This place has become poisonous

[Saxum]

11 hours ago, Dr. K said:

I've been a member of this community since the very beginning, in 2001. 

 

I hope some of you will get out of the house now and then and breathe some fresh air. 

 

Well if they stay inside and breathe their own poisonous air problem should resolve itself.

I think the issue started with the D👀mers and just continued ranting and probably would have no matter what the results.

Some of it is instigated by those regular trolls who pretend to be Bills fans but are always negative no matter what happens.

 

[Stuartjohn]

11 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

Well, I agree to a point, but it's understandable.  What happens every year at this time is people are looking back on the season and talking about what didn't work.  Only time that won't happen is if the Bills win the Super Bowl.  

 

So, what didn't work?   The defense and the offense let the team down in the playoffs.  Why?   Well, that's what people are talking about.  Not very productively, in my opinion, because I think the problems are much more nuanced than people here seem to think, but that's just my opinion.  

 

I am amazed, however, that people think McDermott is the problem.   He's probably a top-five head coach, and people are complaining about him be too soft, or too oriented to the defense, or something.  I don't get that at all. 

Shaw-have you watched McDermotts in game decisions last 5 years? How about last year-13 seconds- this year in the divisional round- andYou think he’s a Top 5 Coach……LOL!

[Blazman11]

During the drought I emotionally divested myself from the Bills because they refused to move heaven and earth for an elite QB.  When quite literally your team is garbage unless you have one.  It upsets me when 10's of millions of dollars are spent on front office and coaching staffs and they refuse to do the logical items.  Of course I'd watch ever game and hope they would win but it was no big deal when they lost as I knew they weren't contenders.  

 

Now we have that elite QB.  After 13 seconds (and the offseason that followed) I again emotionally divested myself from this organization because they refuse to give that elite QB any help.  What's more, 13 seconds was such an egregious coaching miscalculation that someone other than a scapegoat should have lost their job.  13 seconds was the equivalent of answering the question, "what is 2+2?"  McDermott/Frazier answered with 5.  If any one of us was in a career position for 20+ years and so badly failed at something so basic we embarrassed the company on a national stage, we would be fired on the spot.  The Bills instead gave McDermott/Frazier more toys on Defense to play with.  

 

I've heard 3 years ago that we can't beat KC because they have Kelce and Hill.  Then this year we can't beat Cincy because they have 3 terrific passing weapons.   Instead of trying to acquire similar talent, the enormous egos running this organization thinks their defensive schemes are so much better than any other teams that that alone can stop them.  When we continually see evidence to the contrary. 

 

So until this organization stops wasting a generational talent by asking him to be Superman every game and actually come up with a better defensive scheme than rushing 4, dropping 7 on near every play, I will watch and again hope they win but know they are not real contenders.  

[JohnNord]

12 hours ago, Dr. K said:

I've been a member of this community since the very beginning, in 2001. 

 

Through the depths of the drought, I've never seen so much whining and anger and lashing out as what goes on daily on this board right now. Not everybody is guilty of this—there are a good number of eminently sane people who post here frequently—but the percentage of people acting like three-year-olds having temper tantrums is as high or higher than it has ever been.

 

I went away for the last weeks since the loss to the Bengals thinking that of course people are going to act out their disappointment; it's natural, I thought, let them get it out of their system. But it's as bad this morning as ever. I've tried blocking the worst offenders but the list would be too long to comprehend at this point. If the Bills were to take one fifth of the hysterical suggestions that are made every hour on this board, they would be out of the playoffs for the next twenty years. 

 

I realize this is likely my problem, not yours. So I'm giving it a pass at least until the draft, and maybe until training camp.

 

I hope some of you will get out of the house now and then and breathe some fresh air. 

The problem in this forum and with Bills fans in general is #emotionalism 

12 hours ago, QB Bills said:

Counterpoint..people like the op and those who agree with him/her are the worst kinds of fans. If we win, awesome. If we lose.. it's okay it's just football, go take care of your family. Just the worst kind of condescending, gatekeeping bs that is the real poison . You're starting a thread complaining about other people complaining. Who's the real loser here?

 

If a game doesn't affect you the way it does other fans, then why do you even need to post this here? Beyond that, wtf else are we supposed to be discussing here the week of the super bowl knowing that we could easily have been playing in this game?

 

Some of you have perspective that you believe the rest of us lack. Nonsense, but you do you. Pat yourself on the back. Also know this though, if and when the Bills finally do win it all, it'll feel much better to those of us who are that emotionally invested in them compared to y'all in the level-headed brigade.

Wow #emotionalism

[The Red King]

13 hours ago, Dr. K said:

I've been a member of this community since the very beginning, in 2001. 

 

Through the depths of the drought, I've never seen so much whining and anger and lashing out as what goes on daily on this board right now. Not everybody is guilty of this—there are a good number of eminently sane people who post here frequently—but the percentage of people acting like three-year-olds having temper tantrums is as high or higher than it has ever been.

 

I went away for the last weeks since the loss to the Bengals thinking that of course people are going to act out their disappointment; it's natural, I thought, let them get it out of their system. But it's as bad this morning as ever. I've tried blocking the worst offenders but the list would be too long to comprehend at this point. If the Bills were to take one fifth of the hysterical suggestions that are made every hour on this board, they would be out of the playoffs for the next twenty years. 

 

I realize this is likely my problem, not yours. So I'm giving it a pass at least until the draft, and maybe until training camp.

 

I hope some of you will get out of the house now and then and breathe some fresh air. 

 

Gotten plenty off it, thank you.  I'm glad you think anyone who's opinions differ from yours, individuals that think this team showed critical flaws that need addressing, are toxic, overreacting people.  I almost empithised with you, until that last line.

 

This is a forum.  We are allowed to voice our opinions, even if they differ from yours.  Some of us are sick of the drop-off from regular-season performance to playoff performance.  Especially on defense.  And we have a right to both feel and express that.  Equally as much as you have the right to think this season died to circumstances both too numerous and serious to overcome.  I may strongly disagree with that mindset, but I would never begrudge or backhand insult anyone having it.

[John from Riverside]

12 hours ago, QB Bills said:

Counterpoint..people like the op and those who agree with him/her are the worst kinds of fans. If we win, awesome. If we lose.. it's okay it's just football, go take care of your family. Just the worst kind of condescending, gatekeeping bs that is the real poison . You're starting a thread complaining about other people complaining. Who's the real loser here?

 

If a game doesn't affect you the way it does other fans, then why do you even need to post this here? Beyond that, wtf else are we supposed to be discussing here the week of the super bowl knowing that we could easily have been playing in this game?

 

Some of you have perspective that you believe the rest of us lack. Nonsense, but you do you. Pat yourself on the back. Also know this though, if and when the Bills finally do win it all, it'll feel much better to those of us who are that emotionally invested in them compared to y'all in the level-headed brigade.

If by emotionally invested, do you mean crying like a little three year old all off-season?

 

we are all upset after a loss the difference between that and the fan they can get up for the next season is not thinking that the whole team sucks because they didn’t achieve the ultimate goal

 

This team went 13 and three. They are not a bad team. Those are not bad coaches. Those are not bad players Josh Allen doesn’t suck Diggs does not need to be traded. We shouldn’t fire our first year offensive coordinator. McD has the best record of any coach of this team since Marv Levy.  Brandon bean is an excellent GM.
 

Thinking that you’re crying is some kind of badge of courage is what is really the worst of fans

 

suck it up buttercup

[Shaw66]

2 hours ago, Stuartjohn said:

Shaw-have you watched McDermotts in game decisions last 5 years? How about last year-13 seconds- this year in the divisional round- andYou think he’s a Top 5 Coach……LOL!

I doubt there are five coaches who have won as much, and winning isn what its about.  

[dancing_joker]

35 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I doubt there are five coaches who have won as much, and winning isn what its about.  

Andy Reid

Bill Belichick

John Harbaugh

Sean Payton

Kyle Shanahan 

Pete Carroll 

Sean McVay

 

Even Mike Tomlin could be on that list. He won a Super Bowl. 

[The Red King]

I will ask again, this time to anyone who thinks Frazier is a great coach.  Look at only the playoff numbers from his tenure.  Not regular season, playoffs.  They are horrific.  Not just one year.  Multiple years.  All of them.

 

Are you okay with a DC that will do fantastically in the regular season only to underperform and flame out in the playofffs?  It's like recording a painful football game, then rewatching it, hoping they win this time.  And when they don't, you watch the recording again because this time you've got a good feeling about it and gosh darn it, they were so close they just gotta win this time!

 

Frazier has made it crystal clear what kind of DC he is, and that's perfectly fine if you want to crush the regular season.  Me?  I'd like an actual shot at a Super Bowl title.

[teef]

This thread is an emotional roller coaster.  I don’t care what side you’re on…to me this place is fascinating. 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

18 hours ago, LabattBlue said:

What historic moment?

Exactly. It's only historic because the franchise has been utterly incompetent forever. It's historic to have a division round ceiling?

 

Get outta here 

[Ya Digg?]

4 hours ago, dancing_joker said:

Andy Reid

Bill Belichick

John Harbaugh

Sean Payton

Kyle Shanahan 

Pete Carroll 

Sean McVay

 

Even Mike Tomlin could be on that list. He won a Super Bowl. 

Ahhhh yes, Kyle Shanahan, the guy who has won as many super bowls as McDermott. The guy who actually lost the game for Atlanta because as an OC he refused to run the ball. The guy who choked when he was up 10 on the Chiefs….yeah that guy definitely deserves to be ranked above McDermott. At least the other guys on that list have a Super Bowl (although it’s been a while for most of them)

[Dr. Who]

There are many things more important than the Buffalo Bills. I've invested my life in pursuing them. At the same time, I have also spent untold hours thinking about and rooting for the football team from Western New York. I've been a fan for over fifty years. I'd like to see a SB win in my lifetime. Aside from trolls who I despise because of their dishonesty and the fact that they exist to dump on the team and fans of that team, I believe one should tolerate the full spectrum of genuine fans. A fella like Scott Law tends to see the flaws, but he's a real fan (not a Jets fan in disguise) -- and he's often correct in the flaws he recognizes. There are others who see the positive. Logic usually makes a good case for why there is hope. Neither is wrong.

 

At this particular moment, I'm disgusted with our recent playoff performances. I feel we are wasting Josh Allen's early prime and Stefon Diggs mid to late prime. Frazier does appear a liability in the post-season. The drafts have been mediocre, too many resources have been poured into a defense that underperforms when it counts most and Josh has not been given the weapons and especially the oline protection that would maximize his capacity to play well and contribute to winning a SB. You want to call that assessment toxic, have at it. If you're bored enough, go search my posting history. I'm generally one of those who leans "homer." 

[<bills4life>]

17 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

There are many things more important than the Buffalo Bills. I've invested my life in pursuing them. At the same time, I have also spent untold hours thinking about and rooting for the football team from Western New York. I've been a fan for over fifty years. I'd like to see a SB win in my lifetime. Aside from trolls who I despise because of their dishonesty and the fact that they exist to dump on the team and fans of that team, I believe one should tolerate the full spectrum of genuine fans. A fella like Scott Law tends to see the flaws, but he's a real fan (not a Jets fan in disguise) -- and he's often correct in the flaws he recognizes. There are others who see the positive. Logic usually makes a good case for why there is hope. Neither is wrong.

 

At this particular moment, I'm disgusted with our recent playoff performances. I feel we are wasting Josh Allen's early prime and Stefon Diggs mid to late prime. Frazier does appear a liability in the post-season. The drafts have been mediocre, too many resources have been poured into a defense that underperforms when it counts most and Josh has not been given the weapons and especially the oline protection that would maximize his capacity to play well and contribute to winning a SB. You want to call that assessment toxic, have at it. If you're bored enough, go search my posting history. I'm generally one of those who leans "homer." 

Be careful.  Your logical dose of reality is sure to trigger some people.  Sometimes the truth hurts. You sir are spot on.  

Edited February 12, 2023 by <bills4life>

[Casey D]

20 hours ago, uticaclub said:

People need an outlet. There's those that aren't satisfied with just making the playoffs anymore and those fans that are content. 

It's comments like these that drive me crazy.  No one- I repeat no one-- is "satisfied Just making the playoffs." The implication of these posts is that I whine because I have higher standards and am more discerning than the rest of you.  Fact is, whiners gonna whine.

[ProcessTruster]

20 hours ago, HappyDays said:

For me personally my frustration stems from the fact that we finally have an elite QB after a two decade wait and the prime of his career is going to be gone before we know it. So the stakes have gotten much higher. I suspect that many fans feel the same way, consciously or not. The 13 seconds debacle was the epitome of this - our QB had arguably the greatest performance in playoff history but got screwed over by his coaches and teammates (mainly on the defense). So everything is coming to a head now and yes frustrations are boiling over.

 two words.  Heath Farwell.   McDermott gets Coach of the Year forever for the restraint of not throwing that incompetent under the bus for that magnificent screw up.  

[Ethan in Cleveland]

20 hours ago, Rigotz said:

It’s not a problem with this message board, it’s a problem with the fan base and it’s totally understandable.

 

After a very long history of failure (my entire adult life as I’m 37 years old), there is finally excitement and hope again.

 

Any time that hope is dashed, the feelings are amplified. People feel like THIS is our one and only chance… and perhaps rightfully so.

 

A little bit of understanding and grace will go a long way in just enjoying this historic moment we’re currently in.

What is historic about this moment?

[SoCal Deek]

What’s poisonous about people sharing their opinions / predictions of the future? Many on here are perfectly content to win lots of regular season games and lose in the playoffs, believing that after so many years of 7-9 that it’s a whole lot better to be ‘competitive’. Others have grown weary of simply being competitive and are anxious to change things up (take a risk or two) to get to the next level. Seems like an open and honest debate to me. So…as for me…I’m in the second camp. Having been a fan for SIXTY years, I’m ready to roll the dice. The Team has their QB. It’s time to change some things around him. What they’ve been doing for the last half decade is nice, for sure, but it is NOT the goal. 

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

5 hours ago, dancing_joker said:

Andy Reid

Bill Belichick

John Harbaugh

Sean Payton

Kyle Shanahan 

Pete Carroll 

Sean McVay

 

Even Mike Tomlin could be on that list. He won a Super Bowl. 

 

What's this a list of coaches with worst records than McDermott??  I assume that is what this list is as if you looked it up you'd find that every name on the list has a worse record than McD with the exception of Belichick and technically Reid.  But Reid has a winning percentage of .641, McD is .639 which is an overall difference of one win more liketime.  With the exception of Shanahan, they've all won one SB and some have better playoff records, but  if you take the one year away that they won the SB as they went at least 3-0, their overall playoff isn't any better either.

 

This is a pretty impressive list of names, but none of which have done any better than McD except Belichick overall except they won one SB each.  I do think winning the SB is a bit of luck involved, the biggest is avoid large number of injuries,  timing i.e. peaking at the right time, matchups, Bills likely would have had a better shot at beating KC than Bengals, and just a bit of luck overall.

 

As to the original point of this thread, I think one of the issues that magnifies everything is the internet.  Imagine what this board would have been like 30 years ago when the Bills lost 4 in a row if everyone had easy access to the internet and there were as many sites to go to for data and information as there is today.  People would have been rioting in the streets.

 

Don't forget too that the word fans is short for fanatics which is what we all are.  Anyone who posts on message boards 12 months of the year, 7 of which there aren't even any games going on is a fanatic.  So as fanatics we're not the most rational thinkers as it's emotional.  We likely are more emotional than many of the players are as to them it's a job, many of which weren't even o nthe team last year and many won't be here again next season.    Most here rip the media that covers the team, they don't know anything, they're wrong, if they rip a Bills player they are scorned, etc.  But one thing they are for the most part is unbiased.  When you read many of their articles, they are much more rational takes on things overall than many posters here.

[ProcessTruster]

21 hours ago, tomur67 said:

I know we're all very disappointed on how the season ended, but I enjoyed watching most of the games this season.  It is great to be a Bill's fan. They have great talent and anything is possible. I think back on those depressed years and remember being happy when they were able to score a touchdown or two.  Super excited when they actually won a game.  Now I'm happy we have a team that we can be proud of.

Agreed.   After 20 years of suck, they are competitive in every game, likely to win 3 out of 4 ... as long as McBeanes focus on roster improvement and avoid the shiny objects, this will continue for the next 10+ years.   If I can have this, plus an extended Patriots drought, I am good with that... plus they'll be in the SB hunt every year.