Frazier: The hard FACTS on why many of us want a change.

[Simon Says]

On 2/8/2023 at 2:18 PM, Bill from NYC said:

McDermott is ultimately responsible for the defense, as well as the composition of the team itself. 

 

I am no fan of Frazier but if he is fired he will basically serve as a scapegoat for McDermott's failures.

How responsible is McDermott for the "composition of the team"? Isn't that  Beane's job ?

[Alphadawg7]

On 3/1/2023 at 11:51 AM, Nihilarian said:

Kansas City Chiefs are the best team in the NFL! They have been to 3 of the last 4 SBs and won 2 of them! They have arguably the best offensive-minded head coach in the league in Andy Reid. They are the ELITE team to beat. 

 

 

You say that, yet in the 2 playoff games against the Chiefs, the Bills gave up an average of 40 points per game.  In the Chiefs next games each of those years the Chiefs scored an average of 16.5 points per game, both losses.  

 

So you want to claim the Chiefs are this big bad unstoppable force, yet the Chiefs lost their next game BOTH times they Beat Buffalo in the playoffs and averaged LESS than HALF in points scored than what they averaged against us.  

 

Chiefs vs Bills - Average 40 points per game.

Chiefs vs next opponent - Average 16.5 points per game.

 

So yeah, this excuse of "well its the Chiefs" is nothing more than an excuse, and a bad one at that, that doesn't hold water.

[C.Biscuit97]

3 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

You say that, yet in the 2 playoff games against the Chiefs, the Bills gave up an average of 40 points per game.  In the Chiefs next games each of those years the Chiefs scored an average of 16.5 points per game, both losses.  

 

So you want to claim the Chiefs are this big bad unstoppable force, yet the Chiefs lost their next game BOTH times they Beat Buffalo in the playoffs and averaged LESS than HALF in points scored than what they averaged against us.  

 

Chiefs vs Bills - Average 40 points per game.

Chiefs vs next opponent - Average 16.5 points per game.

 

So yeah, this excuse of "well its the Chiefs" is nothing more than an excuse, and a bad one at that, that doesn't hold water.

Weren’t they battling s ton of oline injuries? Also, when do we fault the draft picks on the d line? Because constantly blitzing Mahomes is also a terrible plan.

 

im playing devils advocate here a bit. But I think Frazier is taking all the blame when players (especially the d line) and injuries also played a major role. 

[Just in Atlanta]

But these are facts.

 

We want opinions round here.

[Bill from NYC]

4 hours ago, Herb Nightly said:

How responsible is McDermott for the "composition of the team"? Isn't that  Beane's job ?

Not necessarily. Often the coaches have more power than the GM. For example. Pat Kirwin (former Seattle GM and currect Sirius radio host refers to Pete Carrol as his "boss" while at Seattle.

 

In the case of the Bills, McDermott was there first and got the job for Beane. Remember, Beane wasn't there when McDermott traded away (and was WAY undercompensated for) the #10 pick in 2017. That was the selection with which KC took Mahomes. We in turn grabbed the 8th defensive back in that draft after trading down 17 spots. McDermott was fleeced, and this showed how he values defensive players above all else and it didn't stop there. 

 

Josh Allen is great. He is a generational talent imo. McDermott drafts defensive backs and undersized DTs in lieu of blockers and receivers. McDermott is a good field coach. His problem is that he has a dose of the Levy/Jauron disease which is not conducive to winning Super Bowls. He needs to be stripped of his power wrt the draft.

 

This is jmo. I do not necessarily expect you to agree but you asked.

 

GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Nihilarian]

4 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

You say that, yet in the 2 playoff games against the Chiefs, the Bills gave up an average of 40 points per game.  In the Chiefs next games each of those years the Chiefs scored an average of 16.5 points per game, both losses.  

 

So you want to claim the Chiefs are this big bad unstoppable force, yet the Chiefs lost their next game BOTH times they Beat Buffalo in the playoffs and averaged LESS than HALF in points scored than what they averaged against us.  

 

Chiefs vs Bills - Average 40 points per game.

Chiefs vs next opponent - Average 16.5 points per game.

 

So yeah, this excuse of "well its the Chiefs" is nothing more than an excuse, and a bad one at that, that doesn't hold water.

Perhaps in your mind. 

 

The Kansas City Chiefs are the best team in the NFL this past season. KC QB Patrick Mahomes is the MVP and KC has been to the SB 3 of the last 4 years and won 2 of them. Let me repeat. The Kansas City Chiefs are the best team in the NFL.

 

The Buffalo Bills have been right on the threshold of making an SB appearance these last three years. Fighting it out with the Chiefs and now the Bengals. Pretty lofty company. 

 

 

That first playoff loss to the Chiefs was in 2020 at KC 24-38. The Chiefs faced the Bucs in the SB and lost 9-31. (Due to what C.Biscuit97 stated that the KC O line was in battered shape and the Bucs D chased Mahomes all game long.) (Loved that SB)

 

In 2021 Buffalo returned the favor during the regular season and smoked the Chiefs at Arrowhead 38-20. Buffalo lost to the Chiefs at KC in OT 36-42 in the playoff divisional round. (13 seconds)

The Chiefs lost to the Bengals at KC 24-27 in the Conference Championship game and Cincy went to the SB.

 

 

Regardless of your disdain for Leslie Frazier. Both McD and Beane have stated that if Frazier hadn't chosen to take a year off. That he would still be the Buffalo Bills DC. Rightfully so, as Buffalo has had one of the best defenses in the NFL under Frazier. It's not DC's fault that so many of the defensive players suffered injuries this past season. Despite all those injuries, #2 in points allowed, and #6 in yards allowed is pretty amazing, considering. 

 

 

Leslie Frazier is no longer the Buffalo Bills DC...let it go. 

 

 

 

 

[freddyjj]

2 hours ago, Bill from NYC said:

Not necessarily. Often the coaches have more power than the GM. For example. Pat Kirwin (former Seattle GM and currect Sirius radio host refers to Pete Carrol as his "boss" while at Seattle.

Fact check. Kirwan was never with the Seahawks.  He was Director of Player Administration with the Jets from 1989-1997.  Pete Carroll was Jets HC in 1994.  So they worked together. 

[Bill from NYC]

8 hours ago, freddyjj said:

Fact check. Kirwan was never with the Seahawks.  He was Director of Player Administration with the Jets from 1989-1997.  Pete Carroll was Jets HC in 1994.  So they worked together. 

Correct. I confused the Jets with seattle. Thanks.

[Alphadawg7]

18 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Weren’t they battling s ton of oline injuries? Also, when do we fault the draft picks on the d line? Because constantly blitzing Mahomes is also a terrible plan.

 

im playing devils advocate here a bit. But I think Frazier is taking all the blame when players (especially the d line) and injuries also played a major role. 

 

Since joining the Bills, here is Jerry Hughes performance with Frazier and without Frazier.  

 

With Frazier (5 seasons):  Hughes averaged 4.4 sacks a season, with only 1 season with more than 5 (7 in 2018).

 

Without Frazier (5 seasons):  Hughes averaged 8 sacks a season, with 3 seasons of 9+ and only 1 season under 5 sacks.  That includes 9 sacks this year when he was supposed to be washed and playing on one of the worst teams in football.  

 

Doesn't that show a picture of how it is more Frazier and his system than the player when that player is performing at a much higher level when not being coached by Frazier?

 

23 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Under Frazier, our defense (minus the first year because you inherited a group from a fired staff) finished an average of 5th in nfl. 
 

I pray all you guys are right. But man, talk about a guy being scapegoated. Imagine being in the top 5 of your field for 5 years and people not thinking it was not good enough. 

 

The issue is they don't hand out Lombardi trophies for regular season performances.  It doesn't matter what you do in the regular season, come playoff time, its a whole new season of win or go home and against the better to best teams in the NFL.  And Frazier has shown to come up small in those moments too many times, with too many critical mistakes.  

Edited March 3, 2023 by Alphadawg7

[Alphadawg7]

15 hours ago, Nihilarian said:

Perhaps in your mind. 

 

The Kansas City Chiefs are the best team in the NFL this past season. KC QB Patrick Mahomes is the MVP and KC has been to the SB 3 of the last 4 years and won 2 of them. Let me repeat. The Kansas City Chiefs are the best team in the NFL.

 

The Buffalo Bills have been right on the threshold of making an SB appearance these last three years. Fighting it out with the Chiefs and now the Bengals. Pretty lofty company. 

 

 

That first playoff loss to the Chiefs was in 2020 at KC 24-38. The Chiefs faced the Bucs in the SB and lost 9-31. (Due to what C.Biscuit97 stated that the KC O line was in battered shape and the Bucs D chased Mahomes all game long.) (Loved that SB)

 

In 2021 Buffalo returned the favor during the regular season and smoked the Chiefs at Arrowhead 38-20. Buffalo lost to the Chiefs at KC in OT 36-42 in the playoff divisional round. (13 seconds)

The Chiefs lost to the Bengals at KC 24-27 in the Conference Championship game and Cincy went to the SB.

 

 

Regardless of your disdain for Leslie Frazier. Both McD and Beane have stated that if Frazier hadn't chosen to take a year off. That he would still be the Buffalo Bills DC. Rightfully so, as Buffalo has had one of the best defenses in the NFL under Frazier. It's not DC's fault that so many of the defensive players suffered injuries this past season. Despite all those injuries, #2 in points allowed, and #6 in yards allowed is pretty amazing, considering. 

 

 

Leslie Frazier is no longer the Buffalo Bills DC...let it go. 

 

 

 

 

 

Lol...so you literally ignore all the facts that were stated to you and just revert back to this stance of the Chiefs being this big bad boogeyman.  Lol, so weird they weren't that same unstoppable force to the teams they faced the week after curb stomping the Bills defense.

[Nihilarian]

10 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Lol...so you literally ignore all the facts that were stated to you and just revert back to this stance of the Chiefs being this big bad boogeyman.  Lol, so weird they weren't that same unstoppable force to the teams they faced the week after curb stomping the Bills defense.

Talk about ignoring facts. Because the Chiefs lost to the Buccaneers in the SB with a beaten-down O line? And then lost to the Bengals 24-27? 

 

The simple fact remains that the Kansas City Chiefs are the best team in the NFL without question. Who cares what points they beat Buffalo by or who they lost to the following week?

 

 Simply being in the Super Bowl three times in the last four years makes them the best team in the NFL in that time frame. Not to mention 2x MVPs 2x All-Pro for KC QB Patrick Mahomes and winning two of those Super Bowls. 

 

The Chiefs are starting to look like a dynasty.  Anyway, as I said, Leslie Frazer is no longer the Buffalo Bills DC... so ya got your wish. 

[Alphadawg7]

34 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

Talk about ignoring facts. Because the Chiefs lost to the Buccaneers in the SB with a beaten-down O line? And then lost to the Bengals 24-27? 

 

The simple fact remains that the Kansas City Chiefs are the best team in the NFL without question. Who cares what points they beat Buffalo by or who they lost to the following week?

 

 Simply being in the Super Bowl three times in the last four years makes them the best team in the NFL in that time frame. Not to mention 2x MVPs 2x All-Pro for KC QB Patrick Mahomes and winning two of those Super Bowls. 

 

The Chiefs are starting to look like a dynasty.  Anyway, as I said, Leslie Frazer is no longer the Buffalo Bills DC... so ya got your wish. 

Considering there are like 100 plus reactions to my OP and only 3 of them were negative, I’d say most everyone got their wish.  

[Pasaluki]

https://theathletic.com/4271878/2023/03/03/buffalo-bills-leslie-frazier-2/

 

The thin-skinned idiot Tim Graham should read the OP