Rapoport: Greg Roman fired

[C.Biscuit97]

Just now, dave mcbride said:

The year the Ravens went 14-2, they moved up and down the field vs. TN and lost only because of turnovers. They had 530 yards on offense in that game! It was a genuinely fluky loss. They were number one in the league in offense that year too. And Roman OC'd a team that got to three straight NFC championship games and one SB while in SF, where the team's record was 36-11-1. 

Agree with this 100% Dave. But I guess the question is, does he grow quarterbacks?  I think Lamar is the most talented qb he has had (CK is in the running but I think Lamar is a more accurate passer) but he has plateaued.  And it’s not all Roman but the Ravens, one of the best organizations in sports, for whatever reason, hate wrs. They never made a Diggs type move or drafted a no doubt stud guy.

13 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

and he was a 57% completion passer in that college 'pro style' offense.

At almost 9 ypa with very little nfl talent around him. He single handedly carried that team. Very similar to Allen.

[BuffaloBills1998]

I think this will bite the ravens in the ass. Roman had the perfect system for Jackson. You take him out of that system and he will be exposed big time. They better have a back up plan

Edited January 19, 2023 by BuffaloBills1998

[GunnerBill]

46 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

You quickly get into a "chicken and egg" conundrum here.   Other guys who came into the league tenuous as passers like Allen and Hurst, have evolved and improved.  Lamar appeared to take a step forward as a passer last season, improving his Y/G to 240 Y/G from 180 or 200. 

 

This season he took a step back. 

 

Is he gonna become Joe Burrow, absolutely not, but I think there's a serious question as to whether the system and OC were maximizing his passing abilities.

 

 

I kmow his numbers took a step back but that was supporting cast IMO. Andrews missed games, Bateman missed games, Hollywood was gone, the backs were banged up again. Not sure how great your numbers are going to be with Duvernay and Isaiah Likely.

 

[FireChans]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Agree with this 100% Dave. But I guess the question is, does he grow quarterbacks?  I think Lamar is the most talented qb he has had (CK is in the running but I think Lamar is a more accurate passer) but he has plateaued.  And it’s not all Roman but the Ravens, one of the best organizations in sports, for whatever reason, hate wrs. They never made a Diggs type move or drafted a no doubt stud guy.

He does the opposite. He gets bad QB's paid.

[dave mcbride]

Just now, C.Biscuit97 said:

Agree with this 100% Dave. But I guess the question is, does he grow quarterbacks?  I think Lamar is the most talented qb he has had (CK is in the running but I think Lamar is a more accurate passer) but he has plateaued.  And it’s not all Roman but the Ravens, one of the best organizations in sports, for whatever reason, hate wrs. They never made a Diggs type move or drafted a no doubt stud guy.

I dunno, CB; I'm less about long term development than winning a SB. And the 2019 Ravens as well as the 49ers every year between 2011 and 2013 were SB caliber teams without a doubt. To put it a different way, what Josh is doing at age 30 doesn't mean much to me if he brings us a SB victory this year.

 

I think @GunnerBill is absolutely right about the Bears, and I'd add another reason. 75-plus years is a long time, and that's been about how long the Bears have lacked anything approaching an elite passing game. If any team is cursed with regard to passing QBs, it is the Bears. They should accept that they can't change fate and instead go all out to be a Ravens-like running QB team with Roman calling the shots. 

[Beck Water]

30 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

TBD fans today: “pass”

TBD fans if Allen and the offense this weekend look like they did last weekend: fire Dorsey! Bring back Roman!!

 

Seriously?  Who on earth do you think would say that?

 

423 total yards.  56% 3rd down conversion.  9 yards per pass attempt, 4.1 yds per rush attempt.  The problems the offense had last weekend were all self-inflicted wounds.  How do you think Roman would somehow solve incompletions on catchable balls, or a strip sack on the 12 yd line run in for a TD?

 

 

 

 

[colin]

so,

 

i dunno if roman can change his spots enough to run what would be considered a good O for us (i'd give him a 25% of that) but i know i don't want him over dorsey (yeah yeah, might not have the choice!) because in his first OC year dorsey has us passing and running, which i think was our prior biggest flaw.

 

i will say, i DON'T WANT roman and lamar to both end up on the jets.

[GunnerBill]

6 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Okay. My end goal would be trying to get a franchise QB. 

 

GRo runs the wrong offense for that (and I have a tremendous respect for him).

 

If I hire an OC, I want one who is gonna have our young QB chucking it.  I want him to trying to learn and run an NFL caliber offense. Not hiding behind a run scheme that will get its doors blown off in wild card weekend by a real franchise QB.

 

The Bears have the #1 pick. If they want to draft a Quarterback and give up on Fields I won't say a word against that. This is their chance. But if they are not you can't just keep losing. If they decide to stick with Fields they have to try and make Fields work. There are not enough franchise QBs to go around. There are what? 10-12 tier 1 and 2 guys? You can't have 2/3s of the league trying to lose. If they want to pull the plug on Fields I'd support them doing so. If not try and win some damn football games

 

[C.Biscuit97]

4 minutes ago, FireChans said:

He does the opposite. He gets bad QB's paid.

Well a ton of bad qbs get paid. Chase Daniel got paid for absolutely nothing. I think Lamar can do more as a passer. We’ll see.

[BuffaloBills1998]

3 minutes ago, colin said:

so,

 

i dunno if roman can change his spots enough to run what would be considered a good O for us (i'd give him a 25% of that) but i know i don't want him over dorsey (yeah yeah, might not have the choice!) because in his first OC year dorsey has us passing and running, which i think was our prior biggest flaw.

 

i will say, i DON'T WANT roman and lamar to both end up on the jets.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/01/19/ravens-reiterate-their-desire-to-do-a-long-term-deal-with-lamar-jackson/ 
 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/01/19/john-harbaugh-oc-job-will-be-highly-sought-after-lamar-jackson-will-have-input/ I don’t think you have to worry about that. Looks like he’s gonna stay in Baltimore 

[Beck Water]

Just now, dave mcbride said:

I dunno, CB; I'm less about long term development than winning a SB. And the 2019 Ravens as well as the 49ers every year between 2011 and 2013 were SB caliber teams without a doubt.

 

How do you figure that? 

 

I mean, Championship caliber is, as Championship caliber does.  The Ravens got pretty solidly Whumped in the playoffs in 2019.  I think the general perception of the 49ers in 2011-2013 was that they had an outstanding defense, and just not enough offense to match it.

[Jerome007]

46 minutes ago, aristocrat said:

Indy should hire him with whatever qb they're taking in the draft. With Taylor they'd be a good offense

Very bad idea...for the Bills.

 

Their OLine was so good last year it felt almost stupid when they passed! Taylor is very good, but that OLine was the star IMO. I don't get how it didn't work out for them this year. I was glad they missed the playoffs last year as they were made to beat the then run D deficient Bills.

 

As for being OC here again, only if Dorsey is hired somewhere else, and if he can let McD, Josh and others provide input for the pass game.

[H2o]

22 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

I'd imagine the Ravens will franchise tag Lamar and keep him for 1 season with a new OC, if he excels with the new OC then he gets a long term deal otherwise he's gone and they find a new QB that meets the new OC style of offense better. 

I'm not sold they don't move on from him this year. There is no time now they could greater maximize their return for him. I am thinking they wil FT him and then trade him to the highest bidder.

[FireChans]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

The Bears have the #1 pick. If they want to draft a Quarterback and give up on Fields I won't say a word against that. This is their chance. But if they are not you can't just keep losing. If they decide to stick with Fields they have to try and make Fields work. There are not enough franchise QBs to go around. There are what? 10-12 tier 1 and 2 guys? You can't have 2/3s of the league trying to lose. If they want to pull the plug on Fields I'd support them doing so. If not try and win some damn football games

 

and GRo will make him work in the short-term, not the long-term.

 

We won more games with Tuh than Josh their first two years starting.  And yet, making Tyrod "work" wasn't the answer to put the Bills in position to win a Super Bowl.

 

Do you think Josh would have developed as much as he has as a passer with GRo instead of Daboll?

[C.Biscuit97]

5 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

I dunno, CB; I'm less about long term development than winning a SB. And the 2019 Ravens as well as the 49ers every year between 2011 and 2013 were SB caliber teams without a doubt. To put it a different way, what Josh is doing at age 30 doesn't mean much to me if he brings us a SB victory this year.

 

I think @GunnerBill is absolutely right about the Bears, and I'd add another reason. 75-plus years is a long time, and that's been about how long the Bears have lacked anything approaching an elite passing game. If any team is cursed with regard to passing QBs, it is the Bears. They should accept that they can't change fate and instead go all out to be a Ravens-like running QB team with Roman calling the shots. 

Agree 100% he would do great with the Bears. And obviously, winning is the objective. But long term is that the best way to grow Fields (who has a similar skill set to Allen imo). 
 

I think they need to see Lamar in a different system before paying him. Could backfire but at least they will know before investing a ton of money. 

[LABILLBACKER]

I either want Dorsey to drastically improve year 2 and insist on surrounding  Josh with more offensive help (OL/WR)....or move on and go after Frank Riech.  This is insanity how long we've ignored and neglected this OL.

[RocCityRoller]

If Dorsey and Brady move on I would definitely interview him as OC. Mike Shula is still on the staff with no rumors for interviews.

 

Roman could help develop an actual run game to compliment Josh Allen. Keep Mike Shula as a passing game coordinator to flesh out Roman's run concepts, and keep the passing attack JA and Diggs/Davis/Knox are familiar with. The offense would probably look more like Philly or Cincy than 'Josh do it all'.

 

It might force Buffalo to make some actual investments in the OL and be more productive with the RBs. I'd love to see what he could do with Cook, Singletary, or a Singletary like back-fill, McKenzie and a QB like Allen.

 

Roman has often made chicken salad with chicken sh!t.

[FireChans]

3 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Agree 100% he would do great with the Bears. And obviously, winning is the objective. But long term is that the best way to grow Fields (who has a similar skill set to Allen imo). 
 

I think they need to see Lamar in a different system before paying him. Could backfire but at least they will know before investing a ton of money. 

The year is 2025.  Justin Fields has throw for 3300 yards 22 TD's and 12 INT's the last two year in Greg Roman's system.  Rushes for 700 yards and 6 TD's. The Bears win 10 games each year, making the playoffs once and losing in the Wild Card round. Fields wants top 5 QB money. Contract negotiations start breaking down (it's the system, his numbers aren't that impressive etc etc.)

 

TBD makes the topic.  "Should the Bears pay Fields?"

 

And around and around we go on the Greg Roman carousel.

[appoo]

Would love to see Lamar in a vertical/spread system

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, FireChans said:

and GRo will make him work in the short-term, not the long-term.

 

We won more games with Tuh than Josh their first two years starting.  And yet, making Tyrod "work" wasn't the answer to put the Bills in position to win a Super Bowl.

 

Do you think Josh would have developed as much as he has as a passer with GRo instead of Daboll?

 

No. But I believe that Allen is a bit of a unicorn. I don't think you fall into the trap of trying to make every young drafted QB who struggles early Josh Allen. I'd hire GRo. I'd say let's do this for 2 years. If it still doesn't work I am probably firing my HC, OC and drafting a new QB. 

 

Of course if they really like one of the QBs this year they should do that and keep Getsy or hire some other OC.

7 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Agree 100% he would do great with the Bears. And obviously, winning is the objective. But long term is that the best way to grow Fields (who has a similar skill set to Allen imo). 
 

I think they need to see Lamar in a different system before paying him. Could backfire but at least they will know before investing a ton of money. 

 

Hoping each big athletic QB becomes Allen isn't a road to success IMO.