Chad Hall interviewing with Ravens OC Position

[Donuts and Doritos]

Who has he developed that wasn't already great? Diggs, Beasley, Brown, Sanders were already established players prior to his coaching them. Davis is a 54% career catch rate who can only run 3 routes per several CBs we've played & clearly was not the WR2. McKenzie really hasn't progressed. Shakir didn't do much this year. Isaiah Hodgins never really played. Saying all the WR are crap but the WR Coach is awesome seems like saying "he's the best leader of a failed unit". We fired our Safeties coach & his group was so decimated by injuries he had to play 5th stringers. So who has he developed? What WR2, slot WR has he produced for us? Are you satisfied with the WR group? What makes everyone think he's so good other than the players like him (Josh likes Dorsey, & I'm not convinced he's very good)?

 

Edited February 1, 2023 by Donuts and Doritos

[GunnerBill]

58 minutes ago, Donuts and Doritos said:

Who has he developed that wasn't already great? Diggs, Beasley, Brown, Sanders were already established players prior to his coaching them. 

 

 

Diggs, Beas and Brown all had career years being coached by him. And you might have a lower opinion of Gabe Davis than some, but his production through 3 years for a 4th round draft pick is pretty impressive. Now whether he is good enough to be a true #2 is a different question but that comes down to some of the limitations on his talent not necessarily the coaching. 

 

The guys I speak to from the draft community who are connected in the league all say Hall is widely respected as an excellent young coach who will be an OC very soon. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

7 hours ago, BringBackFergy said:

Sources: If Hall gets the job in Baltimore,  Kelvin Benjamin is a likely replacement as Bills WR Coach. 

'Sources'?!  More like 'souses'! 🤨

[thenorthremembers]

2 hours ago, Bad Things said:

Just wondering why everyone seems to love this guy. Where are you getting information to show that he's so good?  Not saying he's not, just wondering. 

I know the WRs like him, but what else have you all heard/read that make you like him so much?

I'd say the proof is in him getting an OC interview with an incredibly respected and smart franchise despite only being a WR coach and having no oc experience at any level of football.

[Donuts and Doritos]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Diggs, Beas and Brown all had career years being coached by him. And you might have a lower opinion of Gabe Davis than some, but his production through 3 years for a 4th round draft pick is pretty impressive. Now whether he is good enough to be a true #2 is a different question but that comes down to some of the limitations on his talent not necessarily the coaching. 

 

The guys I speak to from the draft community who are connected in the league all say Hall is widely respected as an excellent young coach who will be an OC very soon. 

 

Interesting points & I don't disagree that we need a talent upgrade in the WR room. However, Diggs, Beas & Brown all had career years when they upgraded to Allen as their QB. They were established players prior to being here. What exactly did Hall change about their games that brought that out or was it simply a product of the upgrade to Allen as QB?  Davis was expected by the Bills to be the #2 this year, he wasn't, (was Hall consulted on that decision? maybe), he had the second lowest catch % in the entire NFL this year and has a 55.3% career catch %, that's not my opinion, it's just facts. Davis may have been a 4 round pick but Diggs was a 5th. I'm sure Hall is a fine coach, but the WR unit underperformed expectations. (Tied for 2nd in the league in drops). I'm curious who he's really developed? Do we really think he's developed Davis, McKenzie, Shakir, Hodgins into consistent WRs for us? It seems like all our talent over his tenure has come from imports of established guys. So what drafted players has he brought along to being a consistent top 3 WR on our team? In the end I'm not saying he's a bad coach or that we shouldn't keep him, I'm just not sure that if he gets the OC gig, we're going to notice a big drop off in play.

 

https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/who-has-the-lowest-catch-percentage-among-wide-receivers

 

https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/what-is-gabriel-davis-catch-percentage-career#:~:text=Gabe Davis has caught 55.3 percent of targets in his career.

 

https://scores.nbcsports.com/fb/tmleaders.asp?type=Receiving&range=NFL&rank=232

 

 

Edited February 1, 2023 by Donuts and Doritos

[GunnerBill]

19 minutes ago, Donuts and Doritos said:

 

Interesting points & I don't disagree that we need a talent upgrade in the WR room. However, Diggs, Beas & Brown all had career years when they upgraded to Allen as their QB. They were established players prior to being here. What exactly did Hall change about their games that brought that out or was it simply a product of the upgrade to Allen as QB?  Davis was expected by the Bills to be the #2 this year, he wasn't, (was Hall consulted on that decision? maybe), he had the second lowest catch % in the entire NFL this year and has a 55.3% career catch %, that's not my opinion, it's just facts. Davis may have been a 4 round pick but Diggs was a 5th. I'm sure Hall is a fine coach, but the WR unit underperformed expectations. (Tied for 2nd in the league in drops). I'm curious who he's really developed? Do we really think he's developed Davis, McKenzie, Shakir, Hodgins into consistent WRs for us? It seems like all our talent over his tenure has come from imports of established guys. So what drafted players has he brought along to being a consistent top 3 WR on our team? In the end I'm not saying he's a bad coach or that we shouldn't keep him, I'm just not sure that if he gets the OC gig, we're going to notice a big drop off in play.

 

https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/who-has-the-lowest-catch-percentage-among-wide-receivers

 

https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/what-is-gabriel-davis-catch-percentage-career#:~:text=Gabe Davis has caught 55.3 percent of targets in his career.

 

https://scores.nbcsports.com/fb/tmleaders.asp?type=Receiving&range=NFL&rank=232

 

Yes I think he has developed Davis from a 4th round talent to a legitimate NFL receiver. He posted #2 numbers he just wasn't the high end #2 receiver we hoped for in 2022. One of the areas where he has undoubtedly developed his game from college is his release off the line. It was a weakness coming into the NFL and I'd almost now have it as a strength of his game. 

 

Shakir definitely developed during the year too. The numbers might not show it but early on he had a real issue separating from coverage. I think it began to click for him down the stretch and I am optimistic about year 2 for him. 

 

If you are asking why have none of the Bills drafted WRs turned into stars the answer is because Davis (round 4) and Shakir (round 5) are the highest drafted receivers during Brandon Beane's GMship. They have turned a 4th round pick into a mid to low end #2 receiver. That is a good thing. Expecting him to make stars out of the guys they have picked isn't a fair assessment. 

 

And McKenzie also had a career year under Hall. You are right.... Diggs, Brown, Beasley all benefitted from playing with Josh Allen. How much impact the coach has is hard to pin down, I grant you... but when receivers consistently have career years playing for a receiver coach you have to suggest that guy knows at least something of what he is doing. Unless what you are saying is for any established player it is only ever QB and not coach.... which if that is your position well there is a question about the extent to which you will ever think any WR coach is good, right?

 

As for the WR room underperforming expectations... they didn't really underperform mine. A lot of us were talking about our concerns for this receiver room in the pre-season. They had Diggs and Davis as the only two viable outside guys and a career gadget guy, an often hurt vet and a raw rookie in the mix at slot and not much else. I think Davis came right in at about my prediction (850 yards and 7 touchdowns) and McKenzie a little bit behind (had him about 500 and 5). I am more confident that we have the right coach in that room than I am that we have the right pieces. 

[Mr. WEO]

that team is going nowhere

[Dr Divit]

Don't blame him,   there are shelf limit with working for McDumass.    Brian Daboll couldn't take it anymore.    McDumass is good guy,  a great builder of team & culture, but an average coach.  McDummas is a choker who's stuck in 20001,  he does have what it takes to compete in today's NFL.

 

 

[Donuts and Doritos]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yes I think he has developed Davis from a 4th round talent to a legitimate NFL receiver. He posted #2 numbers he just wasn't the high end #2 receiver we hoped for in 2022. One of the areas where he has undoubtedly developed his game from college is his release off the line. It was a weakness coming into the NFL and I'd almost now have it as a strength of his game. 

 

Shakir definitely developed during the year too. The numbers might not show it but early on he had a real issue separating from coverage. I think it began to click for him down the stretch and I am optimistic about year 2 for him. 

 

If you are asking why have none of the Bills drafted WRs turned into stars the answer is because Davis (round 4) and Shakir (round 5) are the highest drafted receivers during Brandon Beane's GMship. They have turned a 4th round pick into a mid to low end #2 receiver. That is a good thing. Expecting him to make stars out of the guys they have picked isn't a fair assessment. 

 

And McKenzie also had a career year under Hall. You are right.... Diggs, Brown, Beasley all benefitted from playing with Josh Allen. How much impact the coach has is hard to pin down, I grant you... but when receivers consistently have career years playing for a receiver coach you have to suggest that guy knows at least something of what he is doing. Unless what you are saying is for any established player it is only ever QB and not coach.... which if that is your position well there is a question about the extent to which you will ever think any WR coach is good, right?

 

As for the WR room underperforming expectations... they didn't really underperform mine. A lot of us were talking about our concerns for this receiver room in the pre-season. They had Diggs and Davis as the only two viable outside guys and a career gadget guy, an often hurt vet and a raw rookie in the mix at slot and not much else. I think Davis came right in at about my prediction (850 yards and 7 touchdowns) and McKenzie a little bit behind (had him about 500 and 5). I am more confident that we have the right coach in that room than I am that we have the right pieces. 

 

Solid points all the way around. Thanks.

[SoCal Deek]

I’ve never put much stock in a WR coach. When the ball comes to you….catch it. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

22 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I’ve never put much stock in a WR coach. When the ball comes to you….catch it. 

Ok...if Hall bolts, how much you want?

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

Ok...if Hall bolts, how much you want?

 

Sounds like his class room sessions will be over quickly..... "right fellas, catch the ball...... okay, who's for a beer?"

[NoHuddleKelly12]

1 hour ago, Dr Divit said:

Don't blame him,   there are shelf limit with working for McDumass.    Brian Daboll couldn't take it anymore.    McDumass is good guy,  a great builder of team & culture, but an average coach.  McDummas is a choker who's stuck in 20001,  he does have what it takes to compete in today's NFL.

 

 

I think there’s one or 2 other franchises out there who would jump at the chance to have his win %…

 

Dont get me wrong, I believe changes to his staff are in order, but to say it’s time to let go of McD is still a bridge too far imho. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

11 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Sounds like his class room sessions will be over quickly..... "right fellas, catch the ball...... okay, who's for a beer?"

And a Watney's 'Red Barrel', to boot! 😁

🎵Torremolinas, torremolinas!🎶

[Beck Water]

3 hours ago, thenorthremembers said:

I'd say the proof is in him getting an OC interview with an incredibly respected and smart franchise despite only being a WR coach and having no oc experience at any level of football.

 

Then there's this

https://billswire.usatoday.com/2022/01/31/buffalo-bills-interview-baltimore-ravens-tee-martin-offensive-coordinator/

 

The Bills interviewed the Ravens WR coach Tee Martin for their OC position last year.  Beane said something about "we'll pick his brains, see how it goes".

 

It could mean the Ravens want to return the favor.

 

Seattle QB coach David Canales is scheduled for a 2nd interview

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/other/new-ravens-coach-dave-canales-to-meet-with-baltimore-again-for-oc-job/ar-AA16ZBgB

Edited February 1, 2023 by Beck Water

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

2 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Then there's this

https://billswire.usatoday.com/2022/01/31/buffalo-bills-interview-baltimore-ravens-tee-martin-offensive-coordinator/

 

The Bills interviewed the Ravens WR coach Tee Martin for their OC position last year.  Beane said something about "we'll pick his brains, see how it goes".

 

It could mean the Ravens want to return the favor.

'We'll pick his brains' is probably NFL code for "see if the candidate fits our  level of disfunctionality".  This holds true for all 32 teams.

[mabden]

16 hours ago, boyst said:

Good interview. Not ready for it yet though. I like this dude. He will fail with that offense 

 

As OC he can install any offense he likes.  Although it may take some time to purge Roman's stench.

[DasNootz]

Chad Kelly too?

[boyst]

26 minutes ago, mabden said:

 

As OC he can install any offense he likes.  Although it may take some time to purge Roman's stench.

Roman wasn't and isn't a bad OC. He's never had talent on the roster.

[Buffalo Bills Fan]

6 minutes ago, boyst said:

Roman wasn't and isn't a bad OC. He's never had talent on the roster.

Roman passing game, play calling might be one of the worst. But his running game is one of the best. Only want him as a running game coordinator coach or something like that. Really want him here only for that. Study Roman really well and long time. Same issues with the other teams along here.

Edited February 1, 2023 by Buffalo Bills Fan