thenorthremembers Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 Absolute horse crap. I've never been so broke. Between my student loans, gas prices, food prices and the unfortunate status of being upper middle class, this country has nothing for me. 1
Joe Ferguson forever Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 5 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said: Absolute horse crap. I've never been so broke. Between my student loans, gas prices, food prices and the unfortunate status of being upper middle class, this country has nothing for me. I get it. Lots of people in your shoes. Especially young people. But what is the fix? I found this joke tho The barman says to the customer 'Sorry, I've got to change the barrel' and disappears into the back. Whilst he's waiting the man notices a bowl of peanuts on the side and goes to take a handful. Just as he's about to grab them the peanuts suddenly start to speak, 'You're a handsome chap! Have you lost a bit of weight recently! You are quite the catch - any woman would be lucky to have you!' The man regarded the peanuts oddly but shook his head and left the bar area in search of a packet of smokes. Located in the corner of the pub was a coin operated cigarette machine. The man reached into his pocket grabbed his change and was about to put his first coin when suddenly the cigarette machine started to speak, 'wow! You've had a hard life! Gained a bit of weight? Few extra grey hairs on your head....welcome to middle age pal! You do not wear it well'! The man was understandably shocked and backed away to the bar where his pint was now being prepared. The customer turned to the bar and said, 'What the hell is going on?!?? That bowl of peanuts said I've lost weight and look good for my age whilst that cigarette machine said I was fat and middle aged!' The barman said. 'I do apologise sir! The peanuts are complementary but the cigarette machines out of order'!!!! 1
John from Riverside Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 1 hour ago, BillStime said: Look at McCarthy in Syracuse… Are the Republicans pretty much all trying to do that they’re voting against things that help the people and then they’re going home to the states and talking about how much work they did for them while they voted against the bill? Rinse and repeat, rinse and repeat
The Frankish Reich Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 6 hours ago, TSOL said: Elections are a fundamental core of democracy, you don't cancel elections. That might not make sense to a liberal, we all know how you guys try to cancel things that don't suit your agenda Sorry, but that's just silly. Ukraine is being bombed relentlessly. It is literally impossible to conduct any kind of election in large parts of the country. They have been invaded. They're going to set up polling station in the Donbas? And if they had elections without polling that part of the country, would those elections be considered legitimate, having excluded nearly every Ukrainian citizen who has pro-Russian allegiances? There was talk of postponing the NYC mayoral transition (remember America's Mayor? ahh, what an innocent age) after 9/11, and that was for a horrific attack but one that immediately impacted a few square blocks of a massive 5 borough city. In the end it wasn't necessary, but I don't recall anyone thinking that it was an outrageous suggestion. 1
The Frankish Reich Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 3 hours ago, thenorthremembers said: and the unfortunate status of being upper middle class Well ... ... I don't know how old you are. I suspect quite a bit younger than me. I spent a lot of time in school. Probably did at least one more degree than was really necessary. Didn't own a home until my late 30s. Then finally began to accumulate enough to pay off those loans, which weren't paid off until I was over 50. But they really weren't burdensome by that time. It takes time. I hear a lot of millennial and Gen Z types talking about how hard it is to buy a home now. True. But not exactly a new thing, depending on where you live. Hard where I lived for sure, in the SF Bay Area. Not so hard when I moved to Colorado at that time. Really not hard at all in WNY. Upper middle class does mean more taxes. But it also means you're probably not ever moving down the economic ladder. And the normal thing is you're economic security won't peak until you're at least in your 50s. Patience and a bit of delayed gratification were lessons I learned just in time. 1
TSOL Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 6 hours ago, The Frankish Reich said: Sorry, but that's just silly. Ukraine is being bombed relentlessly. It is literally impossible to conduct any kind of election in large parts of the country. They have been invaded. They're going to set up polling station in the Donbas? And if they had elections without polling that part of the country, would those elections be considered legitimate, having excluded nearly every Ukrainian citizen who has pro-Russian allegiances? There was talk of postponing the NYC mayoral transition (remember America's Mayor? ahh, what an innocent age) after 9/11, and that was for a horrific attack but one that immediately impacted a few square blocks of a massive 5 borough city. In the end it wasn't necessary, but I don't recall anyone thinking that it was an outrageous suggestion. Elections are a fundamental core, a foundational building block of true democracy. If they could hold elections in the revolutionary war, and the civil war, they could hold elections in Ukraine. To suggest otherwise is weak and cowardly. The leftist posters on here, including you cite the Ukraine war as being a fight for for democracy, well fight for democracy then. Don't half a$$ it only when it suits your narrative. I honestly find your comment pathetically poorly formed. 1
SoCal Deek Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 8 hours ago, The Frankish Reich said: Well ... ... I don't know how old you are. I suspect quite a bit younger than me. I spent a lot of time in school. Probably did at least one more degree than was really necessary. Didn't own a home until my late 30s. Then finally began to accumulate enough to pay off those loans, which weren't paid off until I was over 50. But they really weren't burdensome by that time. It takes time. I hear a lot of millennial and Gen Z types talking about how hard it is to buy a home now. True. But not exactly a new thing, depending on where you live. Hard where I lived for sure, in the SF Bay Area. Not so hard when I moved to Colorado at that time. Really not hard at all in WNY. Upper middle class does mean more taxes. But it also means you're probably not ever moving down the economic ladder. And the normal thing is you're economic security won't peak until you're at least in your 50s. Patience and a bit of delayed gratification were lessons I learned just in time. As is often the case, I agree Frank. But I would add the advice that he should get out of debt as fast as possible. Make some sacrifices early in life, but not so many as to be miserable. It’ll pay huge dividends later in life. 1
Tommy Callahan Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 Just now, ALF said: For those on SS and renters not so good. add the working class, homeowners with interest rates rising, middle class. the only ones doing good is the investor class. 1
SoCal Deek Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 34 minutes ago, Chris farley said: add the working class, homeowners with interest rates rising, middle class. the only ones doing good is the investor class. I disagree. The stock market has been going nowhere since Biden took office. Up, down, up, down, up, down. 1
Tommy Callahan Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 Just now, SoCal Deek said: I disagree. The stock market has been going nowhere since Biden took office. Up, down, up, down, up, down. OK, for the ones that invested in this administration.
The Frankish Reich Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 1 minute ago, SoCal Deek said: I disagree. The stock market has been going nowhere since Biden took office. Up, down, up, down, up, down. S&P 500 up 14.7% since Biden was inaugurated. More proof that perceptions are out of step with reality. 1
SoCal Deek Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 Just now, The Frankish Reich said: S&P 500 up 14.7% since Biden was inaugurated. More proof that perceptions are out of step with reality. That’s true but only if looked at in a vacuum. It should be doing way way better coming out of a pandemic. I wouldn't call less than 5% per year a roaring performance. 1
Tommy Callahan Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 2 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said: S&P 500 up 14.7% since Biden was inaugurated. More proof that perceptions are out of step with reality. yup. the group that bought this administration. the majority of corporations not in the fortune 500 and are not feeling that love from the state stimies. But most of those public companies are controlled by BlackRock/vanguard. And I guess that's good for all of our 401K and investments. .
The Frankish Reich Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 Just now, SoCal Deek said: That’s true but only if looked at in a vacuum. It should be doing way way better coming out of a pandemic. I wouldn't call less than 5% per year a roaring performance. It's a good, solid return for people with a medium to long-range time horizon. The problem, of course, is that the markets were on a sugar high during peak COVID as the Fed held interest rates near zero, continued to pump the money supply, and Congress and the White House (both occupants of it) went on a spending spree, dumping huge amounts of money into the economy. Without those interventions we would have seen a significant market decline in 2020 and 2021, no doubt followed by a bigger rebound in 2022 and 2023. Just now, Chris farley said: And I guess that's good for all of our 401K and investments. I guess it's good to make money, although you seem a bit unsure of that ... Where's the eyeroll emoji you use all the time? 1
SoCal Deek Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 1 minute ago, The Frankish Reich said: It's a good, solid return for people with a medium to long-range time horizon. The problem, of course, is that the markets were on a sugar high during peak COVID as the Fed held interest rates near zero, continued to pump the money supply, and Congress and the White House (both occupants of it) went on a spending spree, dumping huge amounts of money into the economy. Without those interventions we would have seen a significant market decline in 2020 and 2021, no doubt followed by a bigger rebound in 2022 and 2023. That’s also true. But you can always say it could’ve been worse, or it could’ve been better. My point was that the ‘investor class’ (of which I’m one) have not had fair sailing over the last few years. Saying that they have is just another low-hanging talking point by those thinking “somebody else must be making all the money, right?”.
The Frankish Reich Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 Just now, SoCal Deek said: That’s also true. But you can always say it could’ve been worse, or it could’ve been better. My point was that the ‘investor class’ (of which I’m one) have not had fair sailing over the last few years. Saying that they have is just another low-hanging talking point by those thinking “somebody else must be making all the money, right?”. The investor class has had it easy. Agreed. The powers that be, both elected (Congress/White House) and "deep state" (the Fed) did not want to see the kind of market collapse that probably should have accompanied a pandemic that caused a severe fall in output. So all those interventions protected - overprotected in my mind - the investors, in an attempt to avoid the harm of an actual depression. We can and should debate whether it was too much and whether the spoils of those interventions were equitably distributed. But the bottom line is we did emerge in relatively good shape economically. That doesn't mean we just say everything is awesome and stop worrying about deficits and inflation and interest rates. But still: relatively good shape. 1
Tommy Callahan Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 6 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: That’s also true. But you can always say it could’ve been worse, or it could’ve been better. My point was that the ‘investor class’ (of which I’m one) have not had fair sailing over the last few years. Saying that they have is just another low-hanging talking point by those thinking “somebody else must be making all the money, right?”. OK, I should have said investor groups. Notice how hard it is to find current income inequality metrics. 1
SoCal Deek Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 7 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said: The investor class has had it easy. Agreed. The powers that be, both elected (Congress/White House) and "deep state" (the Fed) did not want to see the kind of market collapse that probably should have accompanied a pandemic that caused a severe fall in output. So all those interventions protected - overprotected in my mind - the investors, in an attempt to avoid the harm of an actual depression. We can and should debate whether it was too much and whether the spoils of those interventions were equitably distributed. But the bottom line is we did emerge in relatively good shape economically. That doesn't mean we just say everything is awesome and stop worrying about deficits and inflation and interest rates. But still: relatively good shape. So we’ve gone from ‘having it easy’ all the way down to being in ‘relatively good shape’ in the span of a single paragraph? 😉 As usual, we agree on. A lot of it. Especially on the interest rate part. I long advocated for the Fed to slowly increase rates. Mostly so they’d have someplace to take them if the economy hit a rough patch…which I consider a global pandemic to be pretty rough. 1
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