writing a personal check for $2K to the dealership for the right to buy a car.

yes you are. it's called sales tax  lol....lol 

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, SUNY_amherst said:

 

But they won't. What is the incentive for them?

 

They can keep the same seat. That is it. And realistically that incentive is not worth $5,000.
 

If they want to go to every game, they will buy tickets to 8 home games on any of the secondary marketplaces and save $5,000 (and probably get better seats in Nov & Dec anyway). 

 

--

 

It always plays out like this. AND after year 3,4,5 of PSL disasters, NFL teams start selling portions of their season tickets without PSL and then you truly have a wasted investment

 

 

 

Are we discussing the same thing? You can't buy a ST without a PSL. Yes, you can just buy single seats to 10 games but then it's not a season ticket is it?

[TBBills Fan]

so thats a yes to a dome?

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, SUNY_amherst said:

what difference does it make for the attendee in question 

 

(other than not having to buy a $5K PSL)

Well I’ll do some math for you…. Say you want to do your thing for 10 years

 

Let’s say it was a $5000 PSL And 1500 tickets … the tickets are 150 a game 

 

You get hit on the aftermarket and pay $300 a game …. So I have a investment of $5000 psl…+ 1500 year for 10 years …                            
 

$15,000+5k pls= 20,000

 

you pay 300 a game maybe 400-500 for bigger games for 10 years …. 8-9 games a years … 5 years-8 games , 5 years-9 games…

 

300 a game …. 25,500 

 

You’re still spending more money

 

 

[mrags]

1 hour ago, cba fan said:

lol... it is startling until you realize:

 

yes stadium construction is much much different now with so much more sq feet, scoreboards, electronics, wi fi, better locker rooms, workout areas, restaurants, much more dynamic concessions, fan areas, kid areas, standing room platforms, overhangs, heated areas, domes, Mega amounts of suites, it goes on and on.

 

can't even compare the cost anymore. It is not an accurate comparison.

 

it is like comparing the old Hoosier Dome and Metro Dome to the new Domes that have over double the square footage.

 

 

yes you are. it's called sales tax  lol....lol 

Yes but you are still charged sales tax on the price of tickets. 

45 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Well I’ll do some math for you…. Say you want to do your thing for 10 years

 

Let’s say it was a $5000 PSL And 1500 tickets … the tickets are 150 a game 

 

You get hit on the aftermarket and pay $300 a game …. So I have a investment of $5000 psl…+ 1500 year for 10 years …                            
 

$15,000+5k pls= 20,000

 

you pay 300 a game maybe 400-500 for bigger games for 10 years …. 8-9 games a years … 5 years-8 games , 5 years-9 games…

 

300 a game …. 25,500 

 

You’re still spending more money

 

 

And that’s being generous at double for tix in the secondary. When they are good and competitive it’s often more. 

[SoCal Deek]

2 hours ago, SUNY_amherst said:

 

i dont think they are getting $1billion from taxpayers anywhere in the US to build a Home Depot or Target 

 

NFL stadium seems a little bigger in scale than a car dealership

 

 

 

 

And around and around and around we go. There is only one NFL Stadium in the entire State. There are way more of those other retail outlets. Has anyone ever mentioned that talking with you is like trying to squeeze jello? Yes…we ALL know you don’t like the fact that your ticket price is gonna go up. We all know. 

[Buffalo716]

7 minutes ago, mrags said:

Yes but you are still charged sales tax on the price of tickets. 

And that’s being generous at double for tix in the secondary. When they are good and competitive it’s often more. 

I was being generous

[Augie]

1 minute ago, SUNY_amherst said:

ticket prices, taxes, deficit, all going up…. But what do you care right? You are in So Cal not Buffalo, NY where the Bills play

 

Will you feel better is we ask @HOUSE to help subsidize your new ticket costs.  🤷‍♂️

[Einstein]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

Well I’ll do some math for you…. Say you want to do your thing for 10 years

 

Let’s say it was a $5000 PSL And 1500 tickets … the tickets are 150 a game 

 

You get hit on the aftermarket and pay $300 a game …. So I have a investment of $5000 psl…+ 1500 year for 10 years …                            
 

$15,000+5k pls= 20,000

 

you pay 300 a game maybe 400-500 for bigger games for 10 years …. 8-9 games a years … 5 years-8 games , 5 years-9 games…

 

300 a game …. 25,500 

 

You’re still spending more money

 

300-500 per game? where?

 

you can buy CLUB tickets for $130 on gameday right now. People slash tickets as kickoff approaches. Thats what I wait for.

 

Not to mention, season-ticket holders are on the hook for injuries, crap teams, crap coaches, bad luck, etc.

 

Allen gets injured in Game 1 (God forbid), and all of a sudden you have 7-8 useless home tickets.

 

Bills hire the next Dick Jauron? You can have 3 years (25-26) useless home tickets.

 

 

[Buffalo716]

4 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

300-500 per game? where?

 

you can buy CLUB tickets for $130 on gameday right now. People slash tickets as kickoff approaches. Thats what I wait for.

 

Not to mention, season-ticket holders are on the hook for injuries, crap teams, crap coaches, bad luck, etc.

 

Allen gets injured in Game 1 (God forbid), and all of a sudden you have 7-8 useless home tickets.

 

Bills hire the next Dick Jauron? You can have 3 years (25-26) useless home tickets.

 

 

Not at the new stadium lol

 

We’re talking new stadium tickets And nobody’s giving them up for half of what they paid

 

And you can easily make a goodbuck on them… People make money on season tickets now

 

 

[Xwnyer]

On 4/7/2023 at 5:00 PM, cba fan said:

Now reported the deal is for $1.54 billion and Pegs is responsible for the $140 million additional cost from the original of $1.4 billion.

 

so we have cost overrun before one shovel is in the ground yet. lol. Considering the long construction timeframe, the volitivity of steel and supplies prices, some add ons these projects always get, and some inevitable construction cost surprises, you can bet this will approach 2 billion when done. 

Pegs is responsible for all cost overruns. 

 

I was widely criticized for harping on Pegs would end up paying over 50%, however, that is on track as we speak.

NY state     600 mill

Pegs/NFL   550 mill(250 mill is from NFL program Bills pd into for decades and will pay in for eternity. So is Pegs contribution. Bills actually eventually will pay

                                  more into this then they get out of it until next new stadium is built in Buffalo)

Erie Co.      250 mill

Pegs             50 mill for Highmark demo.

cost o-run  140 million Pegs cost.

 

so Pegs is paying $740 mill already. Almost 50% already.

We getting a dome?

[HOUSE]

27 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

Will you feel better is we ask @HOUSE to help subsidize your new ticket costs.  🤷‍♂️

I can't even afford a new ashtray 

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, SUNY_amherst said:

what difference does it make for the attendee in question 

 

(other than not having to buy a $5K PSL)

The difference is you can't own a season ticket without a PSL. And once sold, PSLs are owned by the ST holder.

[McDeerInTheHeadlights]

15 minutes ago, Xwnyer said:

We getting a dome?

 

Nope. They'll just sprinkle some Viagra on the canopy.

[Augie]

2 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

I can't even afford a new ashtray 

 

Have you looked into used ashtrays?