Perhaps Kromer is overrated as an OLine coach?

[jlgarsh]

49 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

I will say that part…PART… of this true.  At times Allen does need to be better with decision making.  Especially when to take the man underneath rather than going for the high percentage shot.  But it’s a balancing act that I’m hope he figured out soon.  
 

Also, yes Allen does leave a clean pocket at times to set up some crazy scramble plays.  
 

BUT…. The offensive line was not very good. At best they were average…at worst they were in the bottom of the league.  
 

Dawkins had a pretty average year and it’s fair to expect more of him.  Morse and Bates were ok when it came to pass protection - not as good with run blocking and moving people.  
 

Roger Saffold was horrible and will be replaced and I don’t think Spencer Brown is a starting caliber RT.  I’m hoping the Bills find a replacement there too.  
 

Either way, the line was the weak part of the offense and it does need to improve 

I don’t know if Williams was better than Bates.  We’ve seen in the past that Bates can be a decent lineman.  Long term, I’d like an upgrade but he’s good enough to start next year.  The bigger issues are Saffold and Brown.  Both were terrible 

Bates was better at LG

[Mango]

I think depth of target is relevant per attempt and completion is relevant here. We are about a yard deeper across the board. Not insignificant.

Also weird, we are middling/decent in time to break down/pressure but have a low pressure per drop back but a really high scramble percentage. 

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2022/passing_advanced.htm

[MrEpsYtown]

44 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

But the fact remains the Bills identified this as a point of weakness and wanted to get better and they got worse...

 

Agreed. I thought it would a bit more impact than it did. 

7 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

Kromer has a history of having good OLs, including in his previous go around here. You can't live in reputation forever, but these players were brought in under Bobby Johnson's reign (who doesn't have the pedigree of Kromer), so player fit and skillset does become an issue...

 

 

 

 

Is he saying he didn't really prepare enough and now all of a sudden he will? 

[Back2Buff]

4 minutes ago, Mango said:

I think depth of target is relevant per attempt and completion is relevant here. We are about a yard deeper across the board. Not insignificant.

Also weird, we are middling/decent in time to break down/pressure but have a low pressure per drop back but a really high scramble percentage. 

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2022/passing_advanced.htm

 

Your QB has terrible pocket awareness.  That's what its saying.  But people will continue to blame the O line.  

 

For some reason, Allen can do no wrong on this board.

[Success]

I certainly had higher hopes going into the season. The last half of the season last year, this unit had really picked up and was starting to look solid. And it made all of the difference.

 

The regression is concerning.  But like Dorsey, it might just be a rookie year thing. 

 

[Jerome007]

1 hour ago, Back2Buff said:

We had a better running game and Allen held onto the ball longer in pocket. 

I fully agree on the first one. And AT LAST this year 3rd and one (or 4th) could be converted with a run up the gut instead of having to be creatove each time.

 

But Josh had a lot of crazy long lasting pockets in the last years that weren't there this year.

[Mango]

12 minutes ago, Back2Buff said:

 

Your QB has terrible pocket awareness.  That's what its saying.  But people will continue to blame the O line.  

 

For some reason, Allen can do no wrong on this board.

 

 

I think the answer is a little more complicated than that, but Allen is part of the conversation as well. I am not sure I would go as far as to say "terrible pocket presence" but I do get your point. He certainly holds the ball for too long. He also struggles reading zone defenses. His athleticism bails him, his OL, and his OC out of a number of decencies that they all have. 

[Green Lightning]

Our Oline has little to any push when you need a few yards. It's an average to below average bunch and Kromer can only do so much. 

[Gugny]

I think it's more likely that Beane may be overrated as a GM.

 

Bills had the Electric Company in the 70s.

 

Now they've got Cocoon 3.

[BrooklynBills]

1 hour ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I will say this, the Rams dudes regressed when he left there. But I think a lot of the credit for how strong our O line was in his previous stay needs to go to Greg Roman and his scheme.

But they were equally great when they switched full time to A. Lynn's running game which was different than Roman's.  Kromer is good. I doubt he forgot how to coach.  I think they are asking these guys to do stuff that is out of there skill set with going vertical so much.

[Buffalo Super Fan]

There all overrated in Buffalo Bills land Super Bowl champions in there own alternate reality ridiculous. Sean McDermott will never lead the Buffalo Bills to a Super Bowl championship he isn’t up to the job. To borrow a line from the Ric Flair the professional wrestler Sean McDermott isn’t a 60 minute man Sean McDermott is a 59 minutes and 47 seconds man in games. 
 

“Mr 13 seconds “ Sean McDermott worries about things he shouldn’t be worrying about and things he should be worrying about like coaching his team and game planning he is incapable of doing that. That is never changing with that overrated bum. Winning matters few are going to remember AFC East champions. We celebrate Super Bowl victories in this country. Sean McDermott whole staff of coaches aren’t good enough. Sean McDermott belongs in the educational department of a college not as a head football coach. I wouldn’t hire Sean McDermott for UB Bulls he would run the football program into the ground because incompetence. Maybe a History or English professor is where Sean McDermott is best suited same as Marv Levy. I don’t care if Marv Levy is in the Hall of Fame or not he was a mediocre head coach who couldn’t win the big game the Super Bowl.
 

The Buffalo Bills are on the same track with Sean McDermott just good enough to get the Bills beat in games. Fire the whole Bills coaching staff of mediocrity winners in there own alternate reality in my opinion. Go Bills! Let’s Go Buffalo 

[TheBrownBear]

1 hour ago, Big Turk said:

 

I mean 3 of the 5 are...

Yeah, probably our best collective offensive line since '88-'92!

[gordong]

don't need PFF to tell me everyone regressed...  saw it almost every week. for being some kind of guru...  he better make this line MUCH better... because what he did in 2022 was *****. 

 

[PrimeTime101]

Blame can be spread to a ton of coaches and not just one if you ask yourself the smart questions.

 

[TheBrownBear]

51 minutes ago, Mango said:

I think depth of target is relevant per attempt and completion is relevant here. We are about a yard deeper across the board. Not insignificant.

Also weird, we are middling/decent in time to break down/pressure but have a low pressure per drop back but a really high scramble percentage. 

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2022/passing_advanced.htm

I love Josh and agree that he's "the franchise" and any success we have starts and ends with him, but I think we need to be okay with acknowledging his faults and where he needs to improve.  Those stats tell me we have a guy who wasn't reading the field well in 2022, which led to lots of scrambling and happy feet.  Josh regressed as the season went along, at least compared to where he was in 2020 and the end of 2021.  I think he definitely missed Daboll.

[I'm Spartacus]

2 hours ago, H2o said:

The guy who brought everyone down was Saffold. Saffold is the leech here, sucking the life out of the rest of the OL with his ineptitude. Feliciano was better than him at LG and D. 

But....Saffold made the Pro Bowl!!!! 🤪

[Pirate Angel]

Some inventive "gimmicky" play calling to keep the defense honest wouldn't have hurt anything, maybe commit to the run. It's got to be hard to play the online when the defense knows to rush every play.

 

[Alphadawg7]

3 hours ago, Big Turk said:

Every OLineman regressed...

 

 

 

 

LMAO at PFF...Poll every GM and Coach in the NFL and Kromer is at or near the top of their list.  I will trust in that over anything PFF has to say.

 

Our OL wasn't very talented, and our OC was not very good at developing an offensive scheme or identity.  The OL coach has to coach within the offensive scheme and game plan that is being implemented with the personnel he is given.  

[Big Turk]

9 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

 

LMAO at PFF...Poll every GM and Coach in the NFL and Kromer is at or near the top of their list.  I will trust in that over anything PFF has to say.

 

Our OL wasn't very talented, and our OC was not very good at developing an offensive scheme or identity.  The OL coach has to coach within the offensive scheme and game plan that is being implemented with the personnel he is given.  

 

So working on preventing his lineman from missing their blocks completely way too often wasn't his domain?

 

Got it...

Edited January 31, 2023 by Big Turk

[T master]

I think Kromers history speaks for it self he has had good stops & bad stops some players liked him others have hated his guts but for the most part the guy knows what he's doing it could be that the offensive scheme didn't mesh with the blocking scheme who knows .

 

Plus i've read that in todays NFL being a passing league now with little to no running for the most part could be part of it because when he was here before with Shady in the back field the Bills had the number 1 run game which i wish was something that we had on this team is a better running game .

 

But times they are a changing . But i thought it was a good hire & hope he comes back next year to see if his blocking scheme can get better than this year . But not sure if it can if the run game is a after thought like it has been .

Edited January 31, 2023 by T master