You're Beane. Give me your offseason moves as best you can at this point.

[JMM]

1. Move on from Frazier 

 

2. Physicality,  whatever that means in order to achieve this, but both lines need PHYSICALITY!

 

3. WR, OL and LB in that order.

[DCbillsfan]

22 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Bengals changed their OL, but especially early in the season, it wasn't so clear that they fixed it.  1st 4 games of the season, Mixon was getting less than 3 ypc (2 and 2.5 in a couple of those games).  And Burrow was getting pressured and sacked - 7x game one, 6x game 2.

 

The thing is, they evolved their offense pretty promptly to work better with the line they had - different run plays, getting the ball out faster.

 

Burrows rocks 10.2 Y/Completion.  That's 5.6 air yards per completion, and 5.2 YAC per completion.

 

I'm right with you that I want Beane to make substantial investment in offensive line and in WR this off-season, but IMHO we have to fundamentally change either our offensive philosophy, or our offensive execution, or both, to take best advantage.

It took awhile for the Bengals oline to gel this year but they brought in Collins, Cappa, and Karras as free agents.  Drafted Volson in the 4th.  Grabbed another OL from Houston on waivers.  My point is that it's doable to fix the Oline in one off-season and the Bengals and Chiefs have recently done it.  I agree, Bills need to change their offensive approach somewhat.

[Augie]

10 hours ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

I'd quit in shame 

 

Is it shame, or is it a fear of pitchforks and torches? 

[LyndonvilleBill]

24 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

I like most of this but I think it's critical to move on from Edmunds, for sure.

 

He's going to get huge money $15 million or more a year? and that is just not in the cards.

 

He's not CLOSE to adding that sort of value to the team.  Need the cash...get rid of him.

 

 

I actually agree with this, and I like Edmunds.  I just think for the cost, I could probably pay 2 REALLY good UFA guards for the same money. Then draft his replacement.  Someone that's a little more aggressive. Or tag and trade for a draft pick.

Edited January 25, 2023 by LyndonvilleBill

[Adam727]

I would make 2023 a mini-rebuild year and fix some of our current/future cap problems.  I think Beane went all-in in 2021/2022 and it didn't work out, but doubling down on that to fill all the holes on this team will IMO bite the team in future years and shorten our SB window.  I'd pay for it now.  

 

I would offer Edmunds a 5 year 60 million contract that is backloaded to where the Bills have an out at 4 year 44 mil.  When he probably says no I let him walk in FA.  Let Poyer & Singletary walk.  Trade Oliver.  Cut Hines/McKenzie/Neal for cap savings.  

 

Ideally I'd want most of these players back but I'd rather have $15-20mil in cap space to sign someone else than pay Edmunds, same with whatever Oliver is going to command.  I really wanted to see Hyde/Poyer play another year together, but if 2023 does become a mini-rebuild it probably doesn't make sense to re-sign Poyer unless the team thinks he has at least 3 good years left in him, so I'd let him walk in FA.  

 

Re-sign Phillips/Lawson/Jackson/Klein to reasonable contracts and whichever Olineman we're about to lose that the team likes most between Boettger, Van Roten, & Quessenberry

 

Try to sign Mitch Trubisky as back-up QB if he'll sign cheap and try to find a cheap rental at MLB.

 

Draft OL, OL, Safety, WR in whatever order.  Possibly LB if one falls in the right spot.

 

Accept our defense will be mediocre next year, start fixing our O-line, and accumulate the cap space and resources to sign a true WR #1B opposite Diggs and/or O-line as needed in 2024.  Pay close attention to the # of FAs being signed because Edmunds & Poyer (especially Edmunds) will probably land us some high comp picks in 2024.

 

 

 

 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

10 hours ago, HOUSE said:

Send a #2 & #4  to the Giants for soon to be superstar WR Isaiah Hodgins, he is only 24

6'3, 210 lbs. Great Hands, 5 TDs since Dec 4th. Very low cap hit.

I doubt the Giants would trade him though, nobody would be that stupid....

 

 

.

How about just a fourth for his gloves, to give to Gabe Davis- who would be superior in every way if he caught the ball like Hodgens. 

[entropyrules]

Billie Buffalo for Jax with or withiut the speedo

[KingBoots8]

Ok. Here’s the plan:

 

1. We find a replacement for Defensive coordinator. We play too soft with too much on the line, and we have over-invested on this side of the ball to not attack the qb.  Steve Wilks makes sense here, as well as Flores (who doesn’t commit fully to a 3-4 or 4-3 scheme). Fangio runs a very different defense, so he may not be the best answer.

 

2. Bring Dorsey back, but put him on a leash. I know this may be unpopular but we did some great things this year, his first as the OC. Daboll needed a year to get acclimated to our players and got things moving pretty well in year two. I’d give him an opportunity to do his thing, but to assist him (or replace him if needed…)

 

3. Promote Joe Brady to Offensive Specialist, or bring in Frank Reich. These are experienced OC’s/Coaches who can likely help Dorsey take advantage of our players. Giving Joe a bigger role may keep him around, as well as Reich who ran a great offense in Indy even after losing Luck. They can certainly find roles on this team, and be ready to step in should Dorsey get hired elsewhere or be shown the door.

 

4. Prioritizing the O-Line is the mission for the off-season. Draft needs to be a slam dunk for this to happen. Every position is on the table here (with Guard and Center being the biggest needs) So round one we should be looking at BPA at one of those positions. We should likely be drafting at minimum 2 players in the first 4 rounds for the OL.

 

5. We need another playmaker at WR. Like the Eagles and Bengals, they currently find themselves with many great players T receiver. It will be crucial to add to our weapons. Diggs plays outside and the slot on rotation, with Davis and our shiny new WR2 outside. Shakir should be given the opportunity at WR4, with McKenzie back for his last year of his contract at 5/gadget. Beasley still has some wheels and appears to have made amends with the staff after the fallout, so we bring him back as well to fill in the 4/5 role. WR is the focus for round 2 of the draft, provided someone generational isn’t sitting there at 27 - which I don’t know that I see with this draft class. 
 

6. We make some difficult decisions at some long-held positions. Good rotational D-linemen are fine, but we have a few too many.  I’d like to keep Oliver if possible but am not opposed to getting picks if the price is right. Epenesa can go, and Basham is whatever. We likely can retain Jordan Phillips and Shaq Lawson for cheap, so I offer them contracts. Poyer is too rich for our blood and is most likely going to be paid out of our range. Edmunds is also going to be a challenge, and one I’m not sure I am sold on long-term. He had a much better year but was softer than baby poo in the playoffs. Was that scheme or regression?

 

7. Day 3 Draft Picks and FA Strategy. Safety is going to need some attention in later rounds (thinking 5th) and anything later is just depth. I still say we go BPA when we can, but if we have to pass on a great guy who would be 3rd on the depth chart vs a good Safety who might see some significant time, you need to consider your options. We need quality FA’s that won’t break the bank, and that means we either kick the can a little bit or make sure we have easy outs in 2024 or 2025.

 

8. Restructure when we can, but only when needed. Plenty of options to work with here, so no plan until needed. Plenty of guys who would be willing to make some moves for us.

 

[skibum]

Best we can hope for is a that a couple of quality vet FAs sign on (ala Da'Quan Jones), they draft well, and that a few young guys mature into better players.

 

Good news is that they are a proven winner with a strong team culture and a superstar QB under contract. That will at least give them a puncher's chance for said quality FAs. 

 

Other good news is that some of the biggest holes to fill are among the most affordable (G, RB, S, WR2/3). One of Beane's most baller of strategies was to lock up the marquis positions longer-term (QB, WR1, CB1, Edge, LT). 

Edited January 26, 2023 by skibum

[RocCityRoller]

I blow it up now. Don't waste JAs time. The earlier the better. Do it now.

 

Strategically blow it up. Rip the band aid off. Go all in on the offense.

I admit I can't draft or identify FA DL to save my life.

An offensive juggernaut is what I have to build.

if McDermott and Frazier are untouchable, then they have to coach up the picks I made in the past.

 

I dump every defensive contract I can and free up as much room as possible.

My HC and DC are the most senior coaches on the team. They have to make it work or move on.

 

FA I get one stud OL and a proven and productive WR (Brandin Cooks or Ju Ju type)

 

In rounds 1 and 2 I get the best OL/ WR combo I can find

Rounds 3-5 I get a S/LB/OL/S (since Edmunds, Poyer and Oliver are gone)

S are garbage after round 4 and in UFA. So I would go S/S in 3 and 4.

 

UFA All about RB/DT/CB

try to find gold. Those are the 3 best positions found in UFA over the past 10 years

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

15 hours ago, Shanahan's Horseshoe said:

Find someone else to evaluate Rb’s, DL and OL.

 

Sounds like we might as well as bring in a new GM. 

[philholbroo]

trade up for quentin johnston in the draft is a good start.

[Beck Water]

14 hours ago, DCbillsfan said:

It took awhile for the Bengals oline to gel this year but they brought in Collins, Cappa, and Karras as free agents.  Drafted Volson in the 4th.  Grabbed another OL from Houston on waivers.  My point is that it's doable to fix the Oline in one off-season and the Bengals and Chiefs have recently done it.  I agree, Bills need to change their offensive approach somewhat.

 

You make some interesting points.  My initial impression was that what the Bengals did was similar to what the Bills did in 2019 when they signed Morse, Feliciano, Spain, Long and Waddle as well as drafting Cody Ford, except of course that Ford and Waddle didn't work out, then once Spain got paid he got too "cool for school" from the coach and once Feliciano got paid he decided to get skinny. 

 

But looking at Overthecap and such, I think overall Karras Collins and Kappa are a higher tier of FA.

 

Certainly the Bills have invested more than a 4th round pick in OL. Cody Ford in the 2nd; Spencer Brown in the 3rd.  The problem is one can't play and the other isn't looking good.

 

I think the real problem for the Bills might be talent evaluation on OL and/or scheme and coaching.  I know with NE, "Coach Scar" seemed able to turn a group of relative nobodies into a solid OL.  Of course, part of that was Brady's ability to read the defense and to get the ball out quickly in rhythm to the correct guy, often 4-5 yd passes that turned into 10.  Kind of like....Burrows 🤐

 

8 hours ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

 

Sounds like we might as well as bring in a new GM. 

 

There's a lot more to being a good GM than being a good evaluator of NFL talent.  That's why there's a whole staff.

It's possible that losing a couple of the FO guys we lost was big for us.

 

It does seem as though there are a couple of position groups (OL, RB) where we are just having trouble.

Edited January 26, 2023 by Beck Water

[Buckets]

Submit my resignation

 

[Shanahan's Horseshoe]

8 hours ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

 

Sounds like we might as well as bring in a new GM. 

I’m on the fence.  I think Beane has done some really good things here and he’s a great guy.  But I think the end of this season had more to do with his poor drafting than any coach or player. The thought of giving him another draft after 4 straight subpar draft classes is concerning. 

[harmonkillebrew]

14 hours ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

I actually agree with this, and I like Edmunds.  I just think for the cost, I could probably pay 2 REALLY good UFA guards for the same money. Then draft his replacement.  Someone that's a little more aggressive. Or tag and trade for a draft pick.

Thing with Edmunds is given how young he is, we could probably spread out his cap hit over 6-7 years and not be in such a bad place.  It's hard to see our D recovering from the loss of him and Power

[dave mcbride]

13 hours ago, KingBoots8 said:

Ok. Here’s the plan:

 

1. We find a replacement for Defensive coordinator. We play too soft with too much on the line, and we have over-invested on this side of the ball to not attack the qb.  Steve Wilks makes sense here, as well as Flores (who doesn’t commit fully to a 3-4 or 4-3 scheme). Fangio runs a very different defense, so he may not be the best answer.

 

2. Bring Dorsey back, but put him on a leash. I know this may be unpopular but we did some great things this year, his first as the OC. Daboll needed a year to get acclimated to our players and got things moving pretty well in year two. I’d give him an opportunity to do his thing, but to assist him (or replace him if needed…)

 

3. Promote Joe Brady to Offensive Specialist, or bring in Frank Reich. These are experienced OC’s/Coaches who can likely help Dorsey take advantage of our players. Giving Joe a bigger role may keep him around, as well as Reich who ran a great offense in Indy even after losing Luck. They can certainly find roles on this team, and be ready to step in should Dorsey get hired elsewhere or be shown the door.

 

4. Prioritizing the O-Line is the mission for the off-season. Draft needs to be a slam dunk for this to happen. Every position is on the table here (with Guard and Center being the biggest needs) So round one we should be looking at BPA at one of those positions. We should likely be drafting at minimum 2 players in the first 4 rounds for the OL.

 

5. We need another playmaker at WR. Like the Eagles and Bengals, they currently find themselves with many great players T receiver. It will be crucial to add to our weapons. Diggs plays outside and the slot on rotation, with Davis and our shiny new WR2 outside. Shakir should be given the opportunity at WR4, with McKenzie back for his last year of his contract at 5/gadget. Beasley still has some wheels and appears to have made amends with the staff after the fallout, so we bring him back as well to fill in the 4/5 role. WR is the focus for round 2 of the draft, provided someone generational isn’t sitting there at 27 - which I don’t know that I see with this draft class. 
 

6. We make some difficult decisions at some long-held positions. Good rotational D-linemen are fine, but we have a few too many.  I’d like to keep Oliver if possible but am not opposed to getting picks if the price is right. Epenesa can go, and Basham is whatever. We likely can retain Jordan Phillips and Shaq Lawson for cheap, so I offer them contracts. Poyer is too rich for our blood and is most likely going to be paid out of our range. Edmunds is also going to be a challenge, and one I’m not sure I am sold on long-term. He had a much better year but was softer than baby poo in the playoffs. Was that scheme or regression?

 

7. Day 3 Draft Picks and FA Strategy. Safety is going to need some attention in later rounds (thinking 5th) and anything later is just depth. I still say we go BPA when we can, but if we have to pass on a great guy who would be 3rd on the depth chart vs a good Safety who might see some significant time, you need to consider your options. We need quality FA’s that won’t break the bank, and that means we either kick the can a little bit or make sure we have easy outs in 2024 or 2025.

 

8. Restructure when we can, but only when needed. Plenty of options to work with here, so no plan until needed. Plenty of guys who would be willing to make some moves for us.

 

Good post, but Edmunds was great against Miami. He had four pass breakups. He also had 12 tackles vs Cincy.

[Bob Chandler's Hands]

Many posters don't seem to understand the Bills organizational structure. McDermott does not report to Beane. Both McD and Beane report directly to Terry Pegula. So all these calls for Beane to replace Frazier or Dorsey and so forth are just nonsense. The coaching staff is McDermott's call, not Beane's.

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

21 minutes ago, Shanahan's Horseshoe said:

I’m on the fence.  I think Beane has done some really good things here and he’s a great guy.  But I think the end of this season had more to do with his poor drafting than any coach or player. The thought of giving him another draft after 4 straight subpar draft classes is concerning. 

 

Bringing guys back like Klein, Brown, Beasley and to a lesser extend guys like Lawson and Phillips kind of really points out how badly he has missed in evaluations. The guys that were supposed to step up and replace the aforementioned group never did. 

[26TrapDraw]