Should the Bills switch to a 3-4 defense?

[Mr. WEO]

they should switch to the 5-6-5 Defense just for the playoffs each year

[Chaos]

12 minutes ago, RichRiderBills said:

I feel this defense is fine to build on. Just need to tweak some items. Adjustments. We have to stop tackling high and need a few more studs in the secondary. Obviously, we need the D-line, Miller and Jones back and tweak a couple players to get more of a consistent rush. 

 

If we had an elite penetrating DT this defense would be amazing.

 

Whatever happened versus the Bengals was a shame. I don't have an explanation for the game. Neither the poor call to give such soft cushion in coverage or why our Dline got no push against a weak OL. I felt like our players struggled for footing in the snow, whereas the Bengals did not, a fact that still mystifies me.

 

Frankly, offense has to stop turning the ball over. That puts a lot on the Defense. 

zero turnovers against the Bengals until long after the defense had lost the game. 

[4th&long]

You run the D to fit your players. You don’t try to run a your scheme and try to make your players fit it. 
 

now this D is softer than a pillow but I don’t know if that means changing to a 3-4 is the answer?

[Chaos]

2 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

they should switch to the 5-6-5 Defense just for the playoffs each year

Will the back 11 give a 10 yard cushion on third and five? 

[atlbillsfan1975]

The defense relies heavily on skill and less so on scheme. The Bills rarely come out of Nickel…they mix up sending a backer and dropping a lineman or sending an additional man on a blitz…but for the most part it’s about the “Jimmy’s and Joe’s”. I fear McD’s loyalty to someone he loves and respects will cloud his judgement on what is necessary to keep the D elite. Plus it is McD’s Defense, what would be great is to find a cord who uses the 4-3/Nickel a lot but also mixes up into different formations to confuse Offenses. 

[somnus00]

This conversation has some real 2003 vibes. I'm getting terrible flashbacks of the early drought years. 

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

Switch to a 3-4? They won’t take the nickel off the field on 2nd and 1. This team is calling the same defense every down like it’s preseason and just wondering why it can’t stop Burrow and Mahomes

[SoCal Deek]

2 minutes ago, Chaos said:

zero turnovers against the Bengals until long after the defense had lost the game. 

I am no fan of Frazier’s defense, but the Bills offense had an awful lot to do with the loss to the Bengals. The game was 17-10 deep into the third quarter. The Bills aren’t built to win a defensive struggle with anyone. They’re built to outscore them. 

[bmur66]

15 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

they should switch to the 5-6-5 Defense just for the playoffs each year

That may allow them to get some pressure on the QB.

[Mr. WEO]

Just now, bmur66 said:

That may allow them to get some pressure on the QB.

 

that would be the 11-1-4 D

[Chaos]

13 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I am no fan of Frazier’s defense, but the Bills offense had an awful lot to do with the loss to the Bengals. The game was 17-10 deep into the third quarter. The Bills aren’t built to win a defensive struggle with anyone. They’re built to outscore them. 

I will clear this up for you.  The defense cost us any chance to win the game. 

[Nextmanup]

3 hours ago, Tipster19 said:

Between the players we have and the players that we’ll have coming up for new contracts it may be time to change the defensive philosophy. I also think that replacing and/or adding new players will be easier and cheaper to do. Looking at the current roster we already have plenty of the pieces in house. Adding more LBers will be needed but once again they should be pretty easy to find, especially in the draft where 4th and 5th rders can provide great replacements.

You must not pay a lot of attention to McDermott as a human being if you think he's going to radically change how he does things from one year to the next.

 

He's the most conservative man you'll ever meet, and I'd wager good money he thinks evolution is a hoax.

 

He ain't changing crap!  Don't think 3-4 is the answer, regardless, but it could have been an interesting conversation to a degree, if there was any chance of any change happening.

 

 

[NewEra]

2 hours ago, BarleyNY said:

What players do you think would fit better in a 3-4? I’ve got two maybes in Oliver and Edmunds. Oliver is on his 5th year option and Edmunds is an FA. So right now we have 1 excellent LB under contract in Milano. But we don’t have another one that’s even starting level. 

 

Since we do not actually play a 4-3 - we play almost exclusively Nickel - why incorporate a 3-4 at all? when would we even want to put that on the field?

Not saying that we should switch, but Baltimore played a 3-4 vs Cinci in the playoffs for the entire game.
 

Any scheme will work with the proper game plan, coaching and execution.  Our problem in season ending games has been a combination of all 3.  
 

I would’ve liked to make the switch IF we could’ve brought in Fangio.  He’s the best defensive mind in the league imo.  Now he’s the enemy.  Good chance he’s going to take Dorsey to school next season. 

15 minutes ago, Chaos said:

I will clear this up for you.  The defense cost us any chance to win the game. 

And the offense?

[pennstate10]

2 hours ago, Tipster19 said:

Utilize Rosseau, Lawson and Phillips as DEs, Von and Milano as outside LBs with Benford as a ILB. Draft a hog for DT and a couple of more LBs as well. We play nickel mostly so we have plenty of DBs for the system.

205 lb CB at ILB in a 3-4. 
 

Bold move Cotton.

[Nextmanup]

35 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

they should switch to the 5-6-5 Defense just for the playoffs each year

I have seriously thought about getting rid of linebackers entirely, at least on a lot of plays.

 

The concept of a "linebacker" is outdated in today's game.

 

You need 2 kinds of guys out there: huge bodies on the line and who can get after the QB.

The rest should be speedy guys with size/strength to tackle (all NFL players have that anyway)...and who can zip around covering receivers.

 

What's with this in-between guy called a LB who isn't really big enough to pass rush or stuff the line, but not really fast enough to drop into pass coverage?  

 

On some plays, OK, put a few out there but most of the time I think I wouldn't use any!

 

 

[PBF81]

1 hour ago, The Wiz said:

The reason for that is because they have not tried to get a 3rd starting caliber LB because they don't play in a base 4-3.  They play in nickel as their primary defense.  As I already stated.  Why would they waste a pick on another starting LB when they don't play 4-3?

 

Who have they even tried to draft to add as something other than LB depth behind Milano and Edmunds?  

 

Well, the only problem with that line of reasoning is that they did play a base 4-3 a couple of years ago, but were forced to abandon it because we had no capable LBs to fill those roles, particularly with Edmunds OJT-ing it and Milano primarily a pass-defending LB until late last and this seasons.  

 

Beane's drafting has led to poor day 1 and day 2 results.  When you constantly have overlay your prior draft picks with picks at the same positions, you have no choice but to neglect other unit needs.  

[IndyMark]

3 hours ago, BarleyNY said:

What players do you think would fit better in a 3-4? I’ve got two maybes in Oliver and Edmunds.

 

 

So Ed as an OLB?  Interesting.  I actually think they should try Ed as a FB like the Ravens do.

 

But beyond that Ed is not a fit along the DL for a 3 -4 at all. Way way too small and delicate for the NT.....not long enough for the DE. 

 

I could see exploring the OLB with him, but I think it would quickly come to light how limited he is outside of a 3DT with a huge 1DT teammate.

 

 

[frostbitmic]

58 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

they should switch to the 5-6-5 Defense just for the playoffs each year

I'm a big fan of the 16 man defense if you can get away with it.

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, Nextmanup said:

I have seriously thought about getting rid of linebackers entirely, at least on a lot of plays.

 

The concept of a "linebacker" is outdated in today's game.

 

You need 2 kinds of guys out there: huge bodies on the line and who can get after the QB.

The rest should be speedy guys with size/strength to tackle (all NFL players have that anyway)...and who can zip around covering receivers.

 

What's with this in-between guy called a LB who isn't really big enough to pass rush or stuff the line, but not really fast enough to drop into pass coverage?  

 

On some plays, OK, put a few out there but most of the time I think I wouldn't use any!

 

 

 

nah

[Ethan in Cleveland]

We play a 4 down lineman alignment with nickel almost exclusively.  Even 3-4 teams go with 4 DL when they play nickel. And when reams only rush 3 and drop 8 in very long yard to gain situations they aren't using a NT in that 3 DL pass rush. 

So no. A true NT is about as useless as a FB in modern NFL. Almost no college team plays with a NT so it would take quite a bit of time to develop. 

Oliver is not big enough to play a 3-4 DE but he could rush from the outside most likely. Lawson could maybe play a 3-4 DE. But Rousseau is strictly a 4-3 DE so you would be sacrificing one of the better young players on defense.

So the answer is no. Bad idea. Its perfectly fine to rush 3 and drop 8 a couple times a game but the base defense should never be a 3-4.