This place has become poisonous

[teef]

40 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I don’t read any of this as whiney. I just see fans being truly frustrated. To them, the Bills appear to have painted themselves into a corner, and fans think it’s going to take a miracle draft to fix it…or…a change of coaching strategy (that clearly isn’t coming). 

i really wasn't referring to anything specific in this thread.  i'm talking about things like the repeat threads that are just slightly reworded complaints that are already in a million threads.  at some point we get the picture, and it's just non-constructive.  

[SoCal Deek]

Just now, teef said:

i really wasn't referring to anything specific in this thread.  i'm talking about things like the repeat threads that are just slightly reworded complaints that are already in a million threads.  at some point we get the picture, and it's just non-constructive.  

True….but when you step back and look at it, it’s interesting how the debate has shifted this offseason. Most, if not all, of these threads are focused on the schemes, and therefore on the coaching staff. There’s very, very little player bashing going on here. I believe the fans are frustrated with the cul-de-sac that the organization has driven themselves down into….and after a few weeks it’s clear that the organization isn’t planning on making changes there (with the exception of the assistant secondary coach 🙄). Thus the frustration. Fans already don’t see much of a way out of that cul-de-sac in 2023. 

[BarleyNY]

16 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

True….but when you step back and look at it, it’s interesting how the debate has shifted this offseason. Most, if not all, of these threads are focused on the schemes, and therefore on the coaching staff. There’s very, very little player bashing going on here. I believe the fans are frustrated with the cul-de-sac that the organization has driven themselves down into….and after a few weeks it’s clear that the organization isn’t planning on making changes there (with the exception of the assistant secondary coach 🙄). Thus the frustration. Fans already don’t see much of a way out of that cul-de-sac in 2023. 

I have slowed my posting because it seems like I’m just repeating myself. We are barely into the off-season so there isn’t much happening. Free agency starts in about a month and then soon after draft talk will ramp up. But really nothing else besides running back the same staff, last season and how it ended to talk about right now. 

[SoCal Deek]

8 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

I have slowed my posting because it seems like I’m just repeating myself. We are barely into the off-season so there isn’t much happening. Free agency starts in about a month and then soon after draft talk will ramp up. But really nothing else besides running back the same staff, last season and how it ended to talk about right now. 

I disagree on one point. There actually are things going on right now. Coaching changes are happening all across the league. THIS is the month when that happens. The Bills have shown that they’re not interested. Which tells us a lot about what to expect in 2023. With the team up against the cap, and a recently suspect draft track record, there are very few other variables in the equation…other than coaches. OBD has decided to stand pat, therefore proving that they’re blaming this year’s falling short on factors outside of their control. Is it right? Nobody knows for sure, but it’s clear that’s what the organization believes. 

[BarleyNY]

1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said:

I disagree on one point. There actually are things going on right now. Coaching changes are happening all across the league. THIS is the month when that happens. The Bills have shown that they’re not interested. Which tells us a lot about what to expect in 2023. With the team up against the cap, and a recently suspect draft track record, there are very few other variables in the equation…other than coaches. OBD has decided to stand pat, therefore proving that they’re blaming this year’s falling short on factors outside of their control. Is it right? Nobody knows for sure, but it’s clear that’s what the organization believes. 

That's fair. And I think it’s reasonable to expect the coaches and FO to stay the course until we see otherwise. 

[Trogdor]

On 2/13/2023 at 12:47 PM, Shaw66 said:

Well, I've largely stayed out of this thread because a lot it is as you say.   But it started out making a different point, or at least I thought so.  The point was that a lot of fans seemed to be taking extremely negative positions about a team that is awfully close to being a great team in the league.  It's one thing to have intelligent discussions about what needs to be done to get better; it's another to talk about blowing things up, getting rid of coaches or the GM, etc.   

 

If we could poll 32 owners and ask them if they didn't have the HC, GM, and/or QB they have, which one in the league would they like, McDermott, Beane, and Allen would be in everyone's top 10 and probably in most cases, in the top 5.   So, complaining about how this team is being run in terms that suggest it's some kind of massive failure just doesn't make sense to me. 

The NFL is filled with teams who had promise and never put it together. I just don't want this to be the Philip Rivers Chargers. They just don't seem pressed at all to make changes to a system that isn't working in the playoffs. 

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

So do I take the Red pill or the Blue pill? 

[Fleezoid]

4 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

True….but when you step back and look at it, it’s interesting how the debate has shifted this offseason. Most, if not all, of these threads are focused on the schemes, and therefore on the coaching staff. There’s very, very little player bashing going on here. I believe the fans are frustrated with the cul-de-sac that the organization has driven themselves down into….and after a few weeks it’s clear that the organization isn’t planning on making changes there (with the exception of the assistant secondary coach 🙄). Thus the frustration. Fans already don’t see much of a way out of that cul-de-sac in 2023. 

 

 

[Figster]

On 2/14/2023 at 8:10 AM, SoCal Deek said:

With all due respect, there’s a big difference between your ‘content with losing’ take away and my perception of the utter lack of preparation that we saw against the Bengals. Nobody wants to lose…obviously. My point is that the Bills simply don’t appear to be in the moment when the moment is there to be in. Too many collapses and head scratching lack of effort. I blame the coaches for that. Do I like watching them win games during the regular season. Sure! They’ve done that for quite awhile now. Now I want the Team to be laser focused at the moment when the games are there to be won or lost in the playoffs. 

Its a fair point. Under the circumstances I'm not sure laser focused was even possible for the coaches or players IMO. 

 

We both want changes on the coaching side of the equation. The problem is I don't see wholesale changes being made. To be clear I'm a big fan of Bills HC McD. OC and DC, not so much, on the DC side of things its hard to teach an old dog new tricks IMO. Frazier lacks killer instincts IMO. On the other side of the ball the Dorsey O lacks innovation.  Dorseys riding the Daboll playbook and Allens ability to improvise on any play IMO. 

 

You guys have all seen my thread on Ryan Fitzpatrick. In his 1st season with Chan Gailey back in 2010 for Buffalo Fitzpatrick passed for over 3,000 yards. Gaileys no name misfitz's we called them. Featuring Stevie Johnson. We all remember the day Fitzpatrick and the Bills beat the Pats 31 - 0. This was a team with very little actual talent on Offense IMO.  Again more recently, Fitzpatrick was united with Chan Gailey and the Dolphins.  Fitzpatrick imediately picked up right were he left off in the Gailey Offense. Gailey resigned from the Dolphins in 2021 because Tua was named the starter for the following season. The bond and sense of loyalty between Gailey and Fitzpatrick clearly evident. Fitzpatrick understanding and ability to run the Gailey Offense also clearly evident. Chan Gaileys retired now ands its highly unlikely the old fox will ever coach again IMO.   The Gailey playbook and how to use it still resides in the big brain of Ryan Fitzpatrick.

 

Bringing Ryan Fitzpatrick back to Buffalo as a coach on Offense can help the Buffalo Bills win a Championship. 

 

 

 

Edited February 15, 2023 by Figster

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

7 minutes ago, Figster said:

The Gailey playbook and how to use it still resides in Ryan Fitzpatricks big brain.

[SoCal Deek]

28 minutes ago, Figster said:

Its a fair point. Under the circumstances I'm not sure laser focused was even possible for the coaches or players IMO. 

 

We both want changes on the coaching side of the equation. The problem is I don't see wholesale changes being made. To be clear I'm a big fan of Bills HC McD. OC and DC, not so much, on the DC side of things its hard to teach an old dog new tricks IMO. Frazier lacks killer instincts IMO. On the other side of the ball the Dorsey O lacks innovation.  Dorseys riding the Daboll playbook and Allens ability to improvise on any play IMO. We have a QB now and glorified QB coach pretending to be OC IMO. 

 

You guys have all seen my thread on Ryan Fitzpatrick. In his 1st season with Chan Gailey back in 2010 for Buffalo Fitzpatrick passed for over 3,000 yards. Gaileys no name misfitz's we called them. Featuring Stevie Johnson. We all remember the day Fitzpatrick and the Bills beat the Pats 31 - 0. This was a team with very little actual talent on Offense IMO.  Again more recently, Fitzpatrick was united with Chan Gailey and the Dolphins.  Fitzpatrick imediately picked up right were he left off in the Gailey Offense. Gailey resigned from the Dolphins in 2021 because Tua was named the starter for the following season. The bond and sense of loyalty between Gailey and Fitzpatrick clearly evident. Fitzpatrick understanding and ability to run the Gailey Offense also clearly evident. Chan Gaileys retired now ands its highly unlucky the old fox will ever coach again IMO.   The Gailey playbook and how to use it still resides in the big brain of Ryan Fitzpatrick.

 

Bringing Ryan Fitzpatrick back to Buffalo as a coach on Offense can help the Buffalo Bills win a Championship.  

I’m willing to give Dorsey time to create his own style but I am 100% done with Frazier. And the fact that he’s still there has made me lose most of what faith I had in McD. 

[Figster]

23 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I’m willing to give Dorsey time to create his own style but I am 100% done with Frazier. And the fact that he’s still there has made me lose most of what faith I had in McD. 

Dorsey had a whole season to create his own style and fell flat on his face vs Cinci IMO. I am however in agreement with you on deserving another season to prove himself because in all fairness its the right way to proceed. Just a little help from another source of playbook/play calling to add wrinkles. Some help in real time game adjustments. This can help Ken Dorsey succeed IMO. Myself personally, Josh Allen, like it our not, deserves everything Buffalo can do to help him on the coaching side of the equation. Expecting the Bills young OC Ken Dorsey to match wits with the likes of Offensive gurus the caliber of Andy Reid is a mistake IMO. Dorsey faces some of the best DC's in the game when he reaches the playoffs. Give him help. 

 

I worry less about the D because when healthy the Bills Secondary is second to none under the McD/Frazier philosophy IMO. Key word "healthy"

Edited February 14, 2023 by Figster

[Lfod]

It's entertainment for me. It doesn't change my life at all if the team does well or sucks. It's a lot more fun now than it has been for me to follow the team. 

 

I understand people are more invested than I am. People probably know a lot more about the game and the team than I do. 

 

I just don't understand if something that is supposed to be fun can make a person so negative then why do it? 

 

I'm not talking about the ups and downs wins and loses people go through. I'm just saying I read comments on this board that make me wonder if the person needs to step away from this as I don't think it's entertainment to them. 

 

I've noticed there is some toxicity as well. I've been told before not to feed the trolls. 

Edited February 14, 2023 by Lfod

[SoCal Deek]

12 minutes ago, Figster said:

Dorsey had a whole season to create his own style and fell flat on his face vs Cinci IMO. I am however in agreement with you on deserving another season to prove himself because in all fairness its the right way to proceed. Just a little help from another source of playbook/play calling to add wrinkles. Some help in real time game adjustments. This can help Ken Dorsey succeed IMO. Myself personally, Josh Allen, like it our not, deserves everything Buffalo can do to help him on the coaching side of the equation. Expecting the Bills young OC Ken Dorsey to match wits with the likes of Offensive gurus the caliber of Andy Reid is a mistake IMO. Dorsey faces some of the best DC's in the game when he reaches the playoffs. Give him help. 

 

I worry less about the D because when healthy the Bills Secondary is second to none under the McD/Frazier philosophy IMO. Key word "healthy"

I don’t ‘worry’ about Frazier. I know exactly what we’re going to get from him. Been there, DONE with that!

[Figster]

7 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I don’t ‘worry’ about Frazier. I know exactly what we’re going to get from him. Been there, DONE with that!

I understand. 

 

You know for a poisonous thread /site we seem to be doing just fine ;  )

 

Sorry OP...

Edited February 14, 2023 by Figster

[Patrick Duffy]

6 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

I don’t read any of this as whiney. I just see fans being truly frustrated. To them, the Bills appear to have painted themselves into a corner, and fans think it’s going to take a miracle draft to fix it…or…a change of coaching strategy (that clearly isn’t coming). 

 

Although it's definitely a few posters here and there that are 100% whiners, some are pretty bad whiners so much their breathe prolly smells like similac formula.

 

But I agree that many (like myself) are just sharing frustration and sometimes ppl just have to vent once in a while whether it's on here or with another fan/friend, Bills fan etc. That being said, there's always some posters that will say they are whining, crying etc when ppl do vent. So that's my 2 cents anyways....lol

[Figster]

4 minutes ago, Patrick Duffy said:

 

Although it's definitely a few posters here and there that are 100% whiners, some are pretty bad whiners so much their breathe prolly smells like similac formula.

 

But I agree that many (like myself) are just sharing frustration and sometimes ppl just have to vent once in a while whether it's on here or with another fan/friend, Bills fan etc. That being said, there's always some posters that will say they are whining, crying etc when ppl do vent. So that's my 2 cents anyways....lol

If you want to brainstorm something football related concerning the Buffal Bills, TBD is an excellent place to start IMO. This site rocks when it comes to having a high number of knowledgeable posters IMO. I for one don't mind hearing a few crazier takes from time to time. Meltdowns.

 

We care, we all do...

 

 

[Augie]

7 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

True….but when you step back and look at it, it’s interesting how the debate has shifted this offseason. Most, if not all, of these threads are focused on the schemes, and therefore on the coaching staff. There’s very, very little player bashing going on here. I believe the fans are frustrated with the cul-de-sac that the organization has driven themselves down into….and after a few weeks it’s clear that the organization isn’t planning on making changes there (with the exception of the assistant secondary coach 🙄). Thus the frustration. Fans already don’t see much of a way out of that cul-de-sac in 2023. 

 

To be fair, it’s not just the safeties coach. They also brought in Al Holcomb as a “Senior Defensive Assistant”, for better or worse, and are replacing the WR coach. Is Holcomb able to add anything of value? Will our DB’s start a few large mother-may-I steps forward?  Is he the DC in waiting? I honestly have no idea what he might add. He has been a DC before.

 

I also don’t know what happened behind the scenes which Chad Hall at WR coach. Is that addition by subtraction? Again, I have no idea. Sometimes things that seem to be little at the time turn out to be more than what we realized in the moment. But it’s true that they seem to be mostly staying the course. A little help for Dorsey would make me feel better, but maybe improvements in personnel will help make it flow better.  

 

It just seems our in door is connected to Charlotte while our out door seems to lead to Jacksonville. 

 

https://thebuffalofanatics.com/buffalo-bills-hire-al-holcomb-as-senior-defensive-assistant/

 

EDIT: Looks like they moved on from an assistant OL coach, too. Not sure if he found a better gig or Kromer decided he just wasn’t good enough. He’d been there prior to Kromer (2019?) but no idea what happened behind the scenes. No BIG changes, but like the rest of the league, we ARE making some changes.  I just hope it helps!!! 

 

 

.

Edited February 14, 2023 by Augie

[Airseven]

6 hours ago, teef said:

i really wasn't referring to anything specific in this thread.  i'm talking about things like the repeat threads that are just slightly reworded complaints that are already in a million threads.  at some point we get the picture, and it's just non-constructive.  

 

It's an internet message board. You might be in the wrong spot for what you're looking for.  

[LABILLBACKER]

1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said:

I’m willing to give Dorsey time to create his own style but I am 100% done with Frazier. And the fact that he’s still there has made me lose most of what faith I had in McD. 

You guys sure are more patient than me. I was done with Leslie somewhere between Houston and the AFCCG in Arrowhead.  Long before the fun of :13......