NFL draft rumors 2023

[Dr. Who]

19 minutes ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Not for nothing and something to keep in mind. The 2 NFL comparisons I've seen on Torrence the most have been Saffold and Incognito. Both guys were coached and had really solid success under Kromer at points in their career. The "sloppy body type" comment that Campbell made seemed a bit weird. However, the Bills have one of the top end training and nutrition staffs in the NFL and I'd be confident they can assist there. I haven't heard anything about him being particularly unmotivated or lazy, so my hunch is that he can turn that around.

 

The body comment on Torrance reminds me somewhat of the chatter about Jordan Davis from last year close to the draft. I believe Torrence would be a solid pick...however I think he will be gone before pick 27. 

Well, Gunner Bill and @MrEpsYtown are the two fellas I generally turn to for guidance on oline. Neither is high on Torrance for the Bills. I would prefer to wait and pick up a fella like Bergeron or Avila a bit later if you are talking about a guard. Bergeron might have some capacity to play tackle. He was sound at the collegiate level, but some think he is a guard only in the pros. 

[TOboy]

9 hours ago, SCBills said:

While probably true .. We don’t necessarily have that many open spots on the potential in-season roster.  Beane goes hard in filling in the roster before the draft.  No sense in drafting guys just to have them poached - which has been happening in recent years. 

 

Allen/Allen (2)

 

Dawkins/Brown/Q/Doyle (4)

 

Morse/Bates/McG/Edwards/Ike (5)

 

Knox/Morris (2)

 

Cook/Harris/Hines (3)

 

Diggs/Davis/Harty/Shakir/Sherfield (5)

 

Von/Rousseau/AJ/Shaq/Boogie (5)

 

Ed/Jones/Settle/Phillips (4)

 

Milano/Klein/Bernard/Dodson/Spector/Matakevich (6)

 

White/Elam/Jackson/Johnson/Neal/Benford (6)

 

Hyde/Poyer/Rapp/Hamlin/Zayne (5)

 

Bass/Ferguson/Martin (3)

 

(( 50 ))

 

We could certainly use upgrades at RT, WR & LB, with DT, EDGE & S being upgradeable and/or looking to the future, but where are we putting 6 draft picks?  Many of these guys are locks, some likely locks and some ST’s guys… I don’t see many cut candidates on the 50 I listed. 
 

Maybe Zayne, brought in for ST’s gets bumped.  
 

Maybe Ike or Edwards in favor of a rookie IOL.  
 

Morris for a TE2 if he can clear waivers and we only keep two. 

 

Maybe Quessenberry for an OT.  
 

DT is bizarre contractually, and I guess maybe they could cut Settle. 

 

EDGE, again, would be a surprise cut or keeping six. 

 

 

While I hope it doesn’t happen, inevitably there will be injuries to start and throughput the year. Let them bring in as many quality players at low cost as possible. 

[MrEpsYtown]

40 minutes ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Not for nothing and something to keep in mind. The 2 NFL comparisons I've seen on Torrence the most have been Saffold and Incognito. Both guys were coached and had really solid success under Kromer at points in their career. The "sloppy body type" comment that Campbell made seemed a bit weird. However, the Bills have one of the top end training and nutrition staffs in the NFL and I'd be confident they can assist there. I haven't heard anything about him being particularly unmotivated or lazy, so my hunch is that he can turn that around.

 

The body comment on Torrance reminds me somewhat of the chatter about Jordan Davis from last year close to the draft. I believe Torrence would be a solid pick...however I think he will be gone before pick 27. 

 

I would just add that Saffold was a high second round pick and a converted left tackle. To me those guys are nothing alike at all. Richie was a mid third round pick. Both of those guys were very high RAS guys. Torrence is closer to a less athletic Cody Ford imo....and that should truly scare everyone. He has some strong traits in the power, but there is a good chance it goes very very wrong for him. At 59 I take a shot. At 27? No way. For a guy who is supposed to have so much power in his game, 23 reps on the bench is pretty alarming. You can get a better player, better athlete, and significantly stronger guy like Tyler Steen way later in the draft. 

 

17 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

Well, Gunner Bill and @MrEpsYtown are the two fellas I generally turn to for guidance on oline. Neither is high on Torrance for the Bills. I would prefer to wait and pick up a fella like Bergeron or Avila a bit later if you are talking about a guard. Bergeron might have some capacity to play tackle. He was sound at the collegiate level, but some think he is a guard only in the pros. 

 

Appreciate it. 

[BuffaloBillyG]

19 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

Well, Gunner Bill and @MrEpsYtown are the two fellas I generally turn to for guidance on oline. Neither is high on Torrance for the Bills. I would prefer to wait and pick up a fella like Bergeron or Avila a bit later if you are talking about a guard. Bergeron might have some capacity to play tackle. He was sound at the collegiate level, but some think he is a guard only in the pros. 

Well, both @GunnerBill and @MrEpsYtown are very highly respected members of the community and have some great knowledge and insight. I also enjoy seeing their perspectives on players coming out as well as their scouting and grading takes. This board is a better place due to their insights, and that's not debatable lol. My question for them would be when scoring him...is it the player that you aren't high on or the player in Buffalo's scheme? 

 

As it sits with what the Bills have done in the past with the type of OL they take and their blocking schemes...I would actually agree with them that his fit with what the Bills have done and looked for is not ideal. It's quite the opposite, actually. And that's the reason I like him for Buffalo. We have a lot of the high RAS scorers. Guys with athletic traits that are through the roof. Spencer Brown is a prime example. While I still feel like Brown may turn the corner at some point...a plug and play mauler would bring a different skillset to this line. A guy that would absolutely push the pile, is a very capable pass blocker and brings some edge would be a very strong move IMO. He would also likely play RG, which is where Allen almost always pushes to on those 3rd and 4th and short sneaks. Could really be an asset with proper conditioning.

 

And this isn't to say Gunner or Eps are wrong at all. Torrence may very well be a square peg in a round hole on this team. But insanity is doing the same thing time after time and not getting the results you are looking for. At some point it's time for fresh concepts and new thought processes by Beane and McD.

[BuffaloBillyG]

5 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

I would just add that Saffold was a high second round pick and a converted left tackle. To me those guys are nothing alike at all. Richie was a mid third round pick. Both of those guys were very high RAS guys. Torrence is closer to a less athletic Cody Ford imo....and that should truly scare everyone. He has some strong traits in the power, but there is a good chance it goes very very wrong for him. At 59 I take a shot. At 27? No way. For a guy who is supposed to have so much power in his game, 23 reps on the bench is pretty alarming. You can get a better player, better athlete, and significantly stronger guy like Tyler Steen way later in the draft. 

 

 

Appreciate it. 

Just saw this response and thank you for the clarification of the thought process on Torrence. 

 

I know Incognito had a pretty high RAS...in the 9.5 range if memory serves. Saffold in the mid high 7s-mid 8s?  

 

I think a large part of his success in the NFL will be what kind of support he gets at the NFL level. While you are correct in saying it could go very wrong for him I feel like he's a kid that needs the right people around him (coaches, trainers, conditioning and teammates) to flourish at the next level. I'd be surprised if he were the pick at 27, but optimistic that they can get the most out of him with what we have in place. I don't think he will be there at 27, let alone 59. 

 

 

[GunnerBill]

11 minutes ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Well, both @GunnerBill and @MrEpsYtown are very highly respected members of the community and have some great knowledge and insight. I also enjoy seeing their perspectives on players coming out as well as their scouting and grading takes. This board is a better place due to their insights, and that's not debatable lol. My question for them would be when scoring him...is it the player that you aren't high on or the player in Buffalo's scheme? 

 

As it sits with what the Bills have done in the past with the type of OL they take and their blocking schemes...I would actually agree with them that his fit with what the Bills have done and looked for is not ideal. It's quite the opposite, actually. And that's the reason I like him for Buffalo. We have a lot of the high RAS scorers. Guys with athletic traits that are through the roof. Spencer Brown is a prime example. While I still feel like Brown may turn the corner at some point...a plug and play mauler would bring a different skillset to this line. A guy that would absolutely push the pile, is a very capable pass blocker and brings some edge would be a very strong move IMO. He would also likely play RG, which is where Allen almost always pushes to on those 3rd and 4th and short sneaks. Could really be an asset with proper conditioning.

 

And this isn't to say Gunner or Eps are wrong at all. Torrence may very well be a square peg in a round hole on this team. But insanity is doing the same thing time after time and not getting the results you are looking for. At some point it's time for fresh concepts and new thought processes by Beane and McD.

 

And this is a very reasonable post. I'm not super high on Torrence as a 1st rounder - period - even in a class like this one. I also agree with you he isn't a fit for what the Bills have tended towards in their oline build, but they have flip flopped a bit on that. He is similar to Quinton Spain who they signed, then extended and paid, then benched, then cut. So it is hard to be too definitive on their type. 

 

I do think you might be onto something with the RAS stuff at oline too. It might be one area of the field where the tape matters more than the athletic profile and it might be time for them to just select good footballer players rather than looking for a high RAS guy. That said, think Ford was a low RAS guy in round two and that was a disaster, so it cuts both ways. 

[LabattBlue]

1 hour ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

However, the Bills have one of the top end training and nutrition staffs in the NFL and I'd be confident they can assist there. I haven't heard anything about him being particularly unmotivated or lazy, so my hunch is that he can turn that around.

When will they get around to meeting with Dawkins?

[MrEpsYtown]

1 minute ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Well, both @GunnerBill and @MrEpsYtown are very highly respected members of the community and have some great knowledge and insight. I also enjoy seeing their perspectives on players coming out as well as their scouting and grading takes. This board is a better place due to their insights, and that's not debatable lol. My question for them would be when scoring him...is it the player that you aren't high on or the player in Buffalo's scheme? 

 

As it sits with what the Bills have done in the past with the type of OL they take and their blocking schemes...I would actually agree with them that his fit with what the Bills have done and looked for is not ideal. It's quite the opposite, actually. And that's the reason I like him for Buffalo. We have a lot of the high RAS scorers. Guys with athletic traits that are through the roof. Spencer Brown is a prime example. While I still feel like Brown may turn the corner at some point...a plug and play mauler would bring a different skillset to this line. A guy that would absolutely push the pile, is a very capable pass blocker and brings some edge would be a very strong move IMO. He would also likely play RG, which is where Allen almost always pushes to on those 3rd and 4th and short sneaks. Could really be an asset with proper conditioning.

 

And this isn't to say Gunner or Eps are wrong at all. Torrence may very well be a square peg in a round hole on this team. But insanity is doing the same thing time after time and not getting the results you are looking for. At some point it's time for fresh concepts and new thought processes by Beane and McD.

 

For me it is a mix of both in that I don't love the player and don't think is a fit. To me Torrence is a late second/third round prospect.   

 

Overall, I think he is going to struggle in the NFL. He got away with some sloppy technique and kind of like Josh does for our guys, Anthony Richardson made him right a lot of the time. Can he get better? Sure. But the lack of a strong athletic profile makes that less likely. I would much rather have a Steve Avila or Tyler Steen or even a Chandler Zavala later because they have that mauling style with athletic upside.  

 

However, I think you make an excellent point about plugging a mauler in the middle of that super athletic offensive line to give it a different flavor and style. A square peg in a round hole can sometimes be a really good thing. My argument is that you can get that later in the draft.  

[TOboy]

I trust your opinions on scheme fit for Torrance. That said, he really won me over with his film against Jalen Carter. He really held his own against arguably the best talent the draft. 

[Coach Tuesday]

I had a dream the other night that the Bills traded up several spots for Hyatt - with several other top receivers on the board still - in part because they were worried the Chiefs were targeting him.

 

Take that for what it’s worth.

[Warriorspikes51]

1 minute ago, Coach Tuesday said:

I had a dream the other night that the Bills traded up several spots for Hyatt - with several other top receivers on the board still - in part because they were worried the Chiefs were targeting him.

 

Take that for what it’s worth.

have your dreams ever come true before? 😆

[BuffaloRebound]

14 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

For me it is a mix of both in that I don't love the player and don't think is a fit. To me Torrence is a late second/third round prospect.   

 

Overall, I think he is going to struggle in the NFL. He got away with some sloppy technique and kind of like Josh does for our guys, Anthony Richardson made him right a lot of the time. Can he get better? Sure. But the lack of a strong athletic profile makes that less likely. I would much rather have a Steve Avila or Tyler Steen or even a Chandler Zavala later because they have that mauling style with athletic upside.  

 

However, I think you make an excellent point about plugging a mauler in the middle of that super athletic offensive line to give it a different flavor and style. A square peg in a round hole can sometimes be a really good thing. My argument is that you can get that later in the draft.  

This.  We need a people mover in the interior of the O-Line.  Doesn’t necessarily have to be a 1st rounder but I’ll be disappointed if we don’t draft one in top 3 rounds.  This offense and O-Line needs more physicality.  

[Dr. Who]

19 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

I had a dream the other night that the Bills traded up several spots for Hyatt - with several other top receivers on the board still - in part because they were worried the Chiefs were targeting him.

 

Take that for what it’s worth.

If this happens, you need to start thinking about the lottery before you go to sleep.

[2003Contenders]

Did anyone else see a report last night on ESPN that the Panthers were reportedly set on shocking the world by taking Levis at #1 overall instead of Young? The report was not from one of the reliable guys like Shefter but supposedly the report was solid enough to have played a role in Vegas odds about the draft order.

[CapeBreton]

 

 

 

[LEBills]

1 minute ago, 2003Contenders said:

Did anyone else see a report last night on ESPN that the Panthers were reportedly set on shocking the world by taking Levis at #1 overall instead of Young? The report was not from one of the reliable guys like Shefter but supposedly the report was solid enough to have played a role in Vegas odds about the draft order.

I did not but this article goes over it

 

on Reddit, someone claiming to be close to Levis says that Levis is telling people he is going to be drafted by the Panthers

 

https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/patriots/will-levis-nfl-draft-odds-soar-after-reddit-post-links-panthers-qb?amp

[TheBeaneBandit]

34 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

I had a dream the other night that the Bills traded up several spots for Hyatt - with several other top receivers on the board still - in part because they were worried the Chiefs were targeting him.

 

Take that for what it’s worth.

Nobody's ever called me a visionary personality, but you just may become a modern day Nostradammit 😆

[Dr. Who]

13 minutes ago, LEBills said:

I did not but this article goes over it

 

on Reddit, someone claiming to be close to Levis says that Levis is telling people he is going to be drafted by the Panthers

 

https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/patriots/will-levis-nfl-draft-odds-soar-after-reddit-post-links-panthers-qb?amp

Folks will lose their minds if this happens. He's got some Josh Allen vibes, but the Panthers almost certainly didn't have to trade up to take him.

[SCBills]

9 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Yeah I suspect there are a lot of guys you think will make the team that are far from roster locks.  Kyle Allen at QB,  Harris at RB, Sherfield at WR, Edwards and Boettger at G,  Quess and Doyle at tackle..........all could lose their jobs to a rookie with potential or if they just flop in OTA's or can't practice due to injuries etc. in camp like OJ Howard did.   And that's just the offense.   Plenty of room for 10+ rookies if they had the picks or got priority to the UDFA's they want.

 

You may be right, but going off Beane's recent history, it seems like these vets typically make the team.   OJ Howard being the exception to the rule. 

[Warriorspikes51]

 

 

WR Michael Wilson anyone? Wonder where he’ll go.  Love his interview

Edited April 26, 2023 by Warriorspikes51