Lamar Jackson wants guarantees that exceed Watson contract

[Teddy KGB]

Lmao @ everyone with it looks fishy nonsense 

 

Lamar is a dud in the playoffs and stays hurt, it’s pretty simple stuff 

 

Edited March 8, 2023 by Teddy KGB

[mjt328]

10 hours ago, chongli said:

 

 

 

Everyone in the NFL (including the Ravens) knows that Lamar Jackson is simply not a great passing quarterback.

In order to succeed, he needs a specialized offense built primarily around his ability to run the ball.  And once his legs and athleticism start declining, Jackson will no longer be able to beat defenses with his arm.

 

I know that people will immediately bring up Jackson's strong passing stats to defend him.  But those numbers are an illusion, built on the tremendous respect defenses show him as a running threat.  Teams usually play the Ravens by overloading the box with run defenders, keeping linebackers in as spies, and asking pass rushers to just play contain instead of trying to get sacks.  This makes it much easier to find receivers wide open downfield.

 

With each passing injury and age, Jackson will become less mobile and less of a threat to run.  When this happens, defenses will feel more comfortable playing normal coverage schemes.  Those wide open receivers will be a thing of the past.  Jackson will need to start reading defenses from the pocket, and make pinpoint throws into tight windows.  After five seasons in the NFL, he hasn't displayed a strong ability to do that.

 

Jackson is a blast to watch.  But the reality is, he already peaked in 2019.  And even in his amazing MVP season, the Ravens were knocked out of the playoffs in the Divisional Round (after scoring 12 measly points).  The last two seasons, he hasn't been able to stay healthy either.  I can't blame any team for being skeptical of trading two 1st Round picks, and then handing him the biggest contract in NFL history.  

 

[Doc]

10 hours ago, chongli said:

Plus, it could be argued he did not play in the playoffs last year when he was fully capable.

 

If he was fully capable (and there were rumblings he was), I can understand him not doing that without a long-term contract.

[benderbender]

9 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

The conspiracy theorist in me says that's the assumption they want you to make.   

 

It's not collusion.  It's well known that the failure to get a deal done was because Lamar wanted a fully guaranteed contract.  Just because the Browns were dumb enough to give a fully guaranteed record qb contract doesn't meant another team is.  If I'm Lamar, I hire an agent and back off the fully guaranteed demand.  He's one bad step away from losing generational wealth playing on the non exclusive franchise tag.

It's hard for me to hold it against Lamar to ask for fully guaranteed and mostly perplexes me as to why the Browns ownership didn't get forced out for wrecking the market. That deal was outrageous. The only thing the Browns seemed to win in the negotiation was paying him the 1 million for his first year they knew he'd be suspended for. Deshaun Watson is an unending PR nightmare that even championships won't erase. Yet he was the only person to have a guaranteed contract. This reset the market, but you're supposed to not notice. Kyler Murray got the same basic Watson contract just with 60% guaranteed money. It's amusing to me that teams would say "Ah, you see? Murray's contract isn't guaranteed and that was the last deal so THAT is the reset. Forget about fully guaranteed now." 

[Mr. WEO]

18 minutes ago, benderbender said:

It's hard for me to hold it against Lamar to ask for fully guaranteed and mostly perplexes me as to why the Browns ownership didn't get forced out for wrecking the market. That deal was outrageous. The only thing the Browns seemed to win in the negotiation was paying him the 1 million for his first year they knew he'd be suspended for. Deshaun Watson is an unending PR nightmare that even championships won't erase. Yet he was the only person to have a guaranteed contract. This reset the market, but you're supposed to not notice. Kyler Murray got the same basic Watson contract just with 60% guaranteed money. It's amusing to me that teams would say "Ah, you see? Murray's contract isn't guaranteed and that was the last deal so THAT is the reset. Forget about fully guaranteed now." 

 

No one cares anymore.  The Daniel Jones deal is the new "outrageous".

[MrEpsYtown]

I think there are 6 guys teams would be willing to trade 2 first-round picks for: Mahomes, Allen, Herbert, Burrow, Hurts, and Lawrence. I think the price hurts Jackson. 

 

I also think people are looking at that Russell Wilson trade and seeing how giving up all that draft capital is probably not the answer. I like Lamar but he has sat out so much and it seems like the book on stopping him may have been found. I would love to see what he could do outside of a Greg Roman offense and if I were a team like Tampa Bay, I would be all over him. If I'm the Jets, same. If I were the Patriots I am calling Baltimore and offering Mac Jones and picks.  These teams have pretty good rosters and are a QB away from competing. If I am the Commanders, same. The fact that some of these teams flat-out said they have no interest is indeed weird and may be an attempt to discourage guys from representing themselves. That is where he makes his most critical mistake. 

[QLBillsFan]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

 

If he was fully capable (and there were rumblings he was), I can understand him not doing that without a long-term contract.

So highlighting he’s a me first guy. The Ravens are a highly respected franchise. I’m seeing Newsome and the leadership are not signing up for the insane guaranteed $. Add that to how things ended last season and that is resonating across the league. His play upside and O based on him, health, and leadership are all concerns. 

[QLBillsFan]

54 minutes ago, benderbender said:

It's hard for me to hold it against Lamar to ask for fully guaranteed and mostly perplexes me as to why the Browns ownership didn't get forced out for wrecking the market. That deal was outrageous. The only thing the Browns seemed to win in the negotiation was paying him the 1 million for his first year they knew he'd be suspended for. Deshaun Watson is an unending PR nightmare that even championships won't erase. Yet he was the only person to have a guaranteed contract. This reset the market, but you're supposed to not notice. Kyler Murray got the same basic Watson contract just with 60% guaranteed money. It's amusing to me that teams would say "Ah, you see? Murray's contract isn't guaranteed and that was the last deal so THAT is the reset. Forget about fully guaranteed now." 

Not amusing just logical. As you say the Browns foolishly tried to drive the new guarantee market. The NFL

is being incredibly generous to the QB position. See Seahawks, Giants, Saints this week. But the fully guaranteed market is just giving away $ unnecessarily. It’s just smart business. Lamar has clearly benefited from having his mom in charge. Yikes… 

[Doc]

9 minutes ago, QLBillsFan said:

So highlighting he’s a me first guy. The Ravens are a highly respected franchise. I’m seeing Newsome and the leadership are not signing up for the insane guaranteed $. Add that to how things ended last season and that is resonating across the league. His play upside and O based on him, health, and leadership are all concerns. 

But why should he take the risk when he has no contract after the season?

[BruceVilanch]

If I were a QB needy team I would rather invest draft picks in moving up to get a rookie in the draft. Cheaper, team controlled contract, and I would imagine, they wouldn't act as their own agent if/when it's time to renegotiate. LJ wouldn't be worth the headache for me if I was in charge of a team, not to mention most teams would have to completely overhaul their offense like the ravens did to fit his skillset. 

[Orlando Buffalo]

2 hours ago, mjt328 said:

 

Everyone in the NFL (including the Ravens) knows that Lamar Jackson is simply not a great passing quarterback.

In order to succeed, he needs a specialized offense built primarily around his ability to run the ball.  And once his legs and athleticism start declining, Jackson will no longer be able to beat defenses with his arm.

 

I know that people will immediately bring up Jackson's strong passing stats to defend him.  But those numbers are an illusion, built on the tremendous respect defenses show him as a running threat.  Teams usually play the Ravens by overloading the box with run defenders, keeping linebackers in as spies, and asking pass rushers to just play contain instead of trying to get sacks.  This makes it much easier to find receivers wide open downfield.

 

With each passing injury and age, Jackson will become less mobile and less of a threat to run.  When this happens, defenses will feel more comfortable playing normal coverage schemes.  Those wide open receivers will be a thing of the past.  Jackson will need to start reading defenses from the pocket, and make pinpoint throws into tight windows.  After five seasons in the NFL, he hasn't displayed a strong ability to do that.

 

Jackson is a blast to watch.  But the reality is, he already peaked in 2019.  And even in his amazing MVP season, the Ravens were knocked out of the playoffs in the Divisional Round (after scoring 12 measly points).  The last two seasons, he hasn't been able to stay healthy either.  I can't blame any team for being skeptical of trading two 1st Round picks, and then handing him the biggest contract in NFL history.  

 

I stated this back in 2020 about Josh vs Lamar and was literally called a racist by people on here. LJ is great to watch but you can't find a backup for him, you can't rely on him to finish a season, and your offense will have to be extra specialized to help him. This does not even mention that he can't be expected to comeback from multiple scores down in the 4th. If I am a team like ATL I am trying to get him Daniel Jones contract but nothing more. 

[BillsFanSD]

I don't understand the "collusion" argument.  Why would teams be colluding against Lamar Jackson?  That doesn't make any sense considering some of the contracts that we've seen signed just this week.

 

A much simpler explanation is that the shaky passer who isn't using an agent overestimated his market value.

[CincyBillsFan]

11 hours ago, benderbender said:

If you were trying super hard to make it NOT seem like collusion, you’d at least ask these “sources” to not all say the same thing at the same time on the same day. 

I suspect they were thinking about the public impact on their fan bases expectations and their young QB's, not about any appearances of collusion.  In fact it would have been stupid to insinuate that they were looking at Jackson as Lamar's contract demands make signing him very difficult and publicly expressing interest at the start of the process hurts their negotiating position.

 

And for these specific teams saying nothing at the start is saying that they're interested in Jackson.

 

BTW I enjoy seeing the Dolphins mess up as much as the next Bills fan but even I would think it cruel and unusual punishment to put Tua through another round of Miami going after a big name QB. 

 

 

Edited March 8, 2023 by CincyBillsFan

[Mr. WEO]

19 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

This is going to be a lot of fun to follow, and I hope some NFC team makes Lamar the highest paid player in NFL history. 

 

Makes the AFC a little easier, and Lamar gets a serious payday. If you look at SpotTrac he was making peanuts (like 1 million or so per season until his 5th year option) while the Ravens ran him into the ground. I can't blame the man for wanting to get his guaranteed money. 

 

AFC has been pretty easy for lots of teams even with Jackson in the conference.  He's a playoff nonfactor.  Flacco was 10-5. 

 

16 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

If Lamar sits out the entire year would he become a free agent?

 

Technically what's stopping the USFL or XFL from offering him $10 million dollars to play this spring to help tide him over this season while generating huge PR for their league?

 

I just want to see Lamar stick it to the Ravens and the league at this point. This is straight up BS. 

 

lol the XFL doesn't have 2 dimes to rub together, let alone "$10 million dollars".  The total league budget for players' salaries is under 25 million.  Also, only 3 weeks in and their ratings are essentially approaching zero.  

[ColoradoBills]

1 hour ago, BillsFanSD said:

I don't understand the "collusion" argument.  Why would teams be colluding against Lamar Jackson?  That doesn't make any sense considering some of the contracts that we've seen signed just this week.

 

A much simpler explanation is that the shaky passer who isn't using an agent overestimated his market value.

 

This collusion stuff works with Lamar because of all the stuff going on with him since he was being drafted.

These "pundits" know it will get the clicks up and that's just what certain people in the sports media want.

 

Lamar screwed up and the Ravens did the smart thing to tag him with the "unrestricted".  An agent would have explained that option clearly to him.

One of these teams may change their minds IF Lamar adjusts his demands.  The question is, what will Lamar do now?  Answer, no one knows,

I'm afraid not even Lamar himself.

 

Lamar created this situation; he was offered a credible contract right after Josh signed.  The ball is in his court.

[JoPoy88]

2 hours ago, BillsFanSD said:

I don't understand the "collusion" argument.  Why would teams be colluding against Lamar Jackson?  That doesn't make any sense considering some of the contracts that we've seen signed just this week.

 

A much simpler explanation is that the shaky passer who isn't using an agent overestimated his market value.

The collusion theory put forth by some has to do with owners collectively behind the scenes agreeing not to pull what the Browns did with Watson and strengthen that precedent. It has little to do with Jackson specifically, but the focus is on him because he’s the 1st “high end” QB comparable to Watson to come up for his extension since Watson’s deal. 

[Orlando Buffalo]

1 hour ago, JoPoy88 said:

The collusion theory put forth by some has to do with owners collectively behind the scenes agreeing not to pull what the Browns did with Watson and strengthen that precedent. It has little to do with Jackson specifically, but the focus is on him because he’s the 1st “high end” QB comparable to Watson to come up for his extension since Watson’s deal. 

The problem with  the collusion argument is that you have to not only show that the other teams worked together, which would be hard to show without access to their emails and such, but to get access you have to show a judge that a reasonable person would expect this kind of compensation and he can only point to one guy, Watson, who plays for a terrible organization. Winners don't usually emulate the Browns 

[JoPoy88]

38 minutes ago, Orlando Tim said:

The problem with  the collusion argument is that you have to not only show that the other teams worked together, which would be hard to show without access to their emails and such, but to get access you have to show a judge that a reasonable person would expect this kind of compensation and he can only point to one guy, Watson, who plays for a terrible organization. Winners don't usually emulate the Browns 

Sure I agree with all of that - it’s very hard to prove. Doesn’t mean it isn’t happening. Only the absolute dumbest (see Stephen Ross) get caught. 

[Buffalo03]

Lamar is a greedy idiot. I understand him wanting to be paid, but he shouldn't be wanting a fully guaranteed contract simply because the Browns are idiots for giving Watson one. All these other QBs are ok with not having fully guaranteed contracts and I'd be willing to bet that Burrow and Herbert will be more than happy with a contract that isn't fully guaranteed. Lamar is going to eventually cave to someone. Not sure who, but he will soon realize, he's not getting that type of deal

[Chicken Boo]

7 hours ago, mjt328 said:

 

Everyone in the NFL (including the Ravens) knows that Lamar Jackson is simply not a great passing quarterback.

In order to succeed, he needs a specialized offense built primarily around his ability to run the ball.  And once his legs and athleticism start declining, Jackson will no longer be able to beat defenses with his arm.

 

I know that people will immediately bring up Jackson's strong passing stats to defend him.  But those numbers are an illusion, built on the tremendous respect defenses show him as a running threat.  Teams usually play the Ravens by overloading the box with run defenders, keeping linebackers in as spies, and asking pass rushers to just play contain instead of trying to get sacks.  This makes it much easier to find receivers wide open downfield.

 

With each passing injury and age, Jackson will become less mobile and less of a threat to run.  When this happens, defenses will feel more comfortable playing normal coverage schemes.  Those wide open receivers will be a thing of the past.  Jackson will need to start reading defenses from the pocket, and make pinpoint throws into tight windows.  After five seasons in the NFL, he hasn't displayed a strong ability to do that.

 

Jackson is a blast to watch.  But the reality is, he already peaked in 2019.  And even in his amazing MVP season, the Ravens were knocked out of the playoffs in the Divisional Round (after scoring 12 measly points).  The last two seasons, he hasn't been able to stay healthy either.  I can't blame any team for being skeptical of trading two 1st Round picks, and then handing him the biggest contract in NFL history.  

 

 

You're completely dismissing the lack of talent at the WR position.  Who has he had to work with?  Devin Duvernay?

2 hours ago, JoPoy88 said:

The collusion theory put forth by some has to do with owners collectively behind the scenes agreeing not to pull what the Browns did with Watson and strengthen that precedent. It has little to do with Jackson specifically, but the focus is on him because he’s the 1st “high end” QB comparable to Watson to come up for his extension since Watson’s deal. 

 

I agree with this.  

 

I hope Burrow demands a fully guaranteed deal.  Things will get real interesting then.