Wish they would just sign Klein at lb

[HOUSE]

OK

[nosejob]

2 hours ago, benderbender said:

It depends on what the coaches ask of him. Edmunds could only be asked to do certain things. Perhaps Chicago will say pretty please with millions on top and he’ll do more. 

I never understood drafting and putting him at MLB. I'm not sure but I don't know if he's ever played anything but DE/OLB before hand. Who knows? Maybe Chicago will make something out  of him.

Edited March 30, 2023 by nosejob

[Yantha]

Beane:  "The answer at MLB is on our current roster".

 

Translation:  We are picking MLB in round 1.

 

lol....  never believe GMs at this time of year.

[JohnBonhamRocks]

The question then becomes… Klein or deKlein?

 

I think he’s a good LB3/4 and like him as a player generally.
 

Don’t want him starting or playing significant snaps especially in passing situations. 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

1 hour ago, JerseyBills said:

I mean Benard was a 3rd rounder and didn't they move up for him?  He looked lost out there but I think it was playbook issues more than skill. I'd be fine with him ,Dodson and maybe a day 3 pick battling it out. 

Rather go ol/TE/WR in 1st 2 rounds 

He weighs 221 pounds. He doesn't look much bigger than Poyer on film. He came from a conference that plays the worst defense in the NCAA.  Hope I'm wrong but this guy has a better chance of being out of football next year than being a starting MLB. 

[MrEpsYtown]

25 minutes ago, nosejob said:

I never understood drafting and putting him at MLB. I'm not sure but I don't know if he's ever played anything but DE/OLB before hand. Who knows? Maybe Chicago will make something out  of him.

 

Edmunds was a stacked in-box off-ball backer, which is exactly what he did here and will do in Chicago. He was never an edge player, but his skill set and length seemed like he could project as a 3-4 edge. He would get destroyed as a base DE. 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Why can't we just have big players? Other teams draft big guys. Why must we always try to plug some undersized high character guy into a man's game. Edmunds at least had size though he played like a puss. 

Oliver and Bernard would make one of the smallest DT/MLB combos in the league if not the smallest. 

[ngbills]

He is not going anywhere. They can sign him at any point. 

[Snappysnackcakes]

2 minutes ago, ngbills said:

He is not going anywhere. They can sign him at any point. 

Klein will be signed, then cut, then brought back after Game One of the regular season. He will be utilized like a chess piece, game-by-game, throughout the season. They don’t want to guarantee his entire yearly salary as a vested veteran, which they have to do if he’s on the squad for Game One. 

13 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Why can't we just have big players? Other teams draft big guys. Why must we always try to plug some undersized high character guy into a man's game. Edmunds at least had size though he played like a puss. 

Oliver and Bernard would make one of the smallest DT/MLB combos in the league if not the smallest. 

Speed is just as important as size. I’ve often said, if you could put Milano’s heart and head in Edmunds’ body…

[nosejob]

33 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

Edmunds was a stacked in-box off-ball backer, which is exactly what he did here and will do in Chicago. He was never an edge player, but his skill set and length seemed like he could project as a 3-4 edge. He would get destroyed as a base DE. 

While I agree with the bolded,  I still think he'd be best outside. Last year 1/3rd of the field if not 1/2 was unattended....

[Beck Water]

19 minutes ago, Snappysnackcakes said:

Bernard was insurance for Milano. A depth piece. 

 

Then that's a *****-up use of a third round pick, if they intended Bernard as "insurance" for a player at a position which takes 100% of the snaps when healthy.

 

In the last 2 years, since Beane and McDermott gave their "the only thing, and Matt knows this, is availability" before they re-signed him, Milano has played 18 and 17 out of 19 games the last 2 seasons, so possibly he may (as @BADOLBILZ once pointed out Eric Wood and another player whose name escapes me did) have learned how to play a bit more within himself so he lowers his injury risk instead of going balls-to-the-wall every play.  Time will tell.  I believe I've seen changes.

 

Anyway: Logically, a third round pick should be used on a player you intend to see the field regularly as a starter or as a backup at a position where rotation is expected every game, not on a backup to see the field 3 games in 2 seasons.  That's where you draft a guy in the late rounds. 

 

Look at our other 3rd round picks:

2018: Harrison Phillips was a backup but at a position where McD is married to a rotation.  He saw 38% of the snaps in 16 games his rookie year and was starting to see more before his ACL year 2.  41% his 3rd year, 55% his 4th.  He's a backup, but at a position where backups see 1/3 to 1/2 of the snaps every game, and they moved on when it was clear he wasn't good enough to start for them.  Left in FA.  Now starting for Minn, a playoff team.

2019: Devin Singletary, starter at position where McD is married to rotation.  67% of the snaps his rookie year, 62% overall.  Left in FA.

          Dawson Knox, starter.  64% his rookie year, 87% and 80% his last 2 seasons, Extended.

2020:Zach Moss, backup at a position with rotation, 45% of the snaps his rookie year, 42% of the 2nd year. Traded because he wasn't working out

2021: Spencer Brown, starting at RT.  Whether he should be or not is another question, but the intent was clearly to start him.  Like John Miller, our 2015 3rd round G who has since started for 2 other teams, Brown can play in the NFL, just maybe not at the top level we want, so perhaps an upgrade is needed.

 

The point is, while a 3rd round pick is not a sure bet as a starter or a long-term building block, it better be used on a player who will see the field regularly. 

 

I would say before 2022, the Bills were 4 out of 5 in drafting a player who can see the field regularly with their 3rd round pick, with Zach Moss as a bust.  2 out of 4 in getting a player who starts for them, with the jury still out on #5 (Spencer Brown).  That's actually pretty good - success rate in the 3rd I think is 20 or 30% league wide.

 

And there's this:  Last year, we went into the regular season with a former 5th round pick (traded a 1st) at #1 WR, a 4th round pick as #2, and 2 5th round picks (McKenzie and Shakir) as the #3 WR.  WR, one of the highest paid, highest value skill positions in the draft with most ROI to get high production from draft picks.

 

Yeah, No.  If the Bills drafted Bernard with the idea he would back up Milano and be a depth piece at LB, that was a terrible use of a 3rd round pick, especially a guy who Lance Zierlein of NFL.com forecast as a 5th round pick.

 

I mean, maybe you're right, Lord knows his lone start last season was NOT promising, but I hope not.  Dylan Parham, who started every game for Las Vegas at G last season, was drafted one pick later than Bernard.  Parham did OK as a run blocker and struggled in pass protection, but then, so did our FA signing Saffold.  So it's not as though there wasn't a guy on the board they could draft and try to develop as a starter.

 

[damj]

I'd be okay with bringing him back on a 1 year, vet minimum deal.

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, nosejob said:

I never understood drafting and putting him at MLB. I'm not sure but I don't know if he's ever played anything but DE/OLB before hand. Who knows? Maybe Chicago will make something out  of him.

 

I mean this in the nicest way, as a suggestion, but if you don't know what Edmunds played in college, why not either ask, or look it up, before pontificating?  He did not play DE in college.  He was not projected as a pass-rushing OLB or edge in the draft. 

 

16 minutes ago, nosejob said:

While I agree with the bolded,  I still think he'd be best outside. Last year 1/3rd of the field if not 1/2 was unattended....

 

A team does not field the #2 D on points, #1 on yards, if 1/3 to 1/2 of the field is unattended.  Be Better.

 

2 hours ago, SCBills said:

I also wonder if we might be fine with two undersized linebackers.  I'm not ruling out McDermott thinking a year 2 Bernard is the answer. 

Look at the linebackers coming out of college... there's a ton of converted Safety types and some 3-4 run stuffers.  

Says a lot when there's only two consensus Top 100 pick guys that can play the traditional MLB role coming out of college this year. 

 

Who are those two top 100 pick guys?  (I honestly don't know)

Edited March 30, 2023 by Beck Water

[SCBills]

13 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I mean this in the nicest way, as a suggestion, but if you don't know what Edmunds played in college, why not either ask, or look it up, before pontificating?  He did not play DE in college.  He was not projected as a pass-rushing OLB or edge in the draft. 

 

 

A team does not field the #2 D on points, #1 on yards, if 1/3 to 1/2 of the field is unattended.  Be Better.

 

 

Who are those two top 100 pick guys?  (I honestly don't know)

 

Campbell is the only true MLB.  Sanders can play MLB, but is a pass rusher/linebacker hybrid.   

 

That's about it.  Everyone else is more of Milano type for us. 

[NewEra]

1 hour ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

He weighs 221 pounds. He doesn't look much bigger than Poyer on film. He came from a conference that plays the worst defense in the NCAA.  Hope I'm wrong but this guy has a better chance of being out of football next year than being a starting MLB. 

Not clue what Bernard is doing with himself but Zay flowers put on 13lbs of muscle in 5 weeks.  
 

I would put money on Bernard not being 221- the same weight he played in college.  
 

Milano was 223 in college and it’s still his listed weight…. But he looks a lot more jacked than he did as a rookie.  I’d say he looks to be around 230-235.  
 

that said-  he didn’t look capable of being a starting Mike due to his size-  which is why I think he’s been focusing on adding weight.  If he doesn’t, he’s screwed.

[The Firebaugh Kid]

I have a bad feeling they think Bernard is going to step in.

[FLFan]

3 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

You mean you don't believe Beane that the answer at MLB is on the roster, or McDermott's speech about how Tyrell, Terrel, and Baylon deserve a chance to compete for the starting MLB role?

 

It's really hard to understand why the Bills drafted Bernard in Round 3 if they didn't believe he could start in some role

I agree, but he did not show at the level that would justify that confidence last year.  I doubt they have totally given up on him, but based on last year, they need to take a serious shot in this draft.  

[nosejob]

35 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I mean this in the nicest way, as a suggestion, but if you don't know what Edmunds played in college, why not either ask, or look it up, before pontificating?  He did not play DE in college.  He was not projected as a pass-rushing OLB or edge in the draft. 

 

 

A team does not field the #2 D on points, #1 on yards, if 1/3 to 1/2 of the field is unattended.  Be Better.

 

 

Who are those two top 100 pick guys?  (I honestly don't know)

Well let me put this in the nicest way. I did look it up and he played OLB/DE at VA.Tech. I can't assume you did.

[Motorin']

3 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

You mean you don't believe Beane that the answer at MLB is on the roster, or McDermott's speech about how Tyrell, Terrel, and Baylon deserve a chance to compete for the starting MLB role?

 

It's really hard to understand why the Bills drafted Bernard in Round 3 if they didn't believe he could start in some role

 

If I remember correctly, I thought Beane was pretty clear that Bernard was taken to backup Milano. 

 

That he's a WIL in the Bills system?

[Beck Water]

2 hours ago, Yantha said:

Beane:  "The answer at MLB is on our current roster".

 

Translation:  We are picking MLB in round 1.

 

lol....  never believe GMs at this time of year.

 

I do understand what you're saying. 

 

But at the same time, IMHO Beane and McDermott have gone, let's call it, unnecessarily far into the weeds of "demotivating and demoralizing" the LB on the roster if there's not a genuine competition, and drafting a 1st or 2nd round pick, whom everyone knows will be given a chance to start sooner or later, isn't too genuine.

5 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

If I remember correctly, I thought Beane was pretty clear that Bernard was taken to backup Milano. 

That he's a WIL in the Bills system?

 

I don't recall that.  It makes sense, in that he's very Milano-like in physique and intangibles.

 

However, I stand by my assessment that if he was, Milano's health and his snap usage means it's a pretty poor use of a 3rd round pick.  Sort of along the lines of GB drafting Jordan Love in the 1st and letting him sit on the bench for 3 seasons.

12 minutes ago, nosejob said:

Well let me put this in the nicest way. I did look it up and he played OLB/DE at VA.Tech. I can't assume you did.

 

 I would love to see the source where you find him playing DE for the Hokies.  He played OLB  (and also inside at times).  He did not play DE or edge AFAIK, nor was he a pass-rushing OLB.