Your Gut Instinct: Are Beane/McDermott On Track to Win Championship(s) or Wasting J. Allen's talent?

[US Egg]

2 minutes ago, Chaos said:

You do understand Elway needed a HC change before he won it all? Or don't you know things?

I don’t need you to explain anything to me, preach to those whose admiration you seek, Mr. Who sees it all.

Edited February 4, 2023 by I am the egg man

[Dr. Who]

Just now, Chaos said:

You do understand Elway needed a HC change before he won it all? Or don't you know things?

I mean, he's an egg. The fact that he can type at all is an accomplishment.

[Taro Nimbus]

This board is so depressing in the offseason.

[LABILLBACKER]

1 hour ago, No_Matter_What said:

Voted on track to winning SB but that's not what I think.

 

I think neither of them is an obstacle to do so. They are both doing good job. But it's not enough to win SB in a league with 32 teams and 6-7 each year capable of winning it all. 

 

You need right circumstances and luck. We didn't have it last two years. And maybe we will never have. 

 

They are making mistakes, everybody is. But they are not wasting Allen. I might say that about Beane next year if he doesn't try (big time) to assemble better OL this offseason. We'll see.

Beane rarely selects olineman because he's being pressured by his boss to select defense. This couldn't be more obvious based on our last several drafts. 

[US Egg]

8 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

I mean, he's an egg. The fact that he can type at all is an accomplishment.

…..and am chewing gum while doing so.

[NastyNateSoldiers]

2 hours ago, Chaos said:

To my read opinions of posters on TBD are split on the Bills general direction.  One group thinks the Bills should stay the course and keeping doing the same things and that through some experience/maturation process the Bills will get better results.  The second group thinks the coaching staff has peaked and won't be able to do further in the playoffs than it has.   There is a smaller group that seems to think coaching changes automatically results in disaster and as long as your current coaches are competent NFL coaches and you don't should tempt the fates with a change. 

I am in the second group.  I am not sure thinking team McDermott has peaked means "fire everybody", but I feel like any further failure to progress means something should change. 

I may be guilty of overrating Josh Allen, but I think any current NFL coaching staff would get the Bills 2022 Roster to the playoffs, simply because Allen is that good.  So the goals have to be set higher than that. 

McD lost my completely when he didn’t fire at least 1 of his coordinators . Mof both should’ve been fired. 
 

Dorsey should’ve been fired just based alone on why the running scheme wasn’t synced with the passing game to me that’s definitely a  reason for him to be fired. That’s borderline insane when u think of it. He had the whole off-season to come up with an offense where the running and passing games work together in synchronization. He should be fired ! 
 

Frazier should’ve been fired after 13secs but now there should’ve been nowhere to hide after that ass kicking we got from the Bengals. 
 

I don’t believe these coordinators would’ve kept there jobs if they coached for any other competent organization.  
 

Seems like McD loyalty is getting in the way of him doing his job correctly. The problem is he should be loyal to the Bills organization and the Bills Mafia not a few individuals. Loyalty works both ways and his is getting in the way of us getting a title. 
 

Last but not least look at this roster now it’s borderline awful other then Josh and Milano we have no building blocks . McBeane has fumbled the last 4 drafts in horrific fashion and there philosophies are almost as bad as everything else. We will never win with these guys running the show. 

[Marcus Aurelius]

Combining Beane and McDermott is a false choice question, I believe.

Beane is the main impediment to winning a Championship.

[LABILLBACKER]

29 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

I share the concern. Because I admire McDermott as a person and he is currently the coach of the Buffalo Bills, I hope he exceeds what appear to be his limits. All that said, Terry Pegula should have Ben Johnson on speed dial, because I suspect he is the next hot OC to get a shot at HC.

How confident are you Beane can pull off that requirement? That's the correct Rx, I agree.

I think 99% of fans realize this. As you accurately said earlier this is an offensive league with rules that further favor the offense.  We desperately need a WR2 and OL overhaul. Ben Johnson would be amazing for this team. The strategy from Day1 should've been surround Josh with excellence. And other than Diggs that didn't happen. 

[machine gun kelly]

1 hour ago, elijah said:

Check the board for the first time since the Bengals game.. And you’re telling me that so far 70% of people (19-8 in the poll currently) think there’s a better chance that we don’t win a championship under McBeane and Allen? 

 

It was a rough playoff loss and embarrassing coaching, true. 

 

McDermott is still a top 8 coach in the league, true. 

 

Allen is still a top 3 quarterback in the league, true. 

 

McDermott & Allen are still a top 5 QB/Coach combo in the league, true. 

 

The first statement can be true at the same time as the next three. It’s unfortunate the way we lost, and it was outright embarrassing for the organization and the city & fans that invest their lives into this team for 5-6 months of the year, and others that do year round. But the amount of criticism I’ve seen surrounding Allen/McBeane since this loss is borderline unfathomable. Confidence and faith should still be very high that these guys bring us atleast 1 Lombardi, if not more.

 

I was having the same meltdown the day after the game, and maybe even a couple after that. But come on, it’s 2 weeks later. Level yourselves. The Bills are still in a very elite class of the NFL and have turned into a model organization. It’ll come. 

 

And on that note, I guess I’ll have to keep TBD out of my search bar a little longer if this is still the direction conversations are trending 😭 

These are some very measured opinions, and agreed.

 

This is an overreaction from a bunch of guys who are upset about an embarrassing loss and we deserved to lose the way we played.  I’ll agree Frasier needs to go.

[BlazinBill]

The entire offensive roster make up this year seemed off to me, as for some reason we spoke about heavy tight end use and how a receiving back was needed - we draft Cook and sign OJ Howard - I'll admit I was very intrigued and then we cut Howard and barely used Cook. Then we don't really incorporate TE in the game at all.

Looking back those moves however it just proved Dorsey was in over his head and really didn't have a solid plan.

Offense had zero identity this year and to me despite it's success just seemed dysfunctional. Josh and Diggs can only do so much and mid season they seemed way off.

I repeatedly lied to myself thinking something was going to click late December and peak in Playoffs and they would ride off into the sunset with a Super Bowl victory.

Sadly Josh can't will this team by himself and was cooked in the last game as he just seemed ill prepared. We never developed a way to win unless JA was a freak and played Like he did in last year's playoffs- very unrealistic 

Then comes Beanes presser talking about how Dorsey is learning and had a lot of success. Problem here is this is the NFL and a first time OC is absolutely wasting the talent of this roster or basically JA17. It's really the first time Beane has had me in doubt.

So in one hand you have a short window and sign Von freaking Miller and the other your grooming someone to be an OC- it's just talking out of both sides of your mouth to me.

McDermott defense although good is completely predictable come playoffs and Frazier isn't the guy to get us past that, for some reason we just get picked apart every time it's a top tier QB.

I'll always bleed Buffalo Bills and be super elevated and over reactive to the season ups and downs but when we sit back in this bye week reflecting on things I'm really not sure how this plays out next year- we are cap strapped and staying the course

 

Neat

 

[Chaos]

6 minutes ago, Marcus Aurelius said:

Combining Beane and McDermott is a false choice question, I believe.

Beane is the main impediment to winning a Championship.

If one component is broken, then the combined component is broken. 

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

1 hour ago, Chaos said:

You do understand Elway needed a HC change before he won it all? Or don't you know things?

 

 The biggest thing Elway needed was a run game to take pressure off him. Something Reeves didn't provide, but Shanahan did. When Reeves departed the Broncos were a bottom 5ish running team and once Shanahan got here he immediately established a yearly top 5 rushing attack. In the 2 years they won the Super Bowl they finished 2nd & 4th in rushing even though Elway only averaged 150 yards per year.  

 

 We've had 2 straight OCs that refused to run the ball once Allen's play took a leap prior to 2020. Many of us here have been begging the Bills to start running it more for a couple years now. The 1st OC then leaves to become a HC his team is instantly a top 8 team in rushing attempts and top 4 in rushing yards.

 

 The positive effect would be two fold. 1 it would take pressure off of Josh and establishing a run game would help open up the passing game, especially the play action game. Want to get the defenses out of the 2 deep safty look this offense sees alot, this is one way of doing it. And 2 how do you protect a defense you don't trust or under performs in certain situations? By limiting their time on the field. I think this offense would be lethal with a good, consistent running game.

 

 

 

Edited February 4, 2023 by LOVEMESOMEBILLS

[wppete]

At this point I really feel McDermott is wasting Josh prime years. Someone a week or two ago started a thread about McDermott not having a killer instinct. I agree with that, he is a passive person with tempered emotions. Got to have a killer instinct with a QB like Josh. Need to destroy teams and intimate. McDermott isn’t that guy. IMHO. 

[Billsfan1972]

1 hour ago, JROC INTEL said:

I think it’s possible with these coaches, but a lot less likely. I was all for keeping all the coaches, because I believe in learning and growth along with stability. But this year has shown that maybe there is a cap to the ability to learn. I see a lot of the same mistakes over and over. Example: tossing a 30 yard pass on 3rd and 2. This is bad coaching. Hardly using any trick plays. This is coaching. 
 

i still think we have one of the best teams in the NFL but most of it is because of Josh. 
 

I believe we need a more physical team over coaching though, specifically linemen. At the end of the days, the players didn’t play well enough. 
 

the loss is on everyone. It was hard to watch, but we are still close, the mentality needs to be to get back to work and take the extra step. Get in the weight room. 

While I agree that 3rd and 2 was stupid, unless that were going for it regardless on fourth down.  Add to that it was a perfect pass and surprise surprise Davis dropped it. If he had caught it that would have been the second contested catch all year (yes he had one vs Pitt).

 

I however keep going on about first in 10 at the Cincinnati 39-yard line and three plays that went nowhere where the Bills needed at least a field goal at a crucial time.  5 yards and Bass is in range.

 

As bad as the Bills were, momentum, the crowd, some adjustments and the second half kick and the game could have changed. We've seen this before usually from other teams (again twice from my memory in the McD era, vs. TB a loss, and vs. Baltimore this year).

[OldTimer1960]

It is very hard to win championships and that involves some level of luck (avoidance of bad breaks, injuries, bad calls, etc).  Every team should strive to win a championship, but really all any organization can do is put together the best possible team they can and compete.  Having the most talented team or the best coach is often not enough.  Some (much?) of the disappointment in the Bills this year is related to the false belief that they clearly had more talent than any other team and therefore, it must be that someone f*cked up because they failed to win it all.

 

I believe that the Bills are currently in the top group of organizations in terms of how well they are run.  Are they perfect?  Of course not, but neither is any other team.  I think it would be a major mistake to get rid of Brandon Beane or Sean McDermott.  The Bills are competing at the level of the very top teams right now.  

[Chaos]

4 minutes ago, wppete said:

At this point I really feel McDermott is wasting Josh prime years. Someone a week or two ago started a thread about McDermott not having a killer instinct. I agree with that, he is a passive person with tempered emotions. Got to have a killer instinct with a QB like Josh. Need to destroy teams and intimate. McDermott isn’t that guy. IMHO. 

People will have hard time understanding a tennis to football analogy.  But the Bills defense is like a great baseline player who can out rally most opponents but can't ever beat the top serve and volley guys. 

1 minute ago, OldTimer1960 said:

It is very hard to win championships and that involves some level of luck (avoidance of bad breaks, injuries, bad calls, etc).  Every team should strive to win a championship, but really all any organization can do is put together the best possible team they can and compete.  Having the most talented team or the best coach is often not enough.  Some (much?) of the disappointment in the Bills this year is related to the false belief that they clearly had more talent than any other team and therefore, it must be that someone f*cked up because they failed to win it all.

 

I believe that the Bills are currently in the top group of organizations in terms of how well they are run.  Are they perfect?  Of course not, but neither is any other team.  I think it would be a major mistake to get rid of Brandon Beane or Sean McDermott.  The Bills are competing at the level of the very top teams right now.  

The are definitely a consistent top 25% of the league team. 

[Mango]

I am really frustrated with Beane and have been for a few seasons now. 
 

But Christ, if the Pegula run Sabres have taught us anything it’s that things can always get worse. 
 

I give Beane an opportunity to figure it out before moving on. That is if the staff makes it through this season without the roster imploding, which I think is non-zero chance unfortunately. 

[JohnNord]

I don’t see the Bills wasting Josh Allen’s talent.  They do need to give him him more on offense.  This season the Bills showed a lot of faith in Davis, McKenzie, and Brown - you can argue all three didn’t step.  On the OL they let Kromer talk them into signing Pro Bowl guard Rodger Saffold and he…sucked.  Then you had Jameson Crowder who was injured for most of the season.  
 

Pretty confident they don’t make the same mistake twice 

[Billsfan1972]

The Bills have a generational quarterback and they babied him from day one. They gave him no help the first two years and he went 28 games before his first 300-yard passing one. Show me any quarterback that went that long without a 300-yard game.  This was Josh freaking Allen.....  To me they could have worked on issues earlier.

 

Sorry this was a shiny new toy that should have been played with and built around day one. But let's not forget who the choice was to start the 2018 season it was Nathan Peterman.

Edited February 4, 2023 by Billsfan1972

[GunnerBill]

I don't recognise any of the above. 

 

Still in with a realistic chance of winning championships

 

is where I'd put myself. There are too many factors that go into it for me to say "on the way to winning Championships".