Your Offseason Upgrades to the OLine

[Simon]

42 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

I'd sign up for this at a minimum.

 

Yeah, it's definitely just a start and not the final product. But at least it buys them enough wiggle room they'll have that #2 pick to use on another outside receiver if there's one they like there. I'd go right back to the OL well with that 3rd pick too; either more competition at OT or a good young center to step into a hole they're going to have there soon.

 

[GolfandBills]

Move Bates back to LG where he had his best days here.  Sign a good RG in free agency and draft a RT in round 1 or 2 to compete with Brown.  

Edited January 28, 2023 by GolfandBills

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

5 minutes ago, Simon said:

 

Yeah, it's definitely just a start and not the final product. But at least it buys them enough wiggle room they'll have that #2 pick to use on another outside receiver if there's one they like there. I'd go right back to the OL well with that 3rd pick too; either more competition at OT or a good young center to step into a hole they're going to have there soon.

 

Coulda had Creed. Bummer 

[Simon]

7 hours ago, Bongo said:

Simon, what do you think is keeping Brown from playing tackle better? Do you think it’s mental or his back issues? He is so frustrating. We typically talk short arms or slow feet for moving tackles inside but he had the highest RAS ever coming out. Heck, he should be an all pro left tackle yet alone right tackle given his RAS score.

 

I think he just doesn't have the feet to match up athletically with the level of player that he's lined up across from. I'm sure he specifically trained and ran that combine drill 5000 times before he did it for the stopwatches, but repeatedly practicing the same rote series of maneuvers is a far cry from having to be able to move your feet and adjust on the fly when you have no idea what's coming from your opponent. He just can't keep up with those faster edge players when he's executing full speed in real time.

 

7 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

Correct me if I'm mistaken, but isn't one of the criticisms of Brown, that he doesn't get enough knee bend?

So moving him to guard, which would require more knee bend, would seem like a disaster.

 

That boy is massive and country strong; I don't think leverage is as much an issue for him as he might be for other players. When he gets his hands on people, they're in trouble, so even if he gets jacked up occasionally by a lower man he has enough power that he should still be able to control him. I'd be more worried about hiding his feet than his knees.

[newcam2012]

3 hours ago, nosejob said:

He's cluless adios. I sure as hell ain't paying him 15 plus....nope hard pass. I d rather draft his replacement.

It's likely he gets paid by the Bills. Certainly, based on his previous years play he doesn't deserve it. This year he was well above average. His best season by far. One of the bright spots on the D. If we get that kind of guy or better he's probably worth it. I just don't like that he isn't a big play guy. By that I mean getting huge sacks and timely INTs. He's solid, not flashy, and a lot of what he does goes unnoticed. I'm on the fence with him but leaning towards signing him. 

[Beck Water]

3 hours ago, Simon said:

I think he just doesn't have the feet to match up athletically with the level of player that he's lined up across from. I'm sure he specifically trained and ran that combine drill 5000 times before he did it for the stopwatches, but repeatedly practicing the same rote series of maneuvers is a far cry from having to be able to move your feet and adjust on the fly when you have no idea what's coming from your opponent. He just can't keep up with those faster edge players when he's executing full speed in real time.

 

Sadly, that's kind of what I see.  When he knows what to expect, he seems to do OK.  When an edge rusher is "like a freight train coming your way" then a "no leaf clover" would be about as much protection to Josh.

 

3 hours ago, Simon said:

That boy is massive and country strong; I don't think leverage is as much an issue for him as he might be for other players. When he gets his hands on people, they're in trouble, so even if he gets jacked up occasionally by a lower man he has enough power that he should still be able to control him. I'd be more worried about hiding his feet than his knees.

 

I Guess.  I'm just sick and tired of "making do" on our line.   I suppose I have a better chance of winning the lottery than seeing Beane really soak in and do a Kansas City or Bengals type rebuild.

[Solomon Grundy]

17 hours ago, 947 said:

Nobody is trading away an All-Pro Guard

Ummm.... Wyatt Teller😎

[Solomon Grundy]

I think it's time to start questioning Beane's scouting department. What are they seeing while evaluating these players? From Oliver to Basham to Epenesa, they really dropped the ball considering the other players available where they were slotted

[Thurman#1]

21 hours ago, Billz4ever said:

Sounds great.  Who's the team trading us an All-Pro guard for Ed?

 

 

The bigger question is which team is trading Ed? Because the chances of us doing it are probably non-zero but genuinely miniscule.

 

Ed was not good against the Bengals. But he was really good for most of the season. Most likely NOT an accident that Ed had a bad game with DaQuan out. DaQuan is an absolute keystone out there. Makes everyone around him better.

 

 

3 hours ago, Solomon Grundy said:

Ummm.... Wyatt Teller😎

 

 

Heh. I hear you, but I think if he'd been all pro before the trade things might have been different.

Edited January 28, 2023 by Thurman#1

[Thurman#1]

As far as the OP's question, I'd like to see them draft an interior OL in the first or second. Maybe a good center and have him play guard till Morse retires. Then hopefully another OL a bit later.

 

It depends to me on the injury situation with Brown. If injuries caused his regression, there's less urgency. If they think his injuries aren't enough to account for his problems, they need to commit some serious resources there.

[Warriorspikes51]

Did Dion Dawkins play RT in college?

 

LT- 1st Round Pick / Trade

LG- Bates
C- 2nd or 3rd Round Pick / Morse
RG- Risner / Spencer Brown

RT - Dawkins 

[gonzo1105]

On 1/28/2023 at 5:47 AM, Solomon Grundy said:

I think it's time to start questioning Beane's scouting department. What are they seeing while evaluating these players? From Oliver to Basham to Epenesa, they really dropped the ball considering the other players available where they were slotted

 

I think the problem with their scouting staff is they rely too much on college tape and not enough on attributes that can be coached up to take a player to another level. Oliver, Basham, Epenesa dominated college football but were all maxed out physically and we're more of the ready right now to plug in type of players. That can lead to having a solid roster but not a ton of guys who can boom for you. 

 

I think Beane plays it safe too much in his picks to be honest. 

[billsfan89]

Ideally Dalton Risner slots in at RG and the team drafts a RT in round 1. Then the team in round 3 and 4 drafts a center and more Oline depth/competition (and an heir apparent for Mitch).

 

That would leave you with an Oline of 

 

Dawkins-Bates-Mitch-Risner-1st round pick

 

Then you have Spencer Brown, two rookies and a vet guard on the bench.

 

[MrEpsYtown]

One of the things that is hard to anticipate is cap casualties.

 

One guy who I have always liked and think will be a casualty is Tampa's Shaq Mason. He is owed 9.6 million and there is zero dead money on his deal if cut. Stick him in at RG and move Bates to LG and you have a much better situation. I like the idea of an experienced guy who can still play and think playing next to Mason would do wonders for Spencer Brown. 

 

The other is Joel Bitonio. He is 32 and there are some murmurs that the Browns could cut him as they have a ton of money tied up in their offensive line. I think he might have to come via trade as it saves the Browns significant cap, but Bitonio still plays at a very high level. 

 

Highly unlikely, but I could see a scenario in which the Falcons are willing to trade Chris Lindstrom. He will be playing on a 13 million 5th year option and it is unclear if they will signing him long term and they have Kaleb McGary coming up as a free agent. Long term are they willing to pay both? Time will tell. He is the most perfect fit for our RG spot right now.  

[SoTier]

When I and a few others advocated drafting interior OL in the first round last off-season, we were dismissed as fools and lectured ad nauseum about how guards and centers didn't have enough "value" to be drafted in the first round.   That's despite the fact that numerous teams have found All Pro guards and centers late in the first round.  My guess is that many of those who didn't think interior OLers were worth even a late first round draft pick have changed their views.  

 

I wanted the Bills to draft interior OL in the first round last year because there were several prospects.   I'm not up on any of the draft prospects this season yet, so I'm not going to necessarily say that the Bills should take a center or guard in the first round, but I certainly think that the Bills should be able to find a good prospect in the first three rounds -- and I'd like to see them draft 2 or 3 OLers in 2022 plus bring in several UDFA rookie prospects.

 

Investment in the OL is the surest way for the Bills to climb back into serious contention for a Super Bowl.