With Oliver Value Goes Beyond the Stat Line

[3rdand12]

On 2/1/2023 at 7:25 PM, JohnNord said:

I just don’t think the Bills will re-sign him, so it does make you wonder if they could flip him for an asset.  
 

The problem with Oliver is that he can feast on bad lineman, but when he’s matched up against against a physical OL, it’s often way to easy to neutralize him.  While he can have splash plays, it often comes at the expense of an inferior talent.   

Star was terrible and one of the worst signings Brandon Beane has made.  I guess he was a good teammate and a culture guy but on the field he vastly underplayed his fat contract.  
 

When you watch DaQuan Jones this season, you realize how much bad we had it with Star

exactly my point. I am poor with sarcasm even though I use it quite often. Forgive me
Good thread from you btw  Thank you for keeping up with it !

On 2/1/2023 at 7:25 PM, JohnNord said:

I just don’t think the Bills will re-sign him, so it does make you wonder if they could flip him for an asset.  
 

The problem with Oliver is that he can feast on bad lineman, but when he’s matched up against against a physical OL, it’s often way to easy to neutralize him.  While he can have splash plays, it often comes at the expense of an inferior talent.   

Star was terrible and one of the worst signings Brandon Beane has made.  I guess he was a good teammate and a culture guy but on the field he vastly underplayed his fat contract.  
 

When you watch DaQuan Jones this season, you realize how much bad we had it with Star

PS I am really a D.Jones fan and like T Settle as well in the middle

On 2/1/2023 at 7:29 PM, Virgil said:

I can’t justify paying him the money he thinks he deserves.  He has strung together a full dominating season yet.  
 

I wouldn’t want the team to pay him on potential 

He thinks he deserves ? 

 What doe that mean? Linky ?
:)

[3rdand12]

21 hours ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

This thread is like chicken soup for the soul 

I have that book actually

[thenorthremembers]

I'd agree if he mainly played 1 Technig

On 1/27/2023 at 1:09 PM, Rich Stadium Original said:

Let me start right off that Oliver is not on a level with Williams, Jones, or Donald, but to judge his value solely by the stat line is misleading.

It is pretty common knowledge that Oliver played injured the last half of the season (as did most of the D line) where he saw a disproportional number of double teams than the rest of his linemates. In a Frasier defense, thats kind of the plan. Clog up the middle freeing up the LBs to make a tackle.

Unfortunately, your DE (insert whichever name you like) was routinely beat 1 on 1 by the opposing tackle or tight end, and the pulling lineman blew up your LB, which in most cases was Taron Johnson, resulting in a big run.

Dont forget the 1st half of the season, where you couldn't double team BOTH Miller and Oliver, so there was a lot more pass rush pressure up the middle, and success against the run.

  Removing Oliver from the center of the line when Miller is back means less success defending the middle of the line..it frees up an offensive lineman from the other team.

  The real disaster on the D line is the complete whiff in drafting a bunch of 1st and 2nd round edge rushers that are anything but....

If he played 1 tech I'd agree with you, but his role in this defense isnt to take up space, its to penetrate.   Because he plays 3 tech I expect him to have more than 2.5 sacks.    Oliver is a decent defensive lineman, but I am not sure he is a top 15 player at his position, which is what he gets paid this coming year.

 

To take the conversation a bit further,  I am not sure the defensive tackle position is worth paying out a ton of money for.   

[Magox]

Ed Oliver is a good but not great player.  Buffalo has a lot of difficult decisions to make and honestly, if you could get a 2nd round draft choice for him they should make the trade.  We could use the draft capital and the money.   
 

I’d rather roll with Settles, Phillips, DaQuan and some mid round pick to anchor the middle.

[KOKBILLS]

On 2/1/2023 at 8:11 PM, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Let me put it this way...the last 3 playoff losses, with Oliver at DT, we have given up 107 points and 1403 yards.  

 

 

Well...When you put it that way...

[GreggTX]

He's a whisker above average. He's not even close to what you'd expect from the 9th pick. Stop making excuses for him. He's been playing at the same medioce level since we drafted him. Last summer everybody was talking like he was giong to be an all pro this year because he was dominating our backup OL. Heck, our starters are backup caliber except Dawkins. Enough. Try to trade him and unload his salary so we can get our money's worth. Maybe even a low draft pick.

 

[BuffaloRebound]

https://buffalonews.com/sports/bills/analysis-the-buffalo-bills-have-an-ed-oliver-problem-with-no-easy-solutions/article_9adf0716-a4b6-11ed-9067-bbf527263e1a.html

 

Lots of points this thread has already touched on.  

[JaCrispy]

If the Bills are not going to extend him, they need to move him to get value….

 

Becsuse if they end up doing neither, it’s just terrible roster management imo…

 

 

Edited February 5, 2023 by JaCrispy

[BuffaloRebound]

Can anybody more knowledgeable than me care to explain why he has dominant games like Detroit then you don’t hear his name for another 2 months.  Is it his motor?  Scheme? Can’t beat decent or certain types of O-Linemen? 

[newcam2012]

On 1/27/2023 at 10:14 AM, IndyMark said:

I think you misunderstood.  We would put another player in the 3DT slot, not just remove Ed and leave it blank.

 

The preference would be someone a bit larger and sturdier whom can perform in less than ideal conditions.

 

I do not think anyone said remove Oliver and leave blank?  'Cuz there is no way you are saying Ed is irreplaceable, are you?

 

Spoiler alert = he is quite replaceable.

I'd try to trade Oliver and get a draft pick. Hopefully a 2nd but more likely a 3rd or 4th. No way should the Bills pay him big money.

 

Oliver is nothing special and far too light in the bootie. He shows a flash here and there but not even close to what you want in a top 10 pick. He's serviceable but very replaceable. Not an anchor on the DL for sure. Another miss by the Bills drafting department. In fairness to them many had Oliver very highly ranked. If memory serves me right Oliver dropped to 9 and many thought he was a steal for the Bills. 

 

An after thought is the Bills drafting department. All departments can't get all their picks right. It's the nature of the business. However, the Bills dept seems to be below average in their top half of their drafts. You just can't afford to do that if you want to be a top tier team. The importance of "grand slam" hit with Allen cannot be underestimated. It sort of gives the Bills a pass.

 

Seems like the Bills are more effective in latter round picks. Wondering if the Bills might need to revamp their drafting process?  Any thoughts?

 

 

[whorlnut]

27 minutes ago, BuffaloRebound said:

Can anybody more knowledgeable than me care to explain why he has dominant games like Detroit then you don’t hear his name for another 2 months.  Is it his motor?  Scheme? Can’t beat decent or certain types of O-Linemen? 

He was going up against backup guards against the lions. Ed always eats when he goes against weak lines or backups. He disappears against good interior olines. I like the guy, but he hasn’t lived up to the number 9 pick. 

[BuffaloRebound]

I could see Houston giving up a 3rd for Oliver.  They have a lot of picks, a lot of cap room, will have to over-pay for free agents, and Oliver is a Houston guy.

[dorquemada]

23 hours ago, BuffaloRebound said:

Can anybody more knowledgeable than me care to explain why he has dominant games like Detroit then you don’t hear his name for another 2 months.  Is it his motor?  Scheme? Can’t beat decent or certain types of O-Linemen? 

 

cause he gassed, come on man

[streetkings01]

For a top 10 pick he’s giving us more like late 2nd/early 3rd returns. A top 10 pick should be elite at his position or at least right on the cusp of being elite. Oliver has been a good NFL Player, but definitely not living up to his draft status.

[BuffaloRebound]

2 minutes ago, streetkings01 said:

For a top 10 pick he’s giving us more like late 2nd/early 3rd returns. A top 10 pick should be elite at his position or at least right on the cusp of being elite. Oliver has been a good NFL Player, but definitely not living up to his draft status.

Kind of depressing when you look at the 3 DT’s who got drafted right after him.  

[streetkings01]

2 minutes ago, BuffaloRebound said:

Kind of depressing when you look at the 3 DT’s who got drafted right after him.  

In hindsight the pick didn’t make sense due to Oliver being in a rotation. You don’t spend a top 10 pick on a player that you’re looking to split reps with. Top 10 picks are reserved for full time players. This current Bills regime should never spend 1st round picks on DL, RB, or CB since they love to rotate those positions.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

Whether or not Oliver is gold or fool's gold is a secondary concern.  The OP should be titling corporate PowerPoint presentations for a living. 😁👍💯